Aluminium Welding on TV

Submitted: Saturday, Feb 22, 2014 at 17:50
ThreadID: 106367 Views:2947 Replies:4 FollowUps:17
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This may be of interest to some..........

5.00pm (Qld) 7Mate,
Motor Sport, Xtreme 4X4. Aluminium Welding.

"Join us for an in-depth explanation of alloy welding, including prep work and technique. We also describe how to add a spool gun and how economical it is to convert your garage welder."

Sorry for the late advice......just now spotted it.

Cheers
Allan

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Reply By: Allan B (Member, SunCoast) - Saturday, Feb 22, 2014 at 18:23

Saturday, Feb 22, 2014 at 18:23
Oh hell, sorry guys. I have not watched that show before.

I couldn't stand more than a few minutes of that loud-mouthed Yank shouting at me.
And I doubt I would have learned much anyway.
You live and learn!

Cheers
Allan

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Reply By: Hoyks - Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 11:54

Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 11:54
Yeah, his voice is a bit hard to take.

I'd hardly call it in depth too. He glossed over a lot of stuff that I would consider important and tried to compress a month long welding course into 10 minutes. His welding leaves a bit to be desired too.

Thank god for Australian modification laws (as much of a pain in the bum they are) or we could have more clowns like him here doing wild home made mods for road vehicles.
AnswerID: 527054

Reply By: The Bantam - Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 12:45

Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 12:45
For most mig welders adding a spool gun is as easy as plugging the thing in.

The preparation of the material and the skills required present only a small obsticle.

The hard part is the cost of renting that second bottle and paying for the gas that only works for aluminium.

I have a welder that would take a spool gun, I have additional liners and drive gear that would allow me to run aluminium in my existing mig torch, and it would cost me very little to add a TIG torch to my existing welder.

But it would cost me arround $250 to get the gas.

You realy have to be doing a fair bit of aluminium welding to justify the cost.

If I need aluminium welded, I take it to someone who does enough to justify keeping the gas and who does enough to maintain the skills.


cheers
AnswerID: 527057

Follow Up By: Member - Bruce C (NSW) - Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 13:27

Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 13:27
I totally agree with you Bantam, I ditched the gas supplies a few years back as they were costing too much. Gone back to stick welding as it is pay as you go. No use, no cost.

I see on ebay they are selling gas bottles whereby you get one and pay for it to be filled and refilled whenever you want or need. I think it is an exchange service or something, but it still costs as there is a setup cost and ongoing use costs.

That bottle rental is an impost, as you say cheaper to pay someone else to do it.

Cheers Bruce.

At home and at ease on a track that I know not and
restless and lost on a track that I know. HL.

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Follow Up By: garrycol - Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 15:01

Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 15:01
I have a D size gas bottle from these guys Speed Gas

$90 to swap and go - is a very economical way to mig weld.

Garry
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Follow Up By: garrycol - Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 15:07

Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 15:07
Gasweld is a dealer.
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Follow Up By: The Bantam - Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 15:33

Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 15:33
The BOC / Air Liquide duopolly is not doing any of us any favours.

The rental cost of bottles is just rediculous.

The real retail cost of the bottles is about 2 years rent...in the vacinity of $300 for an E size.

That is obsceene particularly when many of the bottles in circulation ( at least with BOC) where first filled in the 70's.
If you have a steel bottle, especially argoshield , look for the manufacture date stamp.

What we ARE paying for is both of the gass companies laxity in tracking bottles for decades and the resultant wholesale theft of bottles.

There is a company doing outright sale and pay as you go refills on the inert welding gasses.
They are working their way north.....last time I heard the nearest depot to me was lismore or coffs..

I know a couple of people, who are prepared to drive that far from Brisbane to exchange their bottles.

Believe me I have considered it....If I baught 2 E size argoshields from them, I'd be ahead in 4 years....I'd be ahead in 2 years if I baught 1 bottle, but I could find myself run out.

I'd just have to go to NSW for a picnic once or twice a year.....I can suffer that.

There are disposable shielding gass bottles that can be baught..but the price does not work out well.

Cheers
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Follow Up By: Member - Bruce C (NSW) - Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 17:10

Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 17:10
It is a case of "whatever the traffic will bear" in regard to gas and bottle rental pricing. Given that there is little safety risk with these inert gasses there is no reason why a bulk storage/sales setup, similar to LPG, could not be setup in most communities.

Thinking about it, there is an opening for some enterprising organisation to make a business I would assume. The only issue is the higher pressure requirements for filling bottle with these inert gasses.

You used to be able to get acetylene generators once whereby the acetylene was made as you used it. Simple enough process if not a little dangerous in the wrong hands.

Those disposable bottle which can be "bought" sound like a good idea.

Bantam here is the info for a Brisbane supplier for Speed Gas

C.V. Jensen & Co Pty Ltd (Mobile Service)
1039 Rosevale Road
ROSEVALE QLD 4340
just in case you are interested.

Also here is the link to local suppliers
nearest local suppliers

Cheers, Bruce.

At home and at ease on a track that I know not and
restless and lost on a track that I know. HL.

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Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 19:05

Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 19:05
Bantam,
"and it would cost me very little to add a TIG torch to my existing welder"
What sort of welder do you have and what type of unit would you be adding?

Cheers
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Follow Up By: The Bantam - Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 19:36

Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 19:36
I have a multi mode welder..it is a MIG, but it will also run as a stick welder or a TIG welder.

When I baught mine it came with the MIG handpiece and a set of stick welding leads.....if you buy one now it comes with the TIG torch too.

It was a very big step forward from the transarc ezy welder let me tell you.

cheers
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Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 20:36

Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 20:36
Does it have high frequency for aluminium?
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Follow Up By: The Bantam - Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 23:27

Sunday, Feb 23, 2014 at 23:27
I can not be sure that it has high frequency...probably not.

Yes I know you are suposed to have high frequency for welding aluminium.....but it can be done without.

Further reason why its just not worth bothering setting up for aluminium umless you intend to do a lot of it.

cheers
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FollowupID: 809494

Follow Up By: awill4x4 - Monday, Feb 24, 2014 at 22:21

Monday, Feb 24, 2014 at 22:21
Bantam, your multi mode Mig welder isn't suitable for for Tig welding Aluminium as in Tig mode it is DC only and you need AC for Tig welding Aluminium.
It will be ok for steel and stainless Tig welding though.
One of the previous posts of a $90 change over for a D size bottle is outrageous.
Admittedly we use a fair bit of Argon, in my case I go through a G size bottle every 15 to 18 days but we pay around $115 for a 10.2 cubic metre G size bottle and pay the rental on the bottles.
Regards Andrew.
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FollowupID: 809547

Follow Up By: garrycol - Monday, Feb 24, 2014 at 22:31

Monday, Feb 24, 2014 at 22:31
What is outrageous is the rental costs of bottles - for the average home user it is not the cost of the gas but the rental cost that breaks the bank. At least with the Speed Gas bottles, you own them so no rent. I suspect the average home user, if they had a G size bottle would be paying a lot more than $115 through BOC for a refill.
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FollowupID: 809549

Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 24, 2014 at 22:43

Monday, Feb 24, 2014 at 22:43
Rent on a "G" size is $218 per year....$4 a week. Not that bad really is it? Charge out a couple of jobs and its paid for.
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FollowupID: 809550

Follow Up By: HuskyInAuz - Thursday, Feb 27, 2014 at 12:42

Thursday, Feb 27, 2014 at 12:42
Against my religion to pay 'rent' on gas welding bottles, found and bought two 'E' bottles for Argon and one for CO2 from Speed Gas three years ago. Have to go outside my area to refill but mentally satisfying against another gouging. So far Speed Gas has been very good.
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FollowupID: 809736

Follow Up By: garrycol - Thursday, Feb 27, 2014 at 12:59

Thursday, Feb 27, 2014 at 12:59
Hairy - a commercial operation is completely different to home use - for the average person at home $218 a year rent is a rip off.
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FollowupID: 809739

Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Thursday, Feb 27, 2014 at 20:19

Thursday, Feb 27, 2014 at 20:19
Not sure what you mean? Mine is for home use.........Im doing a job at the moment for a historical mob in town and they offered to pay for any gear. My bottle rent bill has just come in so Ill get them to pay that and that means my rent is paid.
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FollowupID: 809765

Follow Up By: The Bantam - Saturday, Mar 01, 2014 at 10:04

Saturday, Mar 01, 2014 at 10:04
When a years container rental is more than the cost of two fills of gas there is a very real problem.

There are a lot of people like my self that have gas on hand, because it is there when it is needed are paying way more for ther rental than they do for their gas.

It is just plain and simple that the gas duopoply do not want to deal with low volume users.

For a lot of people this means that any form of gas welding is beyond their reach.

The cost of cylinders and the rental of them is grossly and intentionally inflated and does not represent the cost of providing them.

I remember when Liquid Air, as they where calling themselves first came to the market they would happily sell you a cylinder....they very rapidly figured out there was more money to be made by engaging in a restrictive trade practice using their overwhelming market power and not allowoing people to own their cylinders and charging a price well over the odds for rental.

cheers
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FollowupID: 809844

Follow Up By: garrycol - Saturday, Mar 01, 2014 at 11:38

Saturday, Mar 01, 2014 at 11:38
Hairy - you did say " Charge out a couple of jobs and its paid for." - that implies commercial not domestic. When rental is many times the cost of the gas then it is a rip-off.
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FollowupID: 809851

Reply By: Peter_n_Margaret - Monday, Feb 24, 2014 at 18:50

Monday, Feb 24, 2014 at 18:50
The gas is expensive, but I did some of the aluminium welding on the OKA using a Readywelder 2 on 24V DC (2 batteries) with excellent results.

When I take the tinny north, I take gas and aluminium wire for it, otherwise just cored steel wire.

Cheers,
Peter
OKA196 Motorhome.
AnswerID: 527152

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