Roadside Assistance - Simpson Desert

Just as I was reading your reply, I found the same thing. Don't know how I missed it.

There is a "Reimbursement" which will hopefully help me with questions to RACQ when they call me back.

Kenell

Comment I made later in this thread, are you able to provide any insight on this practice

Cheers , Baz

“On windscreen claims, Club 4x4 count a windscreen claim as a ‘claim’ even if you have paid for that extra cover and regardless of who you were insured with.

I had a windscreen claim under a policy with another insurer in 2016, when I advised Club 4x4 (my current insurer) my premium went up 10%.

The only reason I was prompted to advise them was following an article they had in a monthly newsletter they write.

I did check with a broker I know and she indicated not all insurers take that approach.

There is a contributor on here, “Kennell” who might be able to shed some more light on this...

Cheers, Baz - The Landy”

Hi Baz,
It is the prerogative of the insurer as to whether they include windscreen claims in their customer disclosure requirements. Many don't, in fact they ask for details of any claims in the last 5/10 years excluding windscreen claims. The cost of windscreens on some vehicles can be quite significant and with roadworthiness requirements a customer might suffer 2 or 3 in a policy year. Usually insurers don't penalise no claim bonuses for windscreens and on average a customer is unlucky to have more than one every 5 years. Club has a very specific customer demographic (ie people like us) and therefore they are exposed to weighted experiences. The average insurer spreads its risks across everyone from the 18yo newly licensed driver through the mums and dads and so on. Obviously a percentage of their customers are Club type customers but not all. Things like restrictive geographic limits, additional excesses for water crossings and so on would look strange in mainstream policies but less so with Club.
Hope that answers your question.

Funny you mention that Kenell, when you apply for a quote with Club 4x4 they specifically ask if you have claimed a windscreen in the previous 3 years whether a claim or not.

Thanks Kenell, that doesn’t surprise me in terms of the approach by both Club 4x4 and others.

Your point about the weighted risk of Club 4x4 is well noted and a reason I was reluctant at first to insure with them, although price is extremely competitive.

Having said that I do question whether the weighted risk will eventually price them out of the market as their underwriter sustains too many claims from one demographic - it would not be the first time this has happened.

I’ve experienced this previously with specialist insurers.

I guess, as always, Caveat Emptor...

Cheers, Baz

"Your point about the weighted risk of Club 4x4 is well noted and a reason I was reluctant at first to insure with them, although price is extremely competitive."

Not sure where that comes from? I (and many others) are commenting on how comparatively expensive they are. In fact, I have just moved back to Shannons because of the price increase and the coverage limitations of Club 4x4.

They do, however, give the opportunity for remote recovery (for a significant fee). That may be worth your while.

Cheers,
Mark

Hey Les,

Thanks for the feedback, yeah SATPone organised and paid for already, I am lucky work have one laying around and just needed the SIM card. As for vital gear pretty much got it sorted and am sure to get pretty much on weight or slightly over which is leaving Brisbane fully stocked so will lose some weight on the way.

I have spoken to most of them already, one guy even said "not supposed to tell you this, however probably best to give it a miss and get help on the track." Then I told him the price of recovery, he was quite shocked and couldn't believe it.

A few more return calls tonight to ask more questions.

Hi Michael, yes starting a little over is almost inevitable for some, trick is drive to conditions and approx GVM, until you lose some of that weight in the frist 2 - 3 days.

And remember GVM is normally for good roads, not tracks, so those stresses can play out more on the vehicle.

If starting at BV, you will be doing larger dunes in the eastern side when near fully loaded, only 40km from BV to Big Red, and QAA has some doosy dunes too.
So I guess you can just adjust and try not having to bolt up those steeper eastern dune faces, some of which can have twists and turns on the way up and on top.

Unless you are going Rig Rd, that is a lot easier run than French or WAA lines.

Are you going in April ?
Will be probably hot and loads of flies, a lot less traffic, but you might know that.

Try phoning Mt Dare and Birdsville Shell Service Station and then you've got the info straight from the horses mouths.
Jeff

.
I would be surprised if you could get insurance for mechanical breakdown.

As an example, Club 4X4 state that they cover "collision, accident, fire, theft, malicious damage, storm earthquake", etc. And roadside assist only on a sealed road.
They state that what is NOT COVERED is "Structural, mechanical, electrical failures and deterioration, tyre damage and incorrect fuel".

So if you do a wheel bearing, bust an axle, stuff the clutch, etc. you will get no help from Club 4X4.

Pretty sure that Club 4x4 terminology is for normal ins cover, and yes no one covers mech breakdowns in that sort of cover.

Wildmax would have been referring to various extra 'recovery cover', which you can get for various amounts, with an extra fairly large extra premium paid.

It covers recovery from any incident, mech breakdown included, but of course not mech repair, which wan't mentioned by Wildmax.

A lot of people move / moved to Club to get this extra recovery cover, as you know it can cost a heap when remote to get a vehicle out and back to reasonable civilisation.

There's been a lot of 4x4 Earth forum conversation about Club in recent weeks, they recently introduced an extra clause in deep water cover, and also lots of talk about increased premiums vs value cover etc.

Always pays to check what's covered and do the annual ring around insurers.

That's correct. I had Club 4x4 insurance and had the extra remote recovery option up to $15k cover. It just covered the recovery costs, not any repairs. The premium was reasonable in the first year but the renewal price got jacked up through the roof so I went elsewhere.

That's correct Les, I meant recovery costs not the cost of any mechanical repairs which no-one offers to my knowledge. And the cover is more extensive if you're stranded for some reason on remote tracks, especially if you take the extra $15k or $30k limit.
But as Michael says, the renewal price has been jacked up a lot at my most recent renewal - who did you change to Michael, and did you get comparable cover?

I just went back to Allianz without the remote cover. The first year with Club 4x4 was approximately the same cost as my previous Allianz cover but included the remote cover so I jumped at it. The renewal had a 50% price increase and my car's value being 10 years old with over 300,000kms on it wasn't worth paying the extra.

I might add though, my work commitments have meant I haven't been out there as often as I would like lately. But, if I was out there regularly then I would really consider the cover. My guess it costs around an extra $400 a year, (may have changed?), which isn't bad really for $15K peace of mind. You still have to come up with the $15K first as they reimburse you after you have already paid it.

With Club, from what I've gleaned from various posts around, you can only have the extra recovery insurance cover, if you have your full comp cover with them too.

.
You are right Les, about the Club 4X4 "mechanical failure" I mean.

Further reading revealed..............

"ADDITIONAL BENEFITS
Off-road recovery costs
If your vehicle suffers a mechanical failure, becomes stuck or cannot be driven and you require assistance from a third party to transport, tow or recover your vehicle while driving off-road, we will reimburse you the costs incurred to transport, tow or recover the vehicle to the nearest gazetted road.
An excess of $200 will be applied to any payment we make which, under this additional benefit, is limited to one (1) claim per policy period, up to a maximum of $1,500."

But of course "additional benefits" come at the price of 'additional premiums'!
And $1500 minus $200 excess will not go far toward the cost of a remote recovery, and then only to the "nearest gazetted road". And as with any insurance, you eventually pay in premiums more than you typically recover.
Once my vehicles hit 4 years old, I revert to Third Party Property Damage and save a fortune on premiums. They are still fully covered for theft and fire so i carry a box of matches. LOL

Something that should be understood about insurance is that these companies must collect as much in premiums as it costs them for payouts plus operating expenses plus profits. You pay the premiums, they make the profits. Can you really believe you can win or even break even? Like horse racing, it is a gamble.

Yes, I believe that's correct Les. I think their normal insurance is in the ball park of most of the others, although it does come standard with $1500 worth of off road recovery cover so would have to impact the price.

$1500 is pretty good included for all but really remote, a bit of peace of mind . . .

They then have the $15k and $30k options for extra premium, so I guess people need to do due diligence on the value (all up) to them for their travels.

I think with Club 4x4 the extra $15000 recovery cover is about $200 more and the $30000 another $200 again. I claimed a front windscreen last July from oncoming stone damage in NT. I paid extra for the cover so it should not be part of a claim in general but the premium rose $300 a few months back with the renewal. I was going to look elsewhere and as i wasn't really driving the Patrol at that time so i thought i'd just let it expire and look for something cheaper. On the expiry date Club 4x4 direct debited for my Credit Card, so somewhere in the first policy I must have inadvertently ticked the Direct Debit to continue. I was a little shocked but rather than the hassle of reversing the transaction, I let it go, so i'll see what happens to the Premium next year. The premiums are reasonable the first year, maybe a little more but they provide better products but there is only so much over a standard premium most people will cop!
With the $15000 the extra $200 premium may be the way to save your vehicle and maybe continue your trip if its a minor breakdown but without it it may be the trigger to walk away and claim on your Policy with a normal insurer. So in that case we should be covered as well as the Insurer will allow with that vehicle.
Club 4x4 cover all your gear, you set the amount within reason. I think my Patrol 2003 4.2TDI is covered including gear fitted for about $38000 for a premium of about $1350.
Michael

Hi Michael

On windscreen claims, Club 4x4 count a windscreen claim as a ‘claim’ even if you have paid for that extra cover and regardless of who you were insured with.

I had a windscreen claim under a policy with another insurer in 2016, when I advised Club 4x4 (my current insurer) my premium went up 10%.

The only reason I was prompted to advise them was following an article they had in a monthly newsletter they write.

I did check with a broker I know and she indicated not all insurers take that approach.

There is a contributor on here, “Kennell” who might be able to shed some more light on this...

Cheers, Baz - The Landy

Hi Baz, That's interesting, My Caprice insurance with GIO was due just after the windscreen saga with Club 4x4, I rang GIO to tell them about the windscreen claim, they asked me if it was a sub policy, if i paid extra for the cover and if i had to pay any excess. I told her yes extra to cover windscreen, and no to the excess. She said no it wont affect my renewal with GIO. I still asked them to note on my policy, she agreed it was a good idea. Club 4x4 do things a bit differently i'd say. The interesting thing is, your windscreen claim was probably beyond your control as was mine and has absolutely nothing to do with your Club 4x4 policy or additional liability associated with your Club 4x4 policy! Michael

Hi Michael

I hadn’t given it a thought until the Club 4x4 article on the topic, but advised them immediately in the interest of full disclosure as one is required to do.

I felt it a touch ‘technical’ in the context it was a feature of the policy I had with the other insurer and I wrongly assumed it wasn’t ‘technically’ a claim.

Cheers, Baz

Hi Baz,

GIO didn't seem to think it was a claim. I guess their attitude is if you pay extra for that cover, and you happen to need it, that's what its for. I've had cover for windscreens for decades on and off and probably it was not offered in the early days and its always been around $60 extra. This is the second front windscreen I have claimed in all those years so they are still making money out of that feature of their policies. When they start to break even, they will bump the price up to keep them in the black. Insurance companies in my mind don't have the burden of risk. Michael

Tell that to the insurance companies who went broke after the earthquakes in Christchurch.....

Christchurch was extreme, and who would care about a few insurance companies going broke? Michael

You would, if you had to underwrite your risks yourself!

Price has gone up a bit, not too much though.

Almost better off waiting for the police rescue service at that price.

Safe to say, Police will rescue people, but aren't interested (or able) to help with vehicle recovery or major property out there.
Maybe some basic necessities like personal gear to get you by.

I few years ago now, we meet 2 police officers that drove in the night/early morning to get to a couple that had activated an epirb they had broken the engine mounts & bunched the fan thru the radiator, we all met the couple about 5mins apart & they just loaded them up & took them back to Birdsville to arrange tow etc.
The owner came over to me and asked could I throw a match in it, I laughed & said NO but if we could get it going we would drive it out for him, he gave us the keys & I gave him our Sat phone number
My son & I strapped the engine in place squashed the busted veins in the radiator poured some stop leak in filled it with water (not a leak, a few weeps) & off we went about one an half hours later,( did not boil or over heat once) My son 14 & daughter 10 said the looks they got as they drove past other travellers driving east to west was priceless & the VHF talk was funny as, a couple of dunes before big red we came across one of the Police officers again. He was helping a group that had all got bogged one behind the other, he walked over to my son & said, I know you found it in the dunes,,,,,,, I believe you, when we get these clowns out you’ll be on your way young fellow. We got to the western base of big red & the police man got out walked over to my son & said I’ll go up first make sure No Clowns are going to come down, Do Not take the Chicken track & drive it like you stole it this is how I drive the police wagon, you got it this far you might as well be able to say you drove up Big Red & on to Birdsville, we all went up & over & parked it outside the Pub took some photos had a good laugh
(Will not mention Date or the Police officers name in case it causes him any problems it was good old outback Policing)

Thank for the info Peter, we are intending on taking the Rig Road as our original party one of the cars was towing. They have all cancelled seven weeks out from starting (the joys). So we are continuing as I have invested too much already to be pulling out now. We are not in a rush and will be taking it all in; we have a full month to get around our trip of the area.

As for 2wd, there aren't too many dirt roads that I don't engage 4wd on and keep her in high, one; it saves the roads and two; keeps you ready for anything that can happen to have all four wheels with traction. Maybe that's just me, and as for tyre pressure? She is an NA-1HZ she needs them down low to go, go, go...lol...

We are all looking forward to the trip, I don't think we will have a problem, I am a planner and like to have the stumps covered for "Justin".

I agree totally
I first crossed in 1977 & many times since & even crossed on the rig rd in a Denning Bus (think it was a Denning) & it is getting worse every trip
When i think back Ford did a crossing in there new 2wd longreach ute model to promote it, I don't think it would do it now (not the XY 4x4 model)

I don't know how anyone can justify $400 an hr for a recovery vehicle, no matter how fancy and big it is.

My nephew hires out $1.5M Cat D10 dozers for $250 hr, I think I'm going to have to advise him he's in the wrong game.

Yes, I know the outback tracks are torturous, but these dozers bash themselves about on hard rock all day long, and repairs run into mega-dollars when things go wrong - and I'm sure the recovery operators have highly capable and robust vehicles.

I think these recovery and tow blokes are onto the banks methods.
Saw a local 8 tonne tilt tray advertising sea-container delivery by road from Perth to anywhere in W.A. at $4.30 a km.
Yet, I've just organised the transport of a 13 tonne overwidth front end loader on a semi, from Brisbane to the Wheatbelt of W.A., and the cost works out at $1.43 a km.

Cheers, Ron.

A 8 wheeler concrete truck on town work does about 1.8 to 2 km on a litre on fuel so that sound like a go broke show to me.

I think it is because it is remote Ron . . . and they can !!

Even this large capable tilt tray out of Birdsville is very very slow going, more so on the return leg when loaded up.
I've heard of a couple of days to get out to a stranded vehicle is common, and similar return, I'm not sure how they charge for down time / having a bloke camping overnight in the desert etc . . . I'd assume the tilt tray while driving / running would be $400/hr, but there may well be extras to cover a man out there while stopped etc.

The condition of the SA Simpson general lines have deteriorated (especially) in the past 5 years a heck of a lot.

With the 3 big event dates either side of the desert, the traffic in the 'busy' times between say mid May and mid August can be so busy, with many holdups due to a variety of reasons, and a poor attitude to protocols of radio calls and knowing where you are etc.

This is why I avoid SA now, and like to explore more in the remoter NT region.

But even Madigan Line is now getting like French Line was when I first did it in 2014, unless you are the first groups across, the track is very pronounced, and will only get more established, cut up, and a myriad of spider web tracks develop as time goes on.

Thankfully the Geos are still a relatively untracked and decent skills needed.
That won't be far behind Madigan though, I feel.

It is $400 per hour for the entire trip - downtime included so you are paying $400 per hour when they are having a brew.

This is what happens when there is no competition and in this remote region competition is not likely to happen in the foreseeable future.

I guess if you don't like it, don't use it but most do not have the choice.

If I was these operators I would also be offering recovery insurance - pay $XXXX insurance and we come and get you for free, no insurance and you pay the full recovery rate.

Agreed Garry, imagine the extra money for the insurance paid up front that isn't used.

Maybe buy myself a recovery truck and get in competition..lol

Garry, very easy to see $10k + racking up very easy in that case.

Good idea with them offering insurance, if a majority knew about such an offer, many might part with $100 - $150 for peace of mind.
I'd hate to guess how many cross SA lines each year, but imagine it would be probably be 1000 vehicles +, be good if that info could be gleaned from Parks SA.
How many DPP issued / renewed a year would give a general idea.

Madigan maybe $200 premium ?

There won't be much left for the recovery costs after they register their insurance coy, jump thru all the compliance hoops, and meet the liquidity requirements. $10m wouldn't even go close. How many travellers would be likely to pay a premium? No disrespect but campers and 4wd enthusiasts can be pretty hard to squeeze a dollar out of. I have often thought it would be a great idea to have a national scheme underwritten by one of the existing players and tied into a beefed up (fit for purpose) recovery facility like an RAC / NRMA etc. Sorry gone off topic a bit.

Hi Ron.

I have an ole mate out bush who has a triple road train carting cattle. The going rate is $10 per loaded kilometre. Sure while he is loaded and averaging 65 to 68 Kph that works out to be a pretty handsome hourly rate.

BUT he may have to drive 16 hrs to get to the station to load. He burns fuel at 100l/100 ks. while loaded. He has to maintain the whole outfit.
What would a new 6900 western star plus 3 haulmark double deckers and 2 dollies be worth.

I can assure you he doesn’t live like a king off his years of hard work.

Earth moving gear over here in the east is a VERY supply and demand market. When they are all busy on gas or mining jobs they ask a kings ransom per hour. At times like the present they are undercutting the crap out of each other to get some work !!! A pair of 657’s doing a job I know of for $175 per hour each. And the operators are on $50. Haha. Supply and demand

Cheers Greg

$250 per hour for a dozer??? That's hilarious!

It's more than that for a Dingo! (and I use them all the time) You are seriously out of touch old mate!

By the way, it's $400 per hour + GST - depot to depot from Birdsville. Which I reckon is very good value in the circumstances!

The nephew owns around 40 big Cats, and the $250 for his D10 is the going rate in the mining industry for moderate-term to long-term hire.
Hirers pay for any unreasonable damage to his machines, including shorter-than expected life for components.

I don't think he's exactly going broke with his business - his list of personal toys is; a 2016, 400HP 6.2L V8 SVT Ford Raptor (bought new), a convertible Mustang (bought new), Landcruiser Sahara (bought new), a 60 foot Riviera (secondhand at $1.2M), a big ski boat, as well as sheds full of quad bikes, jetskis, caravans, and any other toy that takes his fancy.
He also whinges about a $400,000 tax bill.
He started the business by himself in the early 2000's, and it's owned by just him and his missus.

I'l wager that remote areas recovery operator with the tilt-tray has a large tax bill as well.

Cheers, Ron.

Ron, I can't really see any similarities between your nephew and the recovery operation.

Firstly, your nephews operation at that price is dry hire, no operator, no fuel, no maintenance and damage paid for by the hirer.

Your nephew hires his gear 12 months of the year.

Now that old MAN sits out the back of the servo for at least 6 months of the year. No income from it.

Traveller season comes. If he gets a call and how often will that be, maybe once a month or less, he has to drop everything and go recover. He has to pay everything, fuel that burns up at a huge rate in sand and is expensive in Birdsville, and maintenance costs. The vehicle is registered but I don't know if he gets any rebate on his fuel from the government for what he does.

If others would like to go out there and start an opposition, then do it, but the transport industry id full of failed undercutting operations.

Probably loss of business and extra wages at the workshop are a big factor too. Having a big stick like that bill might discourage some of the more half arsed crossings from eventuating, which is a good thing.

"Hirers pay for any unreasonable damage to his machines, including shorter-than expected life for components."

I've been doing the self employed thing a while & dry hire, or full hire, that just does not happen Ron. I wish it did, but it don't! That's why it costs so much to get stuff done.

When I quote a job, I have to include possible damages to equipment (and the customer's property) from all possible events.

It doesn't happen too much & we kind of get used to that, so when it does, it we are often blindsided to the fact that we already included any possible damages in our quote.

Basically, repairing damage to our gear is the cost of doing business!

Pretty hard to understand I guess, if you have never been in business yourself!

KevinE, I've been in business all my life, and owned hundreds of items of equipment. I've never gone broke, ever.

Brother and his wife and myself were the biggest privately-owned mining contractors in W.A. in 1994. We competed directly with all the biggies in the mining and contracting world.

We owned 55 earthmoving machines, nearly all between 50 and 100 tonnes in weight. 19 x 50 tonne dumptrucks, multiple numbers of dozers, graders, excavators, water trucks, and all the accumulated equipment.
Up to 102 employees at one time, $15M annual turnover, with a modest profit.

But I'm out of operations that size now, I don't need any of the crap that comes with contracting, and regulations, and fighting for work.

I taught the nephew the ropes (in fact, I helped raise him), he started with us, then went out on his own.

But one thing I never counted on, was the utter bastardry of a bank that demanded repayment of $1M in loans - within 48 hrs - despite there being no arrears, no outstanding payments, and no pressing reason to withdraw funding.

The banks reason to withdraw funding and call in loans? They need no reason other than the one they gave us -
"We have carried out some computer studies and have decided we do not want you as our customer any more".
"We believe if we continue to support you, within 6 to 12 mths, we will be owed money, that we will not be able to recover".
"Accordingly you will pay all outstanding loans within 48 hrs and we will terminate our relationship with you".

Now, you say, "Oh, that's easy, you just go to another bank - or go to a lawyer and sue them for any losses!"

Well, we did both. In fact, we went to 19 different banks, to try and transfer our operations across to them.
Not only was that exercise going to cost us around $120,000 in stamp duties, transfer and mortgage costs - we got the stone wall treatment.

All 19 of those banks said, "But you're with one of the four biggest and most powerful banks in Australia.
If they are foreclosing on you, there must be a hidden reason for that, that you're not revealing to us - so, Thanks, but No Thanks!"

We also went to see a lawyer, who said straight-out, "How much money and how much time do you have, to fight one of the Big Four Banks?"
"I can assure you, it will cost $300,000 to commence a lawsuit, and the banks have unlimited funds."
"I can also assure you, they will adopt every delaying and obstructive legal tactic in the book, to ensure you run out of money, long before they do".

So, we struggled along for another 6 mths with a totally crippled business, while everyone sat back and waited for us to crumble, so they could pick up the crumbs.
Our great business that took 30 years to build up, was utterly destroyed by our banks totally unwarranted foreclosure.
We were forced to sell everything at fire sale prices - but we paid everyone out in full - even though we ended up walking out with just the shirts on our backs.

If we wanted, we could have declared bankrupcty and walked away with a lot of assets - but we aren't that type of people.

It has taken a Royal Commission to just scratch the surface of the bastardry in banking, that has been going on for decades.

I even knew a bloke who was on the receiving end of similar treatment from one of the Big Four not long after - and he stated outright, he actually planned for a long time, how he was going to fly an aircraft into a banking headquarters to "get even" with the bastards (this was long before 9/11) - but the only thing that stopped him, was not being 100% sure he could kill the right people that had destroyed him and his business.

So, don't presume I know nothing about business operations, I have been in business since I was 16, when I bought my first old secondhand dozer, and I'm now over 70, and still working, and I don't expect to be retiring, any time soon.

Cheers, Ron.

How the hell did this thread go from advice about “Roadside Assistance in the Simpson” to how much it cost to dry hire machines to I’ve got the biggest number of Tonka Trucks to All the Banks are bastards to plotting acts of terrorism?????

OMG -what next?

Cheers

Anthony

Isn't 4-wheel-driving all about who's got the biggest, shiniest, most expensive 4WD, with the biggest suspension lift, fitted up with the biggest off-road 'van? - and who can go the furtherest out into the Outback, on the most inaccessible tracks, punishing the rig to the maximum of chassis and tyre torture - without incurring a massive recovery bill?? [;-)

Cheers, Ron.

It's a natural progression, we were wondering if Barnsey was a rip off merchant with those sort of charges, so we started talking about other rip off merchants and large sums of money as a comparison. The banks are the gold standard as far as rip off's are concerned, Barnsey's an amateur doing a fine job in difficult circumstances.

So now its 'my penis' is bigger than yours and my toys cost more than yours [ even though the bank actually owns them ] and truth be told 'big red' is in reality NOT the biggest / tallest dune , fact is it just looks that way due to the lack of vegetation , other dunes are actually higher from flat to summit.

Time to photo up Ron.

If there are no pictures, as we all know, it didn't happen.

Haha Kevin.

As in the same vein as Facebook tragics taking photos of meals and posting them. Bout time some internet people got a life. Cheers Greg

You'll notice that the follow up's dried up very quickly after I asked for photo's Greg.

I let you decide why.

I've found the best treatment to make trolls dry up and blow away, is to not feed them.

I have no need to prove anything to anyone on the internet, I know what I've done, and I have the photo albums (and the medals) to prove it.

I am not posting photos here, only to read more personal ridicule, about how my photos are "photoshopped", or stolen off the 'net.

Besides, it's against forum rules to post anything here, that isn't 4WD-related.

Sorry Kevin but Ron has nothing to prove to me. I may be a bit old school but I take people at face value.

Ron has posted plenty of information on here here over the years for me not to doubt him.

This pictures or it’s not true thing is total crap to me. It reeks of the Facebook generation. Yeah try to get me to believe a word you read on Facebook.

Cheers Greg.

At risk of incurring the moderators wrath, I have decided I will show Kevin E some of my recovery and debogging experiences.
There's nothing like 325mm of rain overnight to ensure you get some recovery experience.
Dodging the incoming RPG's and mortars, and avoiding stepping on the M16's just added a little to the stress levels.
And yes, I'm driving a near new, lightly armoured Cat D8H in this pic.

Of course, I guess Kevin will likely now say, I stole these pics off the 'net or Farcebook.
If he can find them (and it's highly unlikely he will), I can cheerfully advise whoever posted them, that I will sue them for photo copyright infringement.

Back home, it was a fairly regular occurrence to have to debog our D7F dozers, particularly in Spring, when the soil got well and truly soaked.
Below, I was clearing for widening a road in the Wheatbelt - and then things got a little embarrassing when I found a wet patch.
Getting a crawler out of a bog like this by yourself is a black art that involves cutting logs, and tying them to the tracks with steel wire rope.
It wasn't the first time I had to go through more than one log, to get the tractor out.

A little later on, when I went mining contracting, the debogging and recovery became a little bit different, and a little more exciting - such as finding old, unmapped stopes.
Fortunately, it was really handy to have a 75 tonne Liebherr R974 (or two), to make recovery easy.

You'll note I scrubbed our family name out of the decal on the excavator - because I'm basically shy, and I wouldn't want trolls stealing my photos and claiming that it was their excavator and dump truck, and they took the photos.
But you will see my mining company logo on there, which you won't find anywhere else - no, not even on Farcebook.

I might add, you'll see Murrin Murrin listed as the mine location. This open-pit was the very first Murrin Murrin Mine, and it was for gold, not nickel.
After this mine, came Twiggy Forrests very expensive Murrin Murrin Nickel venture - which failed - and now they are on to Murrin Murrin Nickel, Version 2.

Ron N, they look like they could be scenes from the Highway Through Hell TV series. Never doubted you for a second. Keep up the good work.

Macca.

$400 per hour is $9600 per day. Maaaaaaaaaaaaaan

So terry. When was the last time you 24 hours a day?

Cheers Greg.

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And how many days his truck just sits there without earning a dollar.

I caught up with Jeff, who used to be at Mt Dare, recently at his pub in Poochera.

He indicated the ‘big truck’ isn’t used for all recoveries, often just a trailer...

Cheers, Baz - The Landy

I've seen Barnesy's MAN in use, but no more than twice.

One of these times was as we slowly idled into the BRB camping area, maybe 3.5 years ago. The truck came down off Big Red, carrying a troopie(sorry Allan!) & a camper trailer. Wondered what was wrong but never found out.

Another time, we found out the value of travelling with friends. Heading west on QAA Line, when there was steady increase in UHF traffic, the closer we got to the Eyre Creek channels. Eventually passed a vehicle who was running escort duties for some mates about a km behind, one of whom had a buggered clutch & was being towed. The "pilot" politely asked if we could get off the track, so the tow-er & the tow-ee didn't have to stop.

Never heard how they got on either, but hope they managed Birdsville okay without too much further damage to either vehicle.

Bob

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Wasn't my Troopy Bob.
Troopies are 'unstoppable'.... Except if they fit Cooper tyres. lol

Hi Michael,
That $3000 cover, is that for NRMA Premium Roadside Assistance ? Michael

Hey Michael, Yes that is correct.

The key wording I got fro. The NRMA sales person was "we cover Aust wide".

Michael

Well I would seek further clarification on that because the NRMA does not cover you nation wide - is only from a place that a 2wd tilt tray can get to. It is the owners responsibility (and cost) to get the vehicle a position that it can be recovered.

Yes once you are picked up the use of hire cars, hotels, and additional towing up to a certain value is available but not before you are picked up.

I have been through this routine with the NRMA - I had to get my vehicle to a position that a 2wd tilt tray could get too and only then could I request road side service. Once collected the vehicle was taken to the nearest town some 100km away for repair. I was able to convince the NRMA that facilities in the town would not able to do the repair and as I was more than 100km from home, the vehicle was transferred to another tilt tray and taken to my home. The NRMA then offered a hire car and accommodation and additional towing if required.

The NRMA Premium cover is good but it doesn't cover everything and you do need to know what your entitlements are.

On a side note, if you just have normal (Classic) roadside cover it only covers vehicles with an all up weight of 2500kg so ruling out most 4wds.

It's worth checking each states motoring organisations determinations on this, as pretty much they are all slightly different to what's entitled.
They are a money making enterprise now, like many things that used to be more cost recovery (eg all our utilities that have been privatised !).

The RAA in SA has very limited cover, ever callout distances are capped on the various levels.
I had the top cover many years ago, and ion the past 5 years or so, found I had slipped to 2nd tier cover after they changed to a while new offering.

Varous levels have towing for X km, then you pay per km !!

Their top cover has better cover for towing, but with all levels you have to be sure about distances, and as Garry mentioned, be where the tilt tray can get to you, and that can be difficult (if not impossible) in some remote locations.

Thanks, Garry.

Appreciate the feedback. Its good to hear some honest experience, as my original post stated I understand that the desert is going to be tricky if not out of range, the attendant on the phone still said to call them even if it's out of the way. They do have a better pathway to rescue services then calling over the SAT phone. For us, that would be one call even if we have to pay the full recovery amount. Maybe I am a little nieve, who knows.

We will still get the full cover roadside assistant. However, this is mainly for the area outside of the Simpson Desert. Being that NRMA has a monthly payment plan which (fingers crossed) if nothing goes wrong we can cancel our subscription with only a couple of months of paying the payment plan.

Cheers

There's sometimes confusion about exactly where and how you are covered. Your insurance does cover you Australia wide for most companies. You don't have to be on a "gazetted road". If you are on someone's farm and a tree falls on your car, you are covered. The only caveat is that it must be somewhere you are legally entitled to be. Now if you have a head on at the top of a dune in the Simpson, then you are covered for damage, but you are not covered for the tow to the repair shop.