Hand winches

Thanks Wolfie, Just thought I'd try one to see what it was like. I think it will be too small so will probably end up in the shed instead of the Pathy.

Rocky

Wayne,

I'm struggling for room and was looking for something a bit less bulky and lighter. Agree that something that won't do the job is pretty useless. Do you know anything about the mud mauler? They are reasonably compact and are rated at 4.5 tonne.

Rocky

Moggs,

Thanks for your comments. Is the Pathfinders Club based in Melb and what sort of activities does the club get up to?

Rocky

Mike.........

"I also carry an air jack"

Is this the car exhaust jobby, or a new piece of kit that the Wolf just has to have... LOL!

Wolfie

"Use it to take the strain as you use engine power to inch forward"

I wouldn't recommend this recovery mkethod to anyone else Mike Harding!

This is a sure way to shock load the cable. I have always been told never to drive while winching.....and to shock load up a lesser cable like that in the smaller winches is surely asking for trouble IMHO.

Oh dear....

>>"Use it to take the strain as you use engine power to inch forward"

>I wouldn't recommend this recovery mkethod to anyone else
>Mike Harding!

Would you not Moggs (Melbourne VIC)?

>This is a sure way to shock load the cable. I have always been told
>never to drive while winching.....and to shock load up a lesser cable
>like that in the smaller winches is surely asking for trouble IMHO.

OK then - in that case try the method I was trying to convey... ie. get stuck - attach winch and pull winch tight - try to drive a bit, stop - get out of vehicle (I'm alone see - as I said - so I can't drive and winch at the same time, can I?) - tighten winch a bit more - get back in vehicle and repeat until free - is that OK with you now Moggs (Melbourne VIC)?

Mike Harding

'would you not....' - no I would not, and after your elaboration on your method I still would not.

Sure, your recovery method is ok with me...as I wouldn't be around while you are doing it LOL. The method you are 'trying to convey' is still a risk of shock loading the cable. What if the winch has 'taken the strain' and you drive and the vehicle slips back shock loading the cable???

and yes, you can drive and winch at the same time...I would call getting into your vehicle and driving with a winch attached with a cable under strain as doing both winching and driving. Sure, you are not cranking the winch handle while you are driving, but the winch is in use if there is forces applied to it.

...and if you can drive the vehicle forward, why have the winch taking strain...if you are not using it to move the vehicle forward what use is it other than to stop the vehicle sliding backwards???

Doesn't matter...you seem to have an issue Mike Harding with your recovery methods being questioned .... BTW sorry for using your name and stating a generally accepted view on winching.

>The method you are 'trying to convey' is still a risk of shock
>loading the cable. What if the winch has 'taken the strain' and
>you drive and the vehicle slips back shock loading the cable???

The inertia of the vehicle at that time would be small - hence any shock load would be small.

These winches have about 3m of cable available when their snatch block is used (and it usually must be). Therefore they always need a winch extension strap to be used too. In the event of shock loading, that strap will stretch and absorb the energy well before the cable does.

>you seem to have an issue Mike Harding with your recovery
>methods being questioned .... BTW sorry for using your name
>and stating a generally accepted view on winching.

No. Just the tone you used to do it.

Mike Harding

Sorry, I didn't mean to use a 'tone' that was offensive to you. I was trying to convey my 'shock' that someone would not only use this method themselves but would be recommending it to others. Maybe (if you haven't already) you should do an accredited 4wd recovery course because what you are doing with your winch is extremely dangerous.

BTW, winch extension straps will not absorb any energy or stretch and if you have a cable under load - it would not take much to shock load it.

We are not here to argue about this so you have stated your preferred method and I have stated my opinion that it is dangerous - that should be the end of it.

Hey!!!! What about me!!!!

Air Jack.

Please... Please... Please... Please... Please... Please... answer me...LOL!!

>BTW, winch extension straps will not absorb any energy or stretch

Yes they will - so will a steel cable, but less so.

>because what you are doing with your winch is extremely dangerous.

My middle name is "Danger!" - I like to live on the edge :)

Mike (Danger!) Harding

Hey 'Danger'

Thanks for your suggestions and good to see some spirited debate on the topic. Like you, I carefully assess the situation before I get stuck and just wanted a back up in case. Bullwinkle and I travel on our own and I want to be able to get moving if I get stuck.

At the risk of opening up pandora's box again, any suggestions on how to shorten a winch extension strap? It was suggested that I buy the longest one at 30metres so how do you get on if you only need say 20 metres?

Rocky

"Bullwinkle"!? I would just love to meet a woman who doesn't mind being called Bullwinkle - take good care of her Rocky :)

>any suggestions on how to shorten a winch extension strap?

Well, usually one anchors to a tree so just wrap as many turns as necessary around the tree in order to "loose" the excess strap. You can also use a "Snatchum" strap as a tree protector and winch anchor (provisor follows here for all the "sensitive" people :) _PROVIDING_ you wrap _ALL_ the strap around the tree and just keep the ends free - otherwise you'll tend to have an elastic band anchor - which can be embarrassing :)

btw – ensure you _ONLY_ anchor to trees which have an Australian Standards approval :)

Mike (Danger!) Harding

PS. (I like that nickname :)

PPS. Sorry Wolfie - yep my "air jack" is an exhaust thingie.

Hey wolfie baby, saw an ad for a new one which has both exhaust and compressor inlets, so twice the fun!! definetly a few beers worth waiting for inflation if using a compressor i reckon :-))

ps i reckon those bag jacks might even pop out pine bollards so wolfie can get some safe shuteye :-))

Danger,

I do take good care of Bullwinkle. With those big things coming out her head, I'm not game to cross her!!

I never thought of winding the strap around the AS approved tree. Thanks for the tip.

Rocky

Wayne,

Thanks for the advice - both with the strap and a Driver Training Course. One of my mates bought a Prado and went down to Werribee (or Anglesea maybe) with the Deniliquin Club and thoroughly enjoyed the 2 days.
Now I have a few more spare weekends I can head down there and learn a bit more.

Rocky

Rocky,

They should show you how a hand winch works and all the other equiment required to keep you vehicle on the move.

Ask questions, even if they might sound a little stupid, this is the time to ask.

They should also have a hand book that you can keep in the glove box just in case, if they don't there are other books that cover 4WD skills.
There are some that can be purchase from this site.

Wayne

Wayne,

Checked out the Vic 4WD club website and they list a training course in Melb. Bullwinkle and I are going to go to 1 in a couple of months time. There are 2 levels - basic and advanced. Sounds like the advanced one will cover the sort of areas you raised. Have to do the basic one 1st so will do both.

Will post results after we have done them.

Thanks for your advice.

R&B

Sandman,

I'll go and check out what they have next time I'm in town.

Rocky

Shaker,

Thanks for the response. I will go and check one out. They look to be a good alternative to the wire cable ones.

Rocky

I remember Mud Maulers from a year or two back - never used one though. Are they very much better than the cheapie Black Rat et al type, do you think?

Mike (Danger!) Harding