Solar Test Update
Submitted: Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 21:51
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Member - Jimbo (VIC)
For those who have been following and may be interested here is what has happened with the Uni Solar 64 watt panel.
With the AGM battery as fully charged, as it will get from the car, it was showing 12.64 V when I took it out of the car and hooked it up to the solar panel and fridge at 8am Friday 17/12. It ran the fridge all day and when I got home late, after letting it settle for 30 min at 11 pm it was showing 12.68 V. Note Friday was a clear sunny day.
Fridge then ran all night with no solar input (obviously) and at 8 am Saturday 18/12 it was showing 12.48 V. So much for hl's theory that it would be flat by Sat morn. Panel went back out in the Sun at 8.30 am (the shadow from my house did not allow getting the early morning Sun). It was a hot day in Melb and by 11 am the back room where I had the fridge had hit 30 C, so the fridge was not in a cool environment and I did not put the cover on the fridge. During the day I opened it 16 times. At about 4 pm I pulled up the awning on the back room and put the fridge in the Sun for two hours; the lid of the fridge got very hot and the thermometer I use went out of control (it stops registering at over 50 C).
Keep in mind this all took place with a fridge containing only 4 bottles of soda
water (my favourite non alcoholic drink) and a milk bottle full of frozen
water.
After the Sun had died I disconnected the panel, turned off the fridge and let the battery settle for 40 min and got a reading of 12.82 V at 8.45 pm.
Seems that the solar panel not only copes with running the fridge all day but also puts extra charge into the battery.
It has been ideal conditions (full Sun) to use a panel but the fridge has had to cope with the heat.
Very happy so far and I reckon this 64 watt job will suit my style of
camping ie not staying in the one place without driving for more than two or three days.
Questions the theory of those that sat you need ar least 120 watts.
Still, two days of fine sunshine may not be the case always.
So far so good.
I'll post again on this tomorrow night after a predicted cool day in
Melbourne.
Cheers,
Jim.
Reply By: banjobush - Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 21:55
Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 21:55
Hi, I have to ask, did the drinks stay cold!!!!!!!! Merry Christmas
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Jimbo (VIC) - Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 21:58
Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 21:58
Like ice Mr A.B Paterson.
Cheers,
Jim
FollowupID:
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Reply By: Al & Mrs Al (Vic) - Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 21:57
Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 21:57
Sounding good so far Jimbo, tomorrow may be interesting...
Lyn
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Jimbo (VIC) - Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:00
Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:00
Lyn,
It's working a treat, thanks to you and the "little" bloke for the advice.
Cheers,
Jim
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Al & Mrs Al (Vic) - Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:02
Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:02
LOL, he's not bad that little bloke....
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Jimbo (VIC) - Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:09
Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:09
I'll take your word for that Lyn,
I prefer Glenn, ROFLMAO.
Jim
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Al & Mrs Al (Vic) - Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:11
Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:11
ROFL..I'm sure Glenn will be relieved....ahahahhahaha
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Bonz (Vic) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 07:19
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 07:19
Callum knows stuff, you know :)
FollowupID:
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Reply By: Member - Blue (VIC) - Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:29
Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:29
tomorrow will be interesting Jim... If 64w can provide slightly more than required in full sun, perhaps it will be enough to just maintain or extend the battery output for the 2 or 3 days required for your style of
camping in overcast conditions, given that with a lower ambient temp the fridge will cycle less often... Of course anyone who has followed my own posts will by now know that I have no
well defined clue and as such I have earned "barleys" from the scourge of being shot down in flames...
keep us posted Jim
Blue
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: Allan Mac (VIC) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 09:47
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 09:47
Yeah Blue,
We must be a pair, I too get shot down if I venture an idea/solution lol
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Reply By: porlsprado - Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:36
Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:36
eh Jimbo
well done and a great
fork to all those who discredited you with such venom.
Now, the only thing you didn't refresh us with was what sort of fridge was it ?
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Jimbo (VIC) - Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:44
Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:44
Waeco CF 80.
She's not small and loves a bit of power.
Just the thing to test the panel.
Jim.
FollowupID:
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Reply By: Member Eric - Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:49
Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:49
I think you conducted a test that wont stack up when in real use . In the vehicle there are other things that will take affect .
The vehicle always has a voltage drop , usually under 12 volts ( anything over would flaten your battery withought a fridge ,
you open the car x times a day so intirior light comes on , and you use voltage for other things like radio ect ect ect.
Not going against your theory , I have run my fridhe for 4 days as stayted before with 2 large batteries and no solar panel .
I have desided to go another way . I am getting a bushranger 4000 jumper pack and running the fridge off that , When driving ill have it Jumper pack plugged unto my 12 volt sytem to keep it charged and run the fridge and when stopped ill have it plugged into the solar panel.
Keep up the good work
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: Wok - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 07:01
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 07:01
I think Jimbo[Vic] has been pretty severe in his test.....an almost empty 80l fridge + sticking it in the sun. In 'real life' he could be doing better.
Most of the items you talk of run off the crank batt anyway, won't affect his Aux.
cheers
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Follow Up By: Member Eric - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 08:57
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 08:57
I think the fridge will struggle more in a stopped car in the sun , than outside. How hot do you think your car is inside when parked in the sun?
I had my thermometer off its dial every time .
Also every battey will show a lower voltage just after a cicle , let that battery sit withought draw and its voltage will recover slighlty . So this is why I dont take the readings seriously .
What I think a good test would be , it to connect the fridge to the battery with no solar panel and see how many days it will run. Then do the same test with the solar panel and see how many days it runs .
Then the results would make people understand how good the panel was .
I would guess that it would run for 3 days minimum withought a panel and atleast 15 days with it .
cheers
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Follow Up By: Member - Jimbo (VIC) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 09:30
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 09:30
Eric,
My fridge will not run for anything like 3 days without putting power into it. On average it _Affordable_Storage_Drawers.aspx 40 to 60 amps per 24 hrs depending on conditions. Given that my battery is 100 amp and I don't like to get it below 50% I only have an effective 24 hrs. This morning the battery was showing 12.53 V (approx 90%) after being rested. So I've got 48 hrs out of it with the Solar attached and it's still almost fully charged. Without the solar it would be dead flat and damage would have been done to the battery.
Your theory of the Bushranger pack is similar to my setup. The aux batt is a portable unit that sits in the back of the Jerry Can and charges from the alternator via a redarc isolator and some seriously thick cable.
Not sure of the capacity of the Bushranger and its ability to recharge quickly. All considerations that need to be made. My aux is an AGM batt which charges super fast from the alternator eg it has gone from 12.1 V (approx 50%) to 12.5V (approx 90%) in a 45 minute drive.
Cheers,
Jim.
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Member Eric - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 10:13
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 10:13
have you purchased a smaller battery to run the fridge ? Now you obviously like the odd experiment , lol . Why guess how long it will last , I will put money on it lasting min 2 days . Forget about what you think you use ect.
Give it a go . if it last longe that 24 hrs . soda waters are on you next day out lol
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Follow Up By: Wok - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 13:34
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 13:34
Eric & Jim,
I apologise about my earlier post, I stuck thermometer in my vehicle in the sun & it read 68oC after an hr.
Looking at Uni-solar US-64 specs it gives at best 3.9A
Derating it to 75% = 2.924A
From Jim's field figure of 40A used in 24hr, it would require 13.7hrs to replace the usage.
Without derating = 10.3hrs
From Jim's earlier post he is not getting that much sun....yet the battery is been maintained [pretty close]
This implies that the present test is not using as much current as his field usage.
Eric's suggestion of disconnecting the panel is valid, it would let you[Jim] get a better idea of what the panel is doing?
cheers
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Bonz (Vic) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 13:57
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 13:57
Hey Jimbo, battery usage is measured in Amp-Hours (A-h), batteries too have this rating, hence a 100A-h battery will deliver say 2 amps for 50 hours and so on. I read about your energy use is like 40-60 A-h a day. Is that how your mean it?
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Jimbo (VIC) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 17:07
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 17:07
Wok/Eric,
I know hust how hot it gets inside a closed car in the Sun. When I
camp I put the car in the shade with doors open to allow ventilation. If this is not possible I simply lift the fridge and the aux batt out and put them under the shade of the camper awning.
As understand it the 3.9 amps is at 17 volts which comes up to 4.5 amps at 14.2 volts when regulated.
Bonz,
The fridge darws 5.5 amps when running. It cycles about 40% of the time (ambient of 23 C) therefore 24 hours X 5.5 X 40% = 52.8 amps, hence 40 - 60 depending on conditions.
Cheers,
Jim.
FollowupID:
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Reply By: Member - aussichef (SA) - Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:56
Saturday, Dec 18, 2004 at 22:56
As you know jimbo
I am in the market for a new fridge and will be going out to buy one on monday
i have been looking @ the Evakool 60 litrewish runs @ less than i amp/h on average
But with yr test i might be able to get & afford a bigger fridge maybe the waeco 80 like you have seeing u have done all the testing
warren
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Blue (VIC) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 02:54
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 02:54
< 1Amp/hr in a controlled environment, pre chilled, full to the gunnels with the lid remaining shut for the entire 24hrs... So I'm told, could all be BS... Instrument tech at work tonight reckons the "typical"~2.1A/hr figure was also a bit shakey, he has the RF47 to accompany his BMW 4x4(excuse me) and reckons closer to 3A/hr is more realistic with your average amount of opening for the good old 1 can out, 1 can in routine. He's pretty annoyed with the results he's getting against the claims on the web.
However, I still maintain my ignorance as I have little if any "fact", just hearsay. Thought I'd put it out there for consideration though.
Blue
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Follow Up By: Mainey... - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 17:41
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 17:41
aussichef (SA)
ROFLMAO, "Evakool 60 litre runs @ less than 1 amp/h on average"
I believe that information is not correct! (said nicely, if said more honestly an I would be banned lol)
The EverKool uses a Danfoss compressor as does the Waeco.
As mentioned by Blue (Vic) above, don't believe what can't be proven to you as 'fact' - let it remain just another 'fairy story'
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Follow Up By: Member - Jimbo (VIC) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 18:29
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 18:29
Warren,
I agree with Mainey. I'm currently looking at the "4wd Accessories Guide" magazine where they tested about a dozen fridges in a test lab. In that test the Evacool 49 used an average of 1.9 amps per hour. You can be sure the 60 will draw more than that.
Cheers,
Jim.
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: rb30s - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 18:41
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 18:41
Maybe 1 amp/hr inside an igloo.
Adrian
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Follow Up By: Member - Jimbo (VIC) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 19:01
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 19:01
I'm led to believe it gets very warm inside an Igloo LOL.
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Follow Up By: Member - Blue (VIC) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 19:07
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 19:07
Saw a doco about eskimos a few weeks ago... From memory about -48C out side with wind chill, +6C inside... very pleasant aparently. I guess it's all relative
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Reply By: hl - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 06:52
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 06:52
Hi,
Well, I had that pie last night. But not sure how valid that
test is with a frozen water bottle to start off with. I think the fridge would not have run a lot, really.
If you stuff a good esky that way, things will stay pretty cool for that time too.
And use zero power.
So... real
test would have been if you dumped half a slab in on sat morning.
Just my thoughts... But keep it going today.
Cheers
AnswerID:
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Reply By: Wok - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 07:12
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 07:12
Hello Jim,
Good results......how about upping the ante and putting the the Waeco into freeze mode?....................[AFTER TAKING OUT THE GOLD']!
You would be getting close to 'worst case' then?
Following this thread with interest.......thks
cheers
ps : soda water..............???????????......remember pinocchio?...hee..hee
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Jimbo (VIC) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 18:39
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 18:39
Wok,
I said Soda Water is my favourite NON ALCOHOLIC drink. I much prefer it mixed 3 parts to one with Scotch. That's 3 parts scotch, one part Soda.
Cheers,
Jim.
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Reply By: cokeaddict - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 13:33
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 13:33
Jimbo,
Impressed with your finding mate, but 1 question that has not been asked is..whats the dimentions of the panel? LxWxB
AlSO if you would be so kind....
whats the cost of such a luxury item?
Is it easy to set up (wiring) or
Dose it need to be done by a sparky at great cost.
Thanks mate
Merry Christmas to you and your family.
Angelo
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Follow Up By: Mainey... - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 18:01
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 18:01
cokeaddict,
IMO no one has asked because the
test is being conducted with a specific solar panel ie; a Uni Solar, 64 watt panel.
Knowing the dimentions of the 64 watt Uni solar panel, which incidently is 1,366 x 741 x 48 cm, would only be relevant to installing/fitting it some place specific. just my 2 cents....
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Jimbo (VIC) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 18:16
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 18:16
Ange,
Mainey's dimenyions are the same as my neasurement except for the depth of the panel which I measured at 32mm.
Cost $540 after some chasing around. I was quoted up to $795. Plus cable (6mm two core) 10m X $2, plus regulator $36, plus hella plug $8 and some crimps he threw in.
Dead easy to wire. Two wires from the regulator screw into the panel, the other two wires out of the rgulator I crimped onto the cable and at the end of the cable I screwed on a Hella plug to plug into my battery box to deliver the power. Took a dill like me about 15 minutes.
Mainey,
The
test is being done with the Uni Solar because that's what I bought. It was never designed to be a scientific
test of amps produced vs amps used by fridge vs hours of sunlight vs ambient temperature etc. I was simply trying to establish if it would keep me going for two or three days without the need for running the car, as that's what I bought it for. A practical, rather than a scientific
test.
I went fishing for 5 days, two weeks ago, and got sick of having to continually run the motor to keep the batt charged. During that time I saw the voltage on the battery drop to 11.95 and in the interests of battery life, did not want to see that again.
Cheers,
Jim.
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Reply By: drivesafe - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 15:51
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 15:51
Hi folks, I have one point I would like to raise regarding the
test readings, NOT THE
TEST.
Letting the battery sit for the short period will not give you any sort of realistic battery capacity indication.
The only way to get a half decent reading is to let the battery sit for at least 24 hours.
This obviously is not realistic either, so if I could make a suggestion here, the best thing to do is simply continue on powering the set-up for as long as you can, not just for a few days.
If it is possible Jimbo see if you can just keep going and see, if after a few more days, if the battery starts to fall short of a full charge at the end of the day.
One question, do you change the position of the panel during the day to gain a better charge.
Cheers and a very interesting set of postings Jimbo.
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Jimbo (VIC) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 18:36
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 18:36
D/S,
I switched it all off over an hour ago and plan to let the batt settle for two hours before taking an indicative reading. The
test was only ever designed for my own purposes to see if it would keep me going for 3 days in the bush. Whilst the reading after two hours will not be as accurate as that after 24 hrs, it will give me a reasonable indication, nothing more.
Given that the batt is showing 12.81 volts after an hour and a quarter indicates to me that the panel has held its own against the fridge. It will be a little different in another 23 hours, but not enough to be of concern.
Cheers,
Jim.
FollowupID:
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Reply By: Member - Browny (VIC) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 19:50
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 19:50
Great stuff Jim,
Interesting reading, much more interesting than some of the "theory" experts who were all over you like poo to a blanket earlier!
Browny
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Reply By: Mr Z - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 20:08
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 20:08
thanks for posting your
test results :-)
are you going to keep the
test going, to see how long your setup will last you?
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Jimbo (VIC) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 21:39
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 21:39
It's all over Z, see post 18698.
I'm happy with the results.
Cheers,
Jim.
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Reply By: bbuzz - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 20:37
Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 20:37
Great
test Jimbo. Following with interest. I have done all the reading and I am OTO that a 64 or 80 watt solar will keep up with a fridge for several days too.
Mine (CF45) only lasted a day and a half without input. Thanks for
test and the
feedback.
AnswerID:
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