navara,rodeo,triton.

P.S. I ranked the Rodeo 1st, Navara 2nd, daylight 3rd. Would have been happy with the Navara and was going to be our choice until I got such a good deal on the Rodeo (which in my opinion was the better but dearer car). In the end there was only a few thousand difference and the Rodeo had ABS and was Automatic, 6 stacker CD etc, etc.

Would have been happy with either is my point, just got a better deal with the Rodeo.

Cheers again.

Is there any reason you have left the best of the bunch out of your list ? The hi-lux is certainly the best built of these commercial vehicles closely followed by the Rodeo. The Rodeo is the best vehicle with a Holden badge on it but that is another story.

Some facts about Navara. When front right wheel is jacked up the back left passenger door can't be opened . Grab all of the rear doors on all these models and pull up and down on them when they are opened and see how much movement there is. Hilux is like a rock. Also open up all doors and count the amount of weld marks in all of the vehicles to create the passenger compartment. The average is 6 weld marks . Hilux has NONE ! One piece all the way through !!

The best thing about Hilux as I am in the market for one myself is there is an all new model coming in March / April based on the Prado chassis with the 4.0 litre v6 grom the prado or an all new common rail 3.0l t/d !!!.... This is going to be one great work truck ( see Tacuma ( american hi-lux ) on www.toyota.com for an early peep )..

Hi-lux is the only vehice in it's class to pass Global Outstanding Assessment for a passenger vehicle . It is not a requirement on these vehicles but you know what Toyota are like.

Back tracks
Not the most astetically pleasing vehicle. Couldn't find the dozer blade attachment for the front, assuming this is how front clearance is sorted. Hope the oz version does have a bit more clearance. Nice big donk though ;-)

Back tracks,

You also fogot to mention:

smallest cabin space of all of them
worst safety rating (airbags, head rests, seat belt pretensioners)
most plastic components inside the cabin
appalling security (no immobiliser, in fact barely needs a key)
no head room in the back
worst interior finish of the lot

and the fact that the diff is going to need to be replaced about every 3 years. If you don't believe me, ask anyone whom has owned a hilux for any period of time how reliable their truck is. I did exactly that and the common theme was "mate it's an excellent unit. Never had a problem with it. Oh, except that I had to replace the front diff, oh and then the gearbox needed a bearing replaced, but apart from that, it's never missed a beat."

I also have a couple of relatives that own mechanical repair places and both said that they are amased at how new some of the Hilux's (and Landcruisers) are that come in for diff and gearbox repairs.

The had a very deserving reputation, but the general comment I read in review articles and hear from mechanics is that the newer are denting that reputation.

Put simply, it just doesn't stack up to be the most expensive of the lot. The Navara (with the Pathy TD) is a better value product.

Just my hmble opinion, but do the Hilux owners test and see how you go for yourself.

Cheers as always,

Smocky.

No head room in the rear ??? Have you tried the rest ?

safety rating ??? Come on that is a laugh. They are the strongest of the lot . 2 airbags does not make a car safe . Nissan Pulsar has 2 and is a 2/5 star crash test rating. Toyota Corolla has 1 and is a 4/5 star . You know these vehicles are not crash tested .

Never heard of any diff troubles in any of them . have heard plenty of horror Navara stories though... what about ground clearance ?? Hilux is king !! .. How are those little wheels they lump on the Navara.. And plastic ???.... funny mate.. Navara has the cheapest interior by far ..and then there is the triton ...

Sorry but I don't suppost any of those comments and I doubt if you can substatiate any of them.

This comparison says it best and reiterates what all motoring journalists think.

Toyota HiLux vs Holden Rodeo LX Space-cab vs Nissan Navara ST-R

The Wrap Up
In summary there's only one winner here and that's the HiLux. It has the best engine, it's the most capable off-road and it's not too shabby on road either. Not far behind is the Rodeo although the leap forward from the 2.8-litre engine to the 3.0-litre engine is not sufficient to place it at the front of the pack where it was until the advent of Toyota's turbo-diesel. The Rodeo still does most things well but it is the most tiring to drive long distances due to its short gearing, and noisy and somewhat harsh engine.

For the Navara it's a case of what could have been. The new engine's a beaut but as for the rest of the package it's back to the drawing board.

taken from

http://www.overlander.com.au/pg/vehicle_tests.php?id=213

Toyota all the way !!!

As far as your comment about not being safe here are some facts for you to digest.

With any kind of vehicle it produces, safety is a very important aspect and must satisfy Toyota’s tough in-house standard - the Global Outstanding Assessment (GOA). To pass GOA, a vehicle has to meet or in some cases, exceed prevailing safety standards.

For example, in offset frontal collision tests, the accepted European standard at present is 56 km/h. But Toyota designs its vehicles' structures to handle a collision speed of 60 km/h. This may be just 4 km/h or 7% faster but the impact produces approximately 15% more energy.

Other tough tests that must be passed include roll-overs and side impacts at up to 50 km/h. The offset frontal collision also gets a lot of attention under GOA because a large percentage of frontal collisions are of this nature. The Hilux SR passes GOA, which is quite impressive considering that it is a pick-up.

taken from

http://www.autoworld.com.my/EMZine/Review/viewarticle.asp?awReviewID=1181&awCatID=RT.ATC.CAR.PV

Do you realise that no other commercial vehicle of this kind passes this testing ?

And just another small point about reliability smocky.

Some more info for you ( if you can show me anything to disprove these comments I am quoting please show me . But all you will find is plenty of evidence to support it all ).

Powers survey shows up lemons for car buyers

April 29, 2004

Toyota US, which includes Lexus, repeated as the company with the highest overall initial quality at 101 problems per 100 vehicles – 18 fewer than the industry average –

Big drop for Nissan

Among manufacturers, No.1 Toyota was followed by American Honda and Hyundai (both with 102 problems per 100 vehicles) and BMW (116.) Those were the only automakers to score better than the industry average.

Nissan with 390 problems per 100 vehicles is by far the worst performer.

Firstly, I believe the Rodeo to be the best. Thought the Navara was better VALUE than the Hilux. That's what I said.

Yes, bought the Rodeo. Much more headroom. I sat in them, took them for test drives, read reviews, put the specifications from their brochures into a spreadsheet and spoke to 3 mechanics. (It was a $45,000 decision after all).

SAFETY: You're kidding right? airbags don't make them safe???

RELIABILITY: Doesn't matter what you or I have heard. I know 3 Navara owners that are all ecstatic with theirs, 4 Rodeo owners that love theirs and 6 Hilux owners that love theirs. Everyone has horror stories. What I SAID was, that when I spoke to mechanical people, they all said don't buy a Hilux, we're seeing plenty of young ones in hear with diff and gearbox trouble.

GROUND CLEARANCE: I didn't buy mine for ground clearance. Plus, ground clearance is only part of the picture. The unladen ride in the Hilux is also substantially worse than the others due to more rigid rear suspension. I'd also suggest that these would have the highest tendency to roll.

INTERIOR: The SR5 Hilux (a $50,000 car on road if you believe dealers) looks worse inside than a base model corolla. Very poor finish. At least the Nissan has a nice interior finish. Didn't even look at the Triton and haven't commented on it in any post.

SUBSTANTIATE: You mean I should give similar references to the ones in your post? I copied in a link to an article, I said I have spoken to mechanics but I'm not prepapred to say where they work, I mentioned another article that the Nissan dealer should have, and a lot of the other stuff I mentioned comes from the brochues.

AND I see you haven't mentioned anything about power yet either, seeing as the Hilux is poorly lacking in that department.

If you don't want to believe anything I've said, that's fine by me. But when you jump in and claim the Hilux as the best of all of them, when I've just spent 3 months researching them all, I have to disagree. I STILL think the Navara is better value, but not as good as the Rodeo that I bought.

I honestly hope you enjoy your Hilux as much as I enjoy my Rodeo and more to the point, I hope Petza is happy with whatever his decision is. He won't be basing his decision on what's written here, just asking for a few more bits of information to confirm his own research. Remember too, that the things that are important are different to each person. Rodeo has the worst fuel economy and the most power. Power is important, but I don't pay for fuel so you can see which way I was leaning. Rodeo is also dearest to repair, but these things aren't important to me.

If you want to take a look at the article it's:
http://www.racq.com.au/03_car/reviews_new/FCT_Dual_personalities_2003.htm

Cheers,

Smocky.

Back Tracks,

I can't keep up with your posts. Your first one though about Hilux vs Rodeo vs Navara is interesting.

I had read that article too, but you'll notice that they are comparing the LX not LT Rodeo. Big difference.

Also, pull the points out of the article that suit you: Navara is best on the road, Hilux best laden ride. How often do I drive around with a few hundred kilo's in the tray? Never.

You pick out the bits that are important to you.

I am not sure which Hilux you sat in but they have more head and leg room than the Rodeo , CLEARLY !.

Never heard a mechanic ay anything of the sort about the Hilux and my brother in law is a transmission mechanic in Acacia Ridge.

As I said , just because they have 2 airbags does not make them safer. If the car is not strong then 2 a/bags won't help jack. Seat belt pretensioners are required with air bags so that is no added value . Next time you open all the doors on your Rodeo , look in all the door jams on the frame and count how many weld marks you find. You see it is not one piece therefore weaker and more unsafe for passengers. Heck even a UK auto TV show put a Hilux in a building they were demolishing at the start of the year to film it and the building went down around the car and they still drove the mangled Hilux out of the carnage !. They were amazed how strong these things are !!.

Roll : Never heard of one rolling. All road tests put Hilux on top of Rodeo so you are on your own there.

SR5 can be bought for 39,000 drive away in V6 right now and $1500 more for turbo diesel. Who pays retail ?

Power : Look at the power on a graph and you will see that 80% of Hiluxes power is usable in a sensible flat tourque curve. Rodeo needs many more revs to achieve maximum power and is thirstier because of it . But you already know that ;).

If all you have spent is 3 months researching all of them I would suggest to you that I have spent 3 years.

You will also notice in that article that they are comparing a base Hilux and not an SR5 so all is even there ;)

Not safe hey ??

check these .

Fraser, a colleague of Gregg Brechin, was heading from Aberdeen to Peterhead on a straight road, doing about 60mph in a Toyota Hilux. Then he hit black ice, span three or four times and rolled. Fraser's head even popped out of the window during the crash, but he landed safely with the vehicle upright, and only a sore back to show for the incident. Amazingly, the Hilux was driven onto a recovery lorry. 'The indestructible truck' indeed!

http://www.topgear.com/content/my_topgear/prangs/08/01/

Hilux is indestructible !

[ View Image]
The next time the Toyota Hilux appeared, it was in the hands of Top Gear's James May. Jeremy Clarkson hadn't succeeded in killing the Toyota through abuse, but James had a better idea.

The Toyota is lifted up
[ View Image]
Using a crane, the crew lifted the truck high into the air and perched it on top of a 240ft building.
[ View Image]
Simply dropping the truck from the roof would’ve been too boring, so Top Gear went one better and had the building drop from below it! The pick-up had been placed on top of a building ready for demolition by explosives. Surely no vehicle could survive that.
[ View Image]

[ View Image]
After a countdown, the explosives were triggered and the Toyota plummeted 240ft into the cloud of dust and debris where the building recently stood. There was silence as the crowd waited nervously for the dust to clear
[ View Image]
When the dust did clear, sitting half buried in rubble was the Hilux. It didn’t look good. The demolition crew brought in a JCB to pull the truck from the wreckage and roll it back onto its wheels. It was a mess.
[ View Image]
The bonnet was prised open by the mechanic, who then went to work on the engine. The battery was reconnected, and the loose parts tightened, then the crowd waited to see what happened. After a bit of jiggling from the mechanic, and a few strange sounds from the Toyota, the engine started!
[ View Image]

[ View Image]
Over the course of two episodes of Top Gear, the Toyota Hilux had survived Jeremy Clarkson’s driving in Bristol, the Severn Estuary, a wooden shed, a caravan, a wrecking ball, fire and, incredibly, a 240ft drop from an exploding building.

A wonder of automotive engineering, the Toyota has now earned its place on a stand at the Top Gear studio. A tribute to an indestructible vehicle.

More info here .

http://brakedisc.net/features/tghilux/index.php?part=01

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/ianman/humour/bugger.html

You can have your welded up Rodeo smocky .

Just because a mechanic can tighten up the bits and start it after it's fallen from a building doesn't make it safer for passengers. I'd rather walk away from a write off than be carried away and have someone drive my car home.

Also, in the article you mentioned, yes it isn't the SR5, but don't be misleading. READ it. The only difference with the SR5 is cosmetics. side steps and a decent radio. The LT Rodeo includes better wheels, steering wheel and ABS as well as other things.

Anyway, you're not going to convince me and I'm not going to convince you. I'm sure the Hilux is a capable off road and I'll even concede to the marketing and call it STRUCTURALLY unbreakable. I'm more than happy in my comfortable Rodeo with safety and security features listening to my 6 stacker CD. I didn't buy it to wreck it, I bought it to enjoy driving it.

Did you read the article I posted? You haven't said a thing about it. How about the conclusion on it?

"The only thing that saves the Hilux is rock solid resale" (due to all of the existing Hilux true believers).

Good luck to all you Hilux drivers out there, I'm sure they are a great car for you. Each to their own. My needs and wants were different and the Rodeo is a better car for me and I suspect many other people. If you want something you can drive through a fence, terrific.

Cheers,

Smocky.

Gee you never really did much research on the Hilux did you ?

Only cosmetic hey ?..

How about

Bucket seats
Lock hubs inside
Big alloys and tyres
Cd Player
Elec windows front and rear
Light bar
Nice painted wheel arches
carpet throughout
Steering wheel
Side steps.

easily equal to the LT.

Toyotas have the best resale because they are the most reliable vehicles on the road. A amte of mine works in oil exploration and is off to different parts of the world almost 12 months of the year and he continually tells me that no matter what part of the world he goes to or which oil company he is working for they are always driving Hilux's !! . He sadi that some companies have tried the other brands for initial purchase savings but they always go back to the Toyota as they can't be killed.

He just got back a fortnight ago from Sudan where they were driving Hilux's through the desert over there and all the goes say they would trust no other vehicle where they take those things . Luck he got out of Sudan alive I tild him ;).

Wait until the new Hilux comes out as I am and it will cream the competition !!. Most reliable vehicle in its class 3 years running in the USA according to JD Powers survey .

Rodeo ??

cough cough..

only for around town thanks and close to a garage.

The one point I agree with is security but that has been addressed in the all new Hilux comng our way.

SR5 also has the unique " automatic disconnecting front differential " which allows the driver to change from Hi Range / 2 and 4 wd at speeds od up to 100km/h.

Wait till you see what the new one will have included ;)

back tracks
Those images of wanton destrection to a hilux bring me a warm inner glow as I've often felt like doing that when I had a hilux work ute. ;-) (_o_) Even the name leaves a bad taste in my mouth these days.
If I want a work ute I buy a landcruiser.

:-)
Tony Harding

Hey Smocky. Just out of curiosity how much can the Rodeo tow ?

I seen a hilux after a Cat scraper reversed over the top of it once ...didn`t look too indestructible after that.... looked more like a flattened beer can with tyres..

YES SIR !!!!

Struth!
I have a '99 GLS Triton sitting on about 120,000. Might have a quick check in the morning. :-0
I have no bitch about the vehicle and it serves its purpose well. Bit cramped in the back and at the moment with 2 kid seats in the back the whole cab is cramped.
It's been everything from fishing hack to birthing suite and done most of it's 120,000 on gravel.
Saying all this a mate asked me the other day which dual cab should he buy, told him the navara. ;-)

Quickly on fuel economy, I found the addition of a canopy halved my fuel comsuption.

Tony Harding

Well my GLS will be sitting in the shed for the next 6 - 10 weeks so I`ll be checking that out before it goes out...Are you talking V6 or T/D Alan?

Terry mine was the V6, the pulley bolts onto the crank and a roll pin is all that is used to locate the pulley on the crank. The theory is that the bolt supports all the load, however if any load is taken by the roll pin it shears off and the pulley is then free to spin on the crank.

The heat generated then locked the bolt into the crank so when the mechanic attempted to remove it, the bolt broke off leaving the threaded section in the crank.

A fix for the aircon overflow is to just turn the pipe sideways a little.

Mines alright :-)

Made a few calls. Brand new 3l V6 long motor in it's crate from Japan is $2900 inc. Can't complain when a second hand 2H is $3300
I still can't fault the vehicle.
Onwards to 200,000 and beyond.

Tony Harding

Thankyou Alan ...yeah mine is a V6 with 143 000kms.

I found out about the air con overflow pipe whilst having a heart attack when checking the Triton over before heading down to Yallingup once and seeing fluid on the shed floor and automatically thinking it was the slave cylinder leaking.

One thing I noticed is the transfer case to chassis rubber mounting completely wore out at about 135,000kms.Apart from that like Tony I can`t fault it.The only reason it`s sitting in the shed for the next 6 weeks is because I got a nice piece of plaster on my leg.

With the amount of leg room in a triton you would have problems getting your cast in.

I suppose overall the Triton wasn't bad just that it let us down twice with very serious cost implications.

Then the missus let me buy a Patrol so i am happy now.

Don't buy one for towing .. that is really pushing it.

For mid 40's you can buy a base prado 3.0 litre t/d which will tow 2.5t and is a much nicer car any other time on the road. They still come well equipped .

You should really wait till MArch mate.

Navara's are rubbish !!

Go ask a mechanic , ask your council what they buy , ask big business what they buy .. It is not navara . worst resale and worst reliability !

Ouch that will hurt ..

You will soon learn a big lesson on the resale of the Navara.

Nobody wants them !!

And that isn't being nasty , that is a fact. Ring a wholesaler and find out.

Nah, ya can't break em...indestructable...lol

Oh sorry, seems that you are talking about new ones...

Back Tracks has been actually pretty quiet in the last few days....maybe Toyota give him a promotion........ or gave him a kick up the back track lol

Peter, if you're driving such long distances why not ask the company to fit some better suspension. I can drive all day in my old solid axle leaf sprung lux in pretty good comfort, nothing sore, no aches and pains and I'm no youngster. Maybe your ute needs a load on the back.