Solar Test, the final result

Submitted: Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 20:04
ThreadID: 18698 Views:3846 Replies:8 FollowUps:7
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Further to my posts 18636 and 18685 this is what has happened.

Please note this was never designed as a scientific test of current drain, rather it was about would the Uni Solar 64 watt panel keep me going for a three day, two night stop without losing significant charge from the battery. Practical not technical.

Well, after hooking the fridge (waeco CF 80), the battery (AGM 100 amp) and the panel together at 8 am Friday, I finally switched it all off at 5.15 pm today (two and a half hous ago). The result is that the battery is showing 12.81 volts indicating it is fully charged or thereabouts. All I was hoping for was that the panel would keep enough charge into the batt so that it would not get below 50% in this time. Clearly it has done better than that.

There are of course some provisos. Friday and Saturday were clear, fine sunny days and Sunday was a bit overcast at times but a reasonable amount of sunshine. Overall I would describe the three days as ideal for a solar panel and I don't expect that all the time.

Also the temp in my back room was not as hot as you would expect in the back of the car, however I put up the awnings and closed the room off to get it near 30 C at most times. I also only put a very small load in the fridge and opened it regularly to work it hard. I also did not put on my insulating cover.

In a real world camping trip in hot weather (which is something I choose not to do often as I don't like it too hot) it may not perform this well. Of course I can always take the fridge and the batt out of the car and put it in the shade of the camper awning if necessary.

It is also important to note that the system did not have to operate at full capacity; numerous times I checked the regulator and it was indicating battery full, so it could have handled worse conditions if needed.

In summary I have found a set up that should handle my needs of keeping a reasonable amount of charge up to my aux batt.

Before you try solar I do not recommend the advice that I received; that being that you need 160 watts of power to be self sufficient. This may be true in a worst case scenario of overcast days for a long period of time. But if you are like me and want something to simply supplement your dual battery system and probably go for a drive every two or three days, lower wattage is worth considering. You can always add another panel at a later date if need be.

Thanks to Al and Mrs Al who gave me great advice about their 2 X 42 watt Uni Solars working well for them in practical use.

I'll give it a real world workover for 5 days from Boxing Day when I get away with a few villains for a trip.

Cheers,

Jim.
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Reply By: Al & Mrs Al (Vic) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 20:15

Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 20:15
Great Stuff Jimbo, glad you're happy with your results thus far, I'm sure the villains will help you give it a real work over :)

Lyn
AnswerID: 89483

Follow Up By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 20:27

Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 20:27
That's great news Jimbo...glad it's all working out well for you.

In order to allow me to consider what both you and Al/Lyn have done, would it be possible for you both to advise me/us the following please:

What brand of panel did you get and where from?
What physical size is the 64w and the 2 x 42w panels?
What regulator are you both using?

All this is double dutch to me at present and I have to go to Adelaide to have a look at what's on offer.......I don't even know where to go (although I've been told often enuff!!! LOL)...........ie what shop (eg: The 12volt shop, perhaps?)................

Or is this stuff that I could order off the internet? I've looked up BPSolar site, but opening their individual products is not easy...seems like you've gotta save it onto the puter's memory or something; all too hard for this ol' phart!!!! hahaha

Thanks for any guidance from you 2 "experts"......

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FollowupID: 348362

Follow Up By: Al & Mrs Al (Vic) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 20:33

Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 20:33
Roachie,

Al said if you have an email addy, he can email you all the details of our set up, but basically:

the panels are unisolar
the dimensions are roughly 1mtr x 800mm [that's a guess, haven't measured them]
the regulator is a prostar 30amp
we got them from Northern Solar Power

our email addy is obtained by clicking the rig pic, or send me a member message....

and an expert is a drip under pressure...lol..... maybe we're just lucky...or just willing to give it a go, regardless of what other's may say.

cheers

lyn
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FollowupID: 348363

Follow Up By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 20:44

Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 20:44
TY, Lyn..... that info will help me a lot.
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Follow Up By: Al & Mrs Al (Vic) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 20:48

Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 20:48
no probs Roachie, just send us an email if you want more info...

Lyn
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Follow Up By: Member - Jimbo (VIC) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 20:50

Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 20:50
Bill,

The 64 watt is 1366 X 745 and 32 deep. Cost $540 from Award Caravan Accessories in Ferntree Gully, Melb.

I bought a poxy 5 amp "Kemo" brand regulator for $36 which will be returned and upgraded as it lets power syphon back into the panel after dark.

BP, Kyocera or Suntech (David Au can do really good prices) are conventional panels and are much smaller for similar output. The Uni Solars are "light energy" panels and are supposed to perform better in overcast conditions and when it gets over 25 C, when conventional panels lose efficiency. I actually read the back of a Kyocera 120 watt panel and it stated that it was only good for 87 watts ay 40 C.

Additionally the Uni Solar panels are virtually indestructable and if you happen to damage them, a simple fill with silicone fixes them.

On balance I went Uni Solar. Whether I am right or wrong is anyone's guess.

Cheers,

Jim.
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Reply By: Member - John Q (QLD) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 22:40

Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 22:40
Jimbo, this has been a very interesting thread.
What was the distance from the solar panel to the fridge & the size of the cable used?

Thanks,

John
AnswerID: 89505

Reply By: Glenn (VIC) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 22:42

Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 22:42
Gooday Jimbo,

I don't reckon you will be up with us on Boxing Day, aren't Supercheap having a sales Boxing Day only?

Cheers mate...see you after Xmas.

AnswerID: 89506

Reply By: Member - John Q (QLD) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 22:54

Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 22:54
Jimbo, I should have said the distance between your solar panel & battery?

John
AnswerID: 89509

Follow Up By: Member - Jimbo (VIC) - Monday, Dec 20, 2004 at 07:06

Monday, Dec 20, 2004 at 07:06
John,

It is connected with 10 meters of 6mm wire. Good thick wire to ensure no voltage drop.

Cheers,

Jim.
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FollowupID: 348389

Reply By: Browny(QLD) - Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 23:05

Sunday, Dec 19, 2004 at 23:05
Hi Jimbo
Been following your progess over the last month or so,seems like you might have found a balance for your needs there....

I've have the same 80l waeco so it's great to here this info.Thinking of going the same way now "solar,AGM" instead of genie.

Like to here how it goes in the wild.

Keep up the good work..

Pete
AnswerID: 89512

Reply By: Baz (NSW) - Monday, Dec 20, 2004 at 07:51

Monday, Dec 20, 2004 at 07:51
Hi Jimbo this is a great idea what you have done, it has certainly given me something to think about in reguards too solar. We decided not to go solar when we were setting up our 12v in the camper mainly because of the advise we recieved about the size of the solar panels and power they had too be (ie)160w two 80w panels, thanks for the post on your test of the panel very helpful.

Eat pie hl.

See you at Murry Sunset Jimbo.

Baz.
AnswerID: 89526

Reply By: John - Monday, Dec 20, 2004 at 23:45

Monday, Dec 20, 2004 at 23:45
Dear Jimbo
Congratulations on your experiment. I would however sound like a couple of notes of caution. I have seen too many people try to make small solar panels do too much. They end up disappointed with a short battery life and high overall running costs.

I would point out couple of facts which may mean your real life performance is not quite as good as you experienced in the Test.
1.As you point out the days you performed the test were good to excellent days for solar output. The average Melbourne December day would not produce as many Ahrs

2.Late December is the optimum month in Melbourne for Solar output ( December 6.42 January 6.67 equivalent hours of sunlight) . The performance at other times of the year will be significantly worse. In April for instance the equivalent Sola hours have dropped to 3.69.

3. Amorphous solar panels put out about 10-15 per cent more power when new than their ratings suggest. If your panel is new it will be performing like a 70-75 W panel. They settle down to the manufacturers claimed output over a few months of use in sun light.

This is how the theory would predict your performance on an average December day in Melbourne.
The manufacturers claim your panel will put out 3.8 amps.
This would therefore give an output of 6.42 X 3.8=24.4 Ahr .
Amorphous panels are less affected by heat and shade but we still have losses for temperature, cabling the regulator etc which means on an average December day in Melbourne you would be doing very well to get much more than 20 Amp hour's out of your 64W solar panel.
If you are stopping for 2.5 days at a time you can pull out another 15 to 20 Amp hours a day out of a deep cycle 100 Ahr AGM battery, without dipping to the level of a very short life.
Lets assume you have 40 Ahr over 24 hours. This means your total average consumption for the fridge camp lights music etc needs to be under a 1.7A average.
The above calculations only rough, but I have been optimistic. They are averages with a reasonably high standard deviation . On some days you will do much better but not consistently. This means unfortunately that to avoid damaging the battery with a deep levels of discharge you need to provide more output and storage capacity ( or an alternative energy source such as a back-up generator ) than the averages would suggest.
Over many years of use in it my own system I have shown that these calculations are not just theory, but do work in practice.
I don't have experience with the type of fridge you own. I will therefore leave it to others to comment whether your set-up will be viable in the long term.
I wish you well Jimbo but I fear you are asking too much from your set up. You are better to buy an adeqate solar output before deep disharges shorten the life of your expensive battery.
Cheers John
AnswerID: 89672

Follow Up By: Member - Jimbo (VIC) - Tuesday, Dec 21, 2004 at 08:13

Tuesday, Dec 21, 2004 at 08:13
Thanks John,

If it proves inadequte in time I'll have to add another I guess.

Still too try it out in the real world, I'll have a better iedea then.

Cheers,

Jim.
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FollowupID: 348499

Reply By: Mainey... - Tuesday, Dec 21, 2004 at 12:56

Tuesday, Dec 21, 2004 at 12:56
Jimbo,

IMHO a brilliant test and yes even a realistic result as well, considering you had next to nothing in the fridge to retain the cool.

As to needing a bigger panel in the real world? well you may or may not, as you can comfortably get a (high) trickle charge into your battery with only one 64watt panel, naturally two will only be better and maybe possibly all that is required for your setup, remembering you did not have to start the engine of your vehicle during your "test" to add outside voltage.

It is good to see a practical test instigated by a "beginner" prepared to spend time and have a go, and geting the result that is expected from those with experience is just the bonus.

Good on you.....

AnswerID: 89742

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