This over weight business and things breaking on utes these days !!.

Submitted: Sunday, Aug 04, 2019 at 17:49
ThreadID: 138875 Views:5914 Replies:13 FollowUps:13
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I remember carting fertilizer @ farm produce on Holden utes for years on end,

and there recommended carrying capacity was about 10 cwt. Everyone farmer in the district did the same thing put ,as much on as possible whether it be a Holden falcon or valiant and most times you where more than likely 10cwt over loaded!

Did things break?...Nope.!....Just trying to stop it and steer it where the biggest concerns. On a undulating road the front wheels near left the road and the towbar left a furrow at times. Breakages where very rare, just a clutch now and then.

So what have we now ?, Big tough 4wds that go like the clappers, but are quite useless in carrying capacity and fall to bits if slightly over loaded.

No offence intended , but these vehicles need beefing up!


Cheers Axle.
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Reply By: Member - Scrubby (VIC) - Sunday, Aug 04, 2019 at 18:36

Sunday, Aug 04, 2019 at 18:36
Axle, were those early utes made from Ausie steel or imported crap ?

Scrubby.
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Reply By: IvanTheTerrible - Sunday, Aug 04, 2019 at 18:37

Sunday, Aug 04, 2019 at 18:37
The internet didn't exist back then or you would have heard the same make/model bashing that goes on today!
AnswerID: 627043

Reply By: Hoyks - Sunday, Aug 04, 2019 at 18:53

Sunday, Aug 04, 2019 at 18:53
The load was evenly distributed over the rear axle, which was a plus. My dads holden snapped in 1/2, so they weren't indestructible.

Power and the suspension are probably what brings people undone. An old red motor would struggle to do 100 unladen and the crap suspension would make you feel like you were flying... or going to die. Chuck a ton of super on the back and it was a slow drive home

Now you can comfortably do 110 with a load on, which is fine (well, not exactly) until you hit a dip and the 1000kg+ on the back falls into the hole and meets the axle coming up the other side.
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Follow Up By: Ron N - Sunday, Aug 04, 2019 at 22:03

Sunday, Aug 04, 2019 at 22:03
Hoyks is spot on. The old unit-construction Holden and Ford utes weren't unbreakable.

The earlier model vehicles such as Mainlines and Inters and Chevs, with chassis' could take a pounding - but none of them ever did any real speed, until the HP race started with Holden Red motors, Valiants, and Ford V8's.

The brother and I had an EH 179 ute when they were new, and the heaviest load we ever carried in it, was 1-1/2 tons (1524kgs), in a set of bulldozer rippers.

But we only moved the rippers about 20 kms, and we couldn't go over about 50kmh, because the front end was so light, the ute was all over the road.
The rear axle was sitting solidly on the stop bumps, and I wouldn't be surprised if the rear axle ended up bent.

Before that episode, the brothers boss, (a bulldozing contractor), used to carry 4-1/2 tons (4570kgs) of clearing chain draped between his FB Holden ute and a tandem trailer!

His boss used to pump the 6.40x13 crossply tyres up to 65 psi to try and stop them from bulging! - but he only succeeded in splitting the rear rims!

This bloke also owned a KB1 (1 ton) International tray truck, which used to pull around a homebuilt caravan, which was built by a bloke working in the Midland Railway workshops - in his spare time!

The caravan had a frame made from 3/4" (19mm) waterpipe welded together, and it was clad with corrugated iron!
One day, they were shifting the van with the Inter, and the boss wheeled around a corner a bit fast - and the caravan fell on its side!

But - the funny part was, the road was so dusty, they didn't realise what had happened, until they'd dragged the 'van for nearly half a mile on its side!! LOL

However, the 'van construction was such, that no real harm was done - they merely went back and got the dozer, and tipped the 'van back on its wheels! - and off they went again! LOL

Try doing that with one todays caravans, and you'd end up with a pile of matchwood!

Cheers, Ron.
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Reply By: OzzieCruiser - Sunday, Aug 04, 2019 at 22:08

Sunday, Aug 04, 2019 at 22:08
If you loaded modern utes only to the 10cwt of the old Holden utes then the modern utes would not have an issue. Likewise if you loaded an old Holden to the specified load capacity of a modern ute the Holden would be dead without turning a wheel.

Axle you need to compare apples with apples.
AnswerID: 627048

Reply By: Member - Stephen L (Clare SA) - Sunday, Aug 04, 2019 at 22:34

Sunday, Aug 04, 2019 at 22:34
Those were the good old days.

Many of the young puppies on here may not have heard of, or ever seen the true Aussie Holden One Tonner....

The adds on the tv showed them with a true 1 ton on the tray.

They are a collectors car today.



Stephen


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Follow Up By: Ron N - Sunday, Aug 04, 2019 at 22:55

Sunday, Aug 04, 2019 at 22:55
Stephen - I've still got one! - a fully original 1984 WB trayback 1-tonner in excellent condition, with a genuine 138,000kms on the clock!

The fools who have chopped them around, and cut them down into hotrods, with 350 Chevs, will regret it eventually!

What makes me cry though, is - I bought a yellow and black HJ Sandman ute, brand new, in 1975!

But I wore it out with hard work, and around 280,000 hard kms - and I turned it into a roo-shooting ute!! (insert head-banging icon here).

It went to the tip around 1995 - and how I wish now, that I'd looked after it!

Cheers, Ron.
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Follow Up By: Bazooka - Monday, Aug 05, 2019 at 10:24

Monday, Aug 05, 2019 at 10:24
Gday Ron. Coincidentally was talking about shaggin wagons oops panel vans to my daughter's bf a few months ago. Pretty rare that you'll see one anywhere these days. Still don't completely understand why they haven't made a comeback in Oz. Too ugly for our spoonfed youth perhaps or more likely it was an Aussie thing and the market simply isn't big enough?
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Follow Up By: Member - Stephen L (Clare SA) - Monday, Aug 05, 2019 at 10:38

Monday, Aug 05, 2019 at 10:38
Hi Bazooka

Yes in my younger days, I was once the owner of a new 1975 HJ Sandman Panel Van, with those very distinctive Sandman decals.

Being the 253 V8, it drank fuel like there was no tomorrow. It’s first long trip, was up the all dirt Stuart Highway to Ayers Rock and Alice Springs, when the only people that owned four wheel drives were farmers and station people.

I saw a restored one in Coober Pedy a few years ago, and it brought back many great memories.

If only I still owned it.......lol



Cheers


Stephen
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Follow Up By: John W58 - Sunday, Sep 08, 2019 at 10:23

Sunday, Sep 08, 2019 at 10:23
I have an original 72 Belmont Panelvan my dad bought new, he has passed now but yrs ago in my 20s everyone told me to get rid of it and buy a faster flashier car.. i am so glad i didnt listen to them.
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Reply By: GarryR - Monday, Aug 05, 2019 at 05:22

Monday, Aug 05, 2019 at 05:22
Yep, I only just got rid of my old HZ 1 tonner with over 800k., but 2 motors, 3 diffs and 2 trans later. A young block took it off my hands complete original gear including the original motor trans etc that I kept in the shed. As Stephen L said they are a great 1 ton ute but try to register them as a 1 ton ute in the early HQ days of manufacture. Holden classified them as a 1 ton truck, hence insurance companies would not insurance them because they were a classified truck. You had to seek truck insurance, and they just laughed at you. The tonners were just an unglorified style side ute which insurance companies would insure. Holden change to 1 ton ute shortly after. I still drive a WB 1 ton work ute, whilst the boss and others drive his crewcab. I hate the crewcab, so I always try and take the WB when I can
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Reply By: Gbc.. - Monday, Aug 05, 2019 at 06:02

Monday, Aug 05, 2019 at 06:02
Creeping around the district on the bump stops with a bag of superphosphate on the back can never be compared with thousands of kays at speed over corrugations. I’ve had old hilux’s I’ve had to engage 4wd on to get any steering they were that overloaded with wet crusher dust. I didn’t (couldn’t) get them to highway speeds though. It is ignorant to make the comparison.
AnswerID: 627052

Reply By: Member - McLaren3030 - Monday, Aug 05, 2019 at 12:35

Monday, Aug 05, 2019 at 12:35
All to do with the design of the modern dual cab ute. The rear axle is too close to the back of the cab, placing most of the weight in the back behind the rear axle.

Macca.
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Follow Up By: Michael H9 - Monday, Aug 05, 2019 at 14:29

Monday, Aug 05, 2019 at 14:29
True, I don't think today's single cab utes break very often. It's all about speed and where the weight is sitting.
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Follow Up By: Ron N - Monday, Aug 05, 2019 at 17:18

Monday, Aug 05, 2019 at 17:18
Macca - Spot on. And it's a problem that is largely peculiar to the Japanese brands of dual cab utes.

If you take a look at the dual cab "Yank tanks", you'll soon notice that they don't hesitate to make them lo-o-ong wheelbase - and on all of them, the rear axle is centred under the tub or tray.

The extra long wheelbase of the big Chevs, Fords and Dodges, is not conducive to parking or turning around sharp corners - but it has two major advantages - a smoother ride, and no fear of fractured rear chassis rail members.

Cheers, Ron.
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Reply By: RMD - Monday, Aug 05, 2019 at 18:58

Monday, Aug 05, 2019 at 18:58
So Axle, are you admitting to running an overweight business?
AnswerID: 627069

Follow Up By: axle - Tuesday, Aug 06, 2019 at 09:25

Tuesday, Aug 06, 2019 at 09:25
Back in those Days Yes!, But so was everyone else in the same industry.



Tippers out on the road were way over weight out in some areas

There was a lot of breakages though.

It would still be the same today, only strict regulation and bigger fines quietened everything down a tad.

The same things need to be looked at in regard to the 4wd and caravan industry

better regulation of weights carried and towed.


Manufactures need to be more accountable on what their throwing out there

and what their advertising as far as towing and carrying capacities really are.


Cheers Axle.
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Follow Up By: Ron N - Tuesday, Aug 06, 2019 at 19:10

Tuesday, Aug 06, 2019 at 19:10
In the bad old days of the 1970's, I had a farmer client tell me how he ordered 57 tonnes of fertiliser from CSBP.

He was expecting it to be delivered in 2 semi-tipper loads - but a Perth trucking company, notorious for overloading, delivered it in one load, on a tandem-tandem semi-tipper! (which is good for around 25 tonnes legally, at best!).

It was operators such as this that created major problems for everyone in the trucking industry - to the extent, that today, even being a few hundred kgs over with a heavy vehicle, will see you harshly penalised.

Cheers, Ron.
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Follow Up By: axle - Wednesday, Aug 07, 2019 at 08:49

Wednesday, Aug 07, 2019 at 08:49
Hi Ron, Yes very true, I still have some contacts that run tippers and checking stations have them scared stiff !!...lol....it has to be that way though, to many on the road these days!.

Cheers.
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Reply By: eaglefree - Tuesday, Aug 06, 2019 at 16:47

Tuesday, Aug 06, 2019 at 16:47
A picture tells
AnswerID: 627079

Follow Up By: Member - PhilD_NT - Tuesday, Aug 06, 2019 at 20:02

Tuesday, Aug 06, 2019 at 20:02
I don't see anything wrong with that, they're just fitted with a tipper body like my Falcon ute
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Reply By: Member - mark D18 - Tuesday, Aug 06, 2019 at 18:27

Tuesday, Aug 06, 2019 at 18:27
Axle

The bloke in the fairly new Narvara probably wished he new more about weight limits on the weekend on the Simpson Desert , wasn’t pretty .
The Western approaches were the worst I have seen In 5 crossing .
AnswerID: 627081

Reply By: greybeard - Tuesday, Aug 06, 2019 at 19:04

Tuesday, Aug 06, 2019 at 19:04
Lift em foot
AnswerID: 627083

Reply By: Ron N - Wednesday, Aug 07, 2019 at 09:20

Wednesday, Aug 07, 2019 at 09:20
It's great to watch old film, of what GMH did to the old Holdens, testing to destruction, on their Lang Lang proving grounds.

Some of todays 4WD manufacturers would blanch at putting their current model 4WD's through this type of testing!!

Yet the old Holdens were used on a lot of roads back then, that would be signposted "4WD Only", today!

Lang Lang proving ground - early Holden testing

Cheers, Ron.
AnswerID: 627093

Follow Up By: axle - Wednesday, Aug 07, 2019 at 09:39

Wednesday, Aug 07, 2019 at 09:39
ARRG!!, the old EK steering!, near had to put a crowbar thru the wheel to get it to turn one way or the other...lol.


Cheers.

..
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FollowupID: 901071

Follow Up By: Ron N - Wednesday, Aug 07, 2019 at 09:53

Wednesday, Aug 07, 2019 at 09:53
What about the "go faster" drum brakes of virtually all the GM and GMH vehicles of that era!
Put your foot on the brake, and you go faster! - that's if you could actually pull up in something resembling a straight line!!

Most times, one side would pull you so far off line, you'd be fighting the steering as well, trying to pull up!!
Of course, those dreadful, standard, cheap cross-ply tyres were little help, either!

Thank the Good Lord, someone in GM saw the light and introduced disc brakes on the HR Holdens.
I can still remember that wondrous feeling of stopping with amazing, straight-line ease, in our new HR with discs!

Cheers, Ron.
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