The value of HF radio
Submitted: Monday, Dec 06, 2004 at 23:54
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Member - David 0
With all of the talk around about the end of
HF radio, and everyone seemingly happy to accept that, I thought I would share with you, one and only one reason why I love HF and will not be prepared to let BPL take it away.
My wife had only camped once in her life before she met me. After we married she only ever camped with the 4wd club, ie lots of people. She was scared to death on our first 3wd trip and yet we did a solo trip on some of the remotest tracks in the SA deserts and a solo crossing of the Simpson.
After leaving the 4wd club in
Longreach, our first night alone was on the Planet Downs Arabury road, and we had not seen a car all day. We set up
camp in a really remote place where the hoizon seemed to stretch forever. I did detect that my wife was afraid and lonely, but she only revealed just how much, at a later date.
I turned on the
HF radio and called VKS737 to let them know where we were and then tuned to
Cairns RFDS where two old gents were chatting about their day. It was hilarious listening to them relate their stories in the understated way of Australian bushmen. My wife later revealed that was a turning point for her. She never again felt lonely or isolated. Every night we tuned to the same guys chatting, and still do now even at home.
Sat phone will never match HF for simple company on a lonely night!
David O
Reply By: Mad Dog (Victoria) - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 00:45
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 00:45
Having spent many nights in the bush by myself listening and chatting on HF I can relate to what you say. Thanks for sharing.
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Reply By: howie - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 02:07
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 02:07
i'd be scared on a 3wd trip.
sorry, couldn't help myself
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Follow Up By: Member - David 0- Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 14:40
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 14:40
dont you hate when you spot the error after you have hit the submit button
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Reply By: Bilbo - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 03:34
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 03:34
When I was out prospecting, HF was my only contact with the outside world for months. It was also a source of humour, mateship and sanity.
Long live HF
Bilbo
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Reply By: Member - Landie - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 08:48
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 08:48
I'm with you also.
Mind you it will be a long, drawn out affair, and it is by no means a foregone conclusion that HF will be dropped. It is used too extensively by the military, and in particular the aviation industry.
There would be a lot of issues for the Civil Aviation Safety Authority to work through before any meaningful discussion could take place, let alone scrap it.....
Good look out there.
Landie "Romeo 9869"
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Reply By: Banjo (SA) - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 08:59
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 08:59
Yep - essentially HF VKS737 and network
membership (possibly others too) is all about "community". Turn it on and tap into that community if you want to. If you don't want that community feeling, leave it off or get a satphone (but if my balloon goes up, I want HF).
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Reply By: floyd - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 12:29
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 12:29
When the "bomb" is evenyually dropped and most of the ic's and computer chips are put out of order the only form of communication will be the old HF radios that were lucky enough to not be exposed to the radiation. Amateurs and HF operators will be the ones that relay the news, location of food sources and information about supplies of uncontaminated
water. If you have an old one seal it up in waterproof bags and bury it in the ground. It will prove to be invaluable to communities in thefuture until law and order can be restored.
The "Bomb" will happen soon. It may not be in our country but it will happen soon.
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Follow Up By: David T - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 12:48
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 12:48
A bit of a morbid perspective, but possibly true...
But to quote one 1960s song writer,
"When the world becomes uranius,
We will all go simultaneous,
And the party will be
Come as you are...."
DavidT
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Follow Up By: Rhubarb - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 23:10
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 23:10
Sounds like something I read around Y2K........ :(
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Reply By: Voxson (Adelaide) - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 14:07
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 14:07
What a load of crap....
So what..... Powerlines will handle broadband....
If you are camped under powerlines using a HF you may as
well have stayed in a 5 star motel....
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Follow Up By: Voxson (Adelaide) - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 14:10
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 14:10
and for base operators in cap cities they will have filters and stuff available..
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Follow Up By: Member - David 0- Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 14:42
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 14:42
filters attentuate signal.
The problem with this issue is that BPL is circumventing the rules everybody else has had to comply with.
It is simply unfair and un-Australain
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Follow Up By: Mad Dog (Victoria) - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 16:19
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 16:19
Using DSP (digital signal processing) various kinds of noise can be filtered out without affecting signal strength. Some good quality HF rigs come with DSP built in these days but I don't know if DSP works with the noise we are concerned about here or not.
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Follow Up By: Member - John (Vic) - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 17:28
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 17:28
Vox initial testing shows that BPL interference can be transmitted up to about 300 km from the offending power line.
The statement is that such vast areas of Australia may be affected by this interference that it will render HF almost unusable and unreliable.
The level of user ability of HF will obviously depend on how far they roll out BPL if and when it happens.
This is the problem Nobody really knows the full affect.
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Follow Up By: Mad Dog (Victoria) - Wednesday, Dec 08, 2004 at 01:33
Wednesday, Dec 08, 2004 at 01:33
Can be transmitted doesn't mean anything John. In fact one could say that the interference could be transmitted around the globe via ionospheric propogation. What we need to be concerned about is the distance from the offending source that the noise level makes communciations impossible and this of course also depends on the received signal strength of the station you are communciating with. The radio ham who attended Queanbeyan BPL Trial Nov 2004 stated in his report that the noise level would be extremely disruptive of comuinciations for several hundred metres from deployment and still be above background noise levels at 1km...this was at 7mhz.
HF can be bloodly noisy, all kinds of man made and natural noises, pops, bangs, the Russian over the horizion radar used to sweep up and down giving everyone the bleep s (defunct now) huge electrical crashes from storms sometimes makes frequencies unusable. I'm picking that should BPL be deployed the spectrum will still be usuable a coupla kilometres from power lines with more or less interference at various times because of conditions....just another pain in the butt thing to put up with.
This BPL business has sure generated a lot of hysteria.
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Follow Up By: Member - John (Vic) - Wednesday, Dec 08, 2004 at 12:59
Wednesday, Dec 08, 2004 at 12:59
Thanks Ray, very interesting info.
As you say a lot of hysteria and I hope your right that it won't be anywhere near the problem it is being made out to be.
As I have said before we will just have to wait and see.
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Reply By: David Au - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 14:55
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 14:55
BPL is a fact of life to benefit 1½ million people in outback Australia.
All they want and need is the high speed Internet service you have available in your cosy little suburbia rabbit warren.
HF radio is now only used by a handful of very part time travellers and the technology is tired and
well out of date.
Why are you been so selfish trying to prevent 1½ million people from enjoying these benefits?
You cannot deny you are being selfish and purely a self interest thing.
Thankfully the authorities have the general interest of Australians' at heart and not a handful of selfish people. BPL is going to happen and is
well down the path towards roll-out.
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Follow Up By: Member - Landie - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 15:42
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 15:42
Clearly, you are either a troll or very mis-informed.
HF radio is used extensively by the aviation industry world-wide.
It is a requirement that all regular public transport aircraft (RPTs) operating within Australia be fitted with
HF Radio due to the fact that VHF communication is not reliable in parts of Australia. Especially at low level, or when on the ground.
I won't go into the speciifics of the requirement, but needless to say, the Civil Aviation Safety Authority has a vested interest in this matter as it oversees legislation that requires operators to have these radios. Not too mentioned the operators themselves.
My money is on there won't be any change, if it all, for a very long time.
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Follow Up By: floyd - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 17:51
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 17:51
David AU you state that "BPL is a fact of life to benefit 1½ million people in outback Australia"
Either I have been in a coma for 50 years, the aboriginies have been breeding like mice or their are a heap of boat people running wild in the bush or all of the above. Did I miss something??????????
I would like broadband in outback Australia so as I can watch liuve coroberees and people on adventure holidays. It would make economic sense to me to have it. Just think I could sell the truck and all of its accessories, buy a big screen for my computer and watch crocodiles and the bush from the safety of my lounge room. I could help save the planet by not burning fossil fuel in my car or by using rubber tyres too.
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Follow Up By: GOB & denny vic member - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 18:13
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 18:13
david au i have watched and read most of your posts i think its time you stuck your head up your bum andbleepoff
sorry dont wanrt to offend any body else but i really wish he would dissappear steve
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Follow Up By: Member - David 0- Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 18:33
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 18:33
BPL is not a necessity for broadband internet in the outback by any stretch of the imagination. There are more effective means to provide much more reliable broadband internet for such
places. I am not sure I would like my broadband connection via the average outback SWER line.
It smacks of govt trying to make money from existing
infrastructure or more likely making the
infrastructure more attractive prior to privatisation of the entire power system.
David O
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Follow Up By: Mike Harding - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 20:55
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 20:55
>Why are you been so selfish trying to prevent 1½ million
>people from enjoying these benefits?
Why can they not enjoy broad band via satellite? It's quite feasible and happens now. And is probably a lot more reliable than trying to get high speed digital data across power lines.
Power line broad band is targeted at the cities - that's the only place they will be able to make decent money from it (and people in cities have ADSL or microwave links) a few people spread far and wide across country Australia won't pay for power line broadband - and, even if they get it, you'll find their throughput will be 33k or 56k or similar because "Sorry Sir you're just too far from the relay station". Bit like Telstra analogue phone lines in the bush now - 33k, if you're lucky.
Broad band by power line = cash! - for someone - not an altruistic desire to help people in the bush.
Mike Harding
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Follow Up By: Member - Ivan (ACT) - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 21:29
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 21:29
Hey floyd - Leave David Au alone!! - he's our source of humour for the day - he certainly has no credibility with his short sighted, shallow and offensive posts.
Vote 1 David Au ;-))
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Reply By: Willem - Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 21:05
Tuesday, Dec 07, 2004 at 21:05
Hi David O
I had a similar experience to yours. My missus isn't the nervy type or scared of things but we were camped at Helena Spring, 90km east of Well 42 on the CSR. We had driven there solo and it was probably as remote as we have been in our lives. I was having a few minor issues with the truck and equipment and the following morning I was told that we were alone in the world and the time to depart had arrived. I turned on the HF and we listened for a while to Mekatharra RFDS Base and their morning schedule which calmed things down a bit. But I lost the argument and had to pack up anyway :o)
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