Unbelievable

Submitted: Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 06:48
ThreadID: 145203 Views:4557 Replies:12 FollowUps:19
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How can they keep getting away with it?
350 watts from a 1 square metre panel.
That is twice the efficiency of the leading technology available a couple of years ago and for a bargain price too.
Notice there is still no reference to output power on the spec sheet on the panel.
Major advancement in solar technology, or major upgrade in their lies and the gullibility of the general public.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/274220974750?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=705-154756-20017-0&ssspo=Kegn4MqcToa&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=KFeC_Gs5ReC&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY
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Reply By: Richard M29 - Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 08:18

Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 08:18
Yep, your right, mostly lies told on ebay, not even a metre square, so no way it could be 350 watts.
AnswerID: 642527

Reply By: Member - Outback Gazz - Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 08:45

Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 08:45
They must be popular qldcamper coz he's sold 1884 in three months - that's 18 a day lol

AnswerID: 642528

Follow Up By: qldcamper - Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 09:37

Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 09:37
Yep rich lying bastards.
1800 people will be annoying the shit out of their regulator supplier cause the wont pit out what their rated at.
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Reply By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 09:00

Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 09:00
,
That's input power. Says so right there in the specs…… "Maximum Input Power: 301-350 W"
Also says "Cell Efficiency: More than 17%"….. so maybe max output is 60W?
Maybe the best feature is…… "Recommended Environment: Indoor/Outdoor" so they will even work indoors! Great for when you are parked up for several months.
Only thing it does not say is…. 'Surface treated with snake oil'.

Cheers
Allan

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Follow Up By: Member - John - Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 15:41

Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 15:41
Allan, I like this bit............
John and Jan

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Follow Up By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 16:04

Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 16:04
.
John, I had not scrolled down that far. That truly is unbelievable!!!!
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Allan

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Follow Up By: Bonz (Vic) - Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 11:20

Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 11:20
beware of chip crack, because "on fire" results .....
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Follow Up By: Candace S. - Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 12:41

Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 12:41
Gotta love "Chinglish"...Amazon listings are full of it nowadays.
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Reply By: Phil G - Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 09:21

Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 09:21
Basically its a 150W panel for $160.
But what's worse is those plastic backed flexible panels are lucky to last 6 months when permanently out in the sun. There's a good reason the caravan manufacturers who were fitting these lightweight panels have gone back to glass.
AnswerID: 642530

Reply By: Member - Racey - Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 17:26

Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 17:26
I have had flexible panels on my van for approx 5 yrs without any problems. It's a matter of buying good quality panels to start with. I sourced mine from Solar4Rv in Rowville Victoria, that cheap crap you get on Ebay Flex solar panels

I have no direct affiliation with Solar4Rv other than being a satisfied customer for over 10 yrs.
Cheers
Jon
AnswerID: 642532

Follow Up By: skulldug - Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 20:21

Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 20:21
Installed my flexible panels (no air gap) from Solar4rv in August 2014. Couldn’t be happier.

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Follow Up By: qldcamper - Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 08:30

Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 08:30
Not saying flexables dont work. This is about false advertising.
Now and then you see them advertised at what seems to be a very high price but that is probably because they are being truthfully rated.
350 watts from a 1sq metre panel means an efficiency of over 31% which would have to be up there with the best in the world if they even exist, and definitely not in flexables. 12 to 14% is closer to what to expect out of cheap panels.
I got stung by OUTBAX a few years back and reported them to the ACCC but they wont act till they have a curtian number of complaints about the same company.
The first thing most people do is cut the plugs off and install plugs to suit their system and when they realise the panels are half what they expected it is too late.
I left an honest review on productreview.com.au about their panels and they have been begging me to take it down, must have had 20 or 30 messages from them.
I told them the only way I would is if they send me one of their currently advertised panels and I would review it. They have even offered me more money than the panels would have cost them to remove the review.
OUTBAX are committing blatent advertising fraud and nothing is being done about it.
Lodging a complaint with the ACCC is very easy, you dont even have to buy anything, just point out the company and what they are doing.
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Reply By: Gronk - Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 22:01

Friday, Jan 06, 2023 at 22:01
Friend bought a Kings 200W solar blanket…..10.42A output.
I had a Projector 120W fold out blanket……
Both connected to a battery that read 12.4V (one after the other ). Tested with a clamp meter….both put out 5.2A
Friend was going to take his back to Kings..
AnswerID: 642535

Follow Up By: Rangiephil - Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 11:42

Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 11:42
You have to realise that the output quoted by all solar panel manufacturers is using a standard test using 1000w of solar energy per square metre of surface. This is done using artificial lights.

Now 1000w of solar energy per square metre is like Unicorns.

There is actually a site which gives the solar input per square metre at different locations at different times of year. AFAIR in NSW in winter at the Central coast it is 500-600 watts at exactly 90 degrees to the sun.
So you are never going to get the rated output unless you live at he equator on an extremely fine and clear day.
It was the difference in rated output to what I actually got that prompted me to do the research .
The rule is buy the biggest area panel you can and count on about 50% of its rated output being achievable.
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Follow Up By: qldcamper - Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 12:24

Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 12:24
Rangi,
I was using 1100 watts per sq metre and it still needed over a 31% efficiency to produce that.
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Follow Up By: Gronk - Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 13:44

Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 13:44
The “other” panel that I had…..a 120W panel, stated on the back an output of 5.6A.
Pretty close to the 5.2A I measured !
The Kings panel was approx 1/2 of what they stated ??
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Reply By: Member - mechpete - Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 12:04

Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 12:04
Yeh iv.e bought 2 in the last 12mths niether
were anywhere near what they claim its really annoying when ya trying yo set up what ya think ya need both at best were 2/3rds what they claim
mechpete
AnswerID: 642539

Follow Up By: qldcamper - Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 12:25

Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 12:25
And yet nobody seems to complain to the ACCC.
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Reply By: Hugh J2 - Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 13:13

Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 13:13
I looked at solar blankets from different sellers. The same 200w seems to be sold by big name companies for wildly varying prices. So i bought mine cheaply and tests at abt 136w fully expecting outcome and it cost a littlish over $1per watt, i'm happy with that.

What i'm curious abt is the batteries , read somewhere that one battery120 ah was actually 105ah so how do u know you have what you paid for.

I bought a thumper compressor the prices vary dramatically for same thing elsewhere.
You have to get your tug and caravan weighed because the manufacturers plate can't be relied on for accuracy.

So where does it go from here !! ... BUYER BEWARE
AnswerID: 642540

Follow Up By: qldcamper - Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 13:46

Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 13:46
I agree, lithium batteries you just dont know whats inside.
Seen tear downs of 100 ah batteries that impressivly deliver 105 ah but inside were second hand 130ah cells, so how old and how many cycles had they done?
How will their balance be in 12 months?
One can only assume the $1100 100ah batteries are new cells, but how do you really know?
I made my decision last week and replaced my under bonnet AGM with a sealed calcium hybrid, even if I only get 2 years out of it I can buy 4 more for the cost of a "quality" lithium and I dont need to alter my charging system.
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Reply By: Rangiephil - Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 15:04

Saturday, Jan 07, 2023 at 15:04
What I did was look for reviews that looked genuine and compare against the specs of the battery.
Funnily enough one of the cheapest Lifepo4 100AH batteries came up as genuine.
That is a VoltX .
There were a couple of reviews that tested the output and one bloke who had them in a home solar setup and retested them after a year and came up with the same capacity after one year's use.

And of course to be expected VoltX strongly claim that theirs is a true 100AH .

The disadvantage is that they have a cheapo BMS which only allows charge and discharge of 50amps.

In my case I have no plans to run a microwave etc and it suits me fine.

I am cautious to charge only to 14.4Volts where they claim 14.6 is the limit. MIne is hardly stressed as the most I have taken out is about 10AH after 4 days lights and pump. I checked it recently after no use for 4 months and still holding 13.27Volts
AnswerID: 642541

Follow Up By: PeterInSa - Sunday, Jan 08, 2023 at 14:21

Sunday, Jan 08, 2023 at 14:21
Re (And of course to be expected VoltX strongly claim that theirs is a true 100AH .

The disadvantage is that they have a cheapo BMS which only allows charge and discharge of 50amps.)

Am looking at 24v 100 amp Lithium Batteries for a DIY Solar setup at home. A very popular 24v Batt in the US says that the battery can be charged at 50 amps but recommends 20 amps. Because of various recommendations this is the battery ( eventually x 2) I am looking at buying, which is around $400 more than the Voltx 24v/100 amp.

Am wary of driving the battery to hard as will shorten its life, or cause a fire. My proposed Reg will pump out 50 amps max on a sunning day, my thinking that this max will be a few hours at the most.
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Follow Up By: Bob Y. - Qld - Sunday, Jan 08, 2023 at 19:24

Sunday, Jan 08, 2023 at 19:24
Peter,

There is a firm in Perth that sell 24v ATG lithium batteries that may suit your project? If the quality of the 24v units are as good as their 12v products, they'd be very good.

Their website escapes me but can be viewed on their FB page: Lithium Battery Wholesalers


.

No affiliation etc

Bob

Seen it all, Done it all.
Can't remember most of it.

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Follow Up By: PeterInSa - Monday, Jan 09, 2023 at 12:40

Monday, Jan 09, 2023 at 12:40
Thanks Bob,
I called them and they will email the details. Their Batteries made more robust than what I am looking for hence a dearer price, compared to Voltx and SOK that is probably my preference.
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Reply By: Banjo (WA) - Sunday, Jan 08, 2023 at 08:55

Sunday, Jan 08, 2023 at 08:55
Stories of being conned by people selling panels, batteries and all manner of items can be added to the claims of buy 3 get one for free, 60 -70 and 80% discounts etc.

20 years ago Consumer Affairs were very active and retailers had to verify their claims of modest 20 -30% discounts. That kept everyone reasonably honest.

It also gave the public the impression that advertised offers were genuine, and for the most part they were.
At some point they stopped doing their job so left the consumer with their belief that the ads were true, wide open to being rorted.

I bet the Government Departments are still stuffed with those who are doing nothing to protect the public but being paid enough so that the rorts aren't a worry to themselves.
AnswerID: 642547

Follow Up By: qldcamper - Sunday, Jan 08, 2023 at 10:14

Sunday, Jan 08, 2023 at 10:14
Too true.
However not long ago one of the big camping gear retailers got a very heavy fine for not have sold the item for the inflated price it had been reduced from in the last x amount of years.
The ACCC need to be made aware and have x amount of complaints before they investigate.
If enough people bothered to lodge a very complaint about the same company they will come down on them, especially the likes of OUTBAX who have little more than a warehouse in Australia.
Might even get the laws changed so the responsible directors contact details have to be included in foreign businesses advertising in Australia.
Why is it that most Australians just accept being ripped off and lied to, real businesses owned by real Australians are going bankrupt because people just accept this treatment.
Everyone just expects everyone else to go to the 10 minutes or so that it takes to lodge a complaint.
Rant finished, but not over.
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Reply By: Member - Outback Gazz - Sunday, Jan 08, 2023 at 11:09

Sunday, Jan 08, 2023 at 11:09
Hey qldcamper

Here's something more unbelievable than the specs of that panel .....

My missus went to the city yesterday to go shopping with some friends and came home with no new dresses and no new shoes !

Now THAT is Unbelievable !

Cheers
Gazz
AnswerID: 642548

Follow Up By: Banjo (WA) - Monday, Jan 09, 2023 at 09:18

Monday, Jan 09, 2023 at 09:18
qldcamper
'If enough people bothered to lodge a very complaint about the same company they will come down on them, especially the likes of OUTBAX who have little more than a warehouse in Australia.'

Those paid to police the claims surely, like the rest of us, can see the falsity of many of these claims so why does there need to be a complaint? They need to be proactive.

How would the roads be if the coppers didn't book anyone unless someone else put in a complaint. The fact is that if they see something amiss they do their job and follow it up.
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Reply By: Member - DOZER - Monday, Jan 09, 2023 at 18:10

Monday, Jan 09, 2023 at 18:10
I have 2 panels, a 180 watt solid and a 300 watt flexy. Both produce 9.6 amps in full sun. Both produce 22 volts open circuit. go figure....watts =amps x volts, so the 180 at 22 volts and 9.6 amps is close.....lol
AnswerID: 642568

Follow Up By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Monday, Jan 09, 2023 at 18:24

Monday, Jan 09, 2023 at 18:24
.
Dozer, you can't use open circuit voltage when determining panel output power.
It has to be the the panel output current x panel output voltage whilst delivering that current.

Cheers
Allan

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