Auto Gas v Camping Gas

Peter,

Gas for the bbq is not delivered as vapour!!

It is the same, both delivered as liquid (liquified gas) the car system converts it to gas at the regulator (usually under the bonnet), the bbq system at the regulator in line at the hose which usually sits close to the bottle.
Talking to a friend of mine who is a qualified gas fitter and happens to also have the license for car inspections on gas, he said the gas is the same, you just cannot fill the gas bottle at the pump because of the way they are filled/purged, with the bbq gas bottle they need to be bled manualy and the car one as a safety device etc.

The gas itself is the same.

The gas in not the same. LPG is a mixture of Butane and Propane. BBQ gas is straight Propane.

Leroy

The regulator at the top of the bottle simple regulates pressure...it does NOT convert the liquid to gas...

Take the regulator off...open the valve...Gas comes out...Tip the bottle over. Depending on how full it is liquid will start to exit the bottle as it reaches the valve. this is one way (very crude, VERY DANGEROUS and must be done outside away from flames etc) to tell how full the bottle is... I saw this done once by a Scout Leader....I wouldn't really recommend it but it does illustrate the point that the gas delivery in a BBQ bottle is vapour from the top of the bottle...

Also as I pointed out (as did Leroy) your qualified gasfitter is plainly WRONG. The gases are DIFFERENT and it is ILLEGAL to fill a BBQ gas bottle from a car pump and ILLEGAL for a sevice station operator/refiller to decant from a Car LPG tanker into the 90kg+ bottle used to fill BBQ bottles.

See The Office of Gas Safety Victoria
and
Aust LPG Assoc Ltd.

he never told me it was legal...

Found it

http://www.deh.gov.au/atmosphere/lpg/

Confused, I am.

I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong but I think you'll find that butane has a higher energy ouput per litre than propane and burns slightly hotter.
This means that if jetted correctly an appliance should use less gas than it would on propane. In fact, many disposable cartridge gas stoves and lanterns do use butane and are set up for it.

Theoretically running butane in an appliance designe for propane could lead to premature failure of the burner (not designed for the extra heat) and the mixture will be ever so slightly wrong. Some BBQs have adjustable jets so could be altered but if you are using a mixture of propane/butane you couldn't get it exactly right over the life of the bottle.

In reality, the differences are quite minor and most quality appliances would last and run quite well on a mix. The only long term issue may be due to any other additives that may be in autogas not burning off properly due to a much lower combustion temperature and/or gumming up the jets/regulator as these were not designed to have these substances present. I don't know for sure if there are any other additives in autogas but there may be.

Bottom line: It can be done and may work perfectly, but is in fact illegal and possibly dangerous, particularly if you do the decanting yourself. I've done LPG fire safety and handling courses and the potential for disaster gives me the willies! I've decanted gas, and may do so again, but I always try to be exceptionally careful.

You CANNOT be too careful where any form of LPG is concerned. There was a big article in the Herald-Sun (Melbourne) today (6/6/2005) about a home mechanic who caused a LPG leak while working on his Ute in the garage, luckily went inside for a cuppa, and blew the whole house 15cm up of its foundations, knocked down half of its brick walls and threw the people inside up in trhe air and banged their heads on the ceiling! Luckily no-one was really injured, but the Ute is a write-off and the house (about $400,000 worth) will have to be demolished. I bet his Insurance company will think long and hard about paying up.

House lifted 15cm in gas explosion

We all have to make our own decisions as to wether what we do is worth the risk we take. In my opinion I'm not willing to risk my, or my family's, safety and will get someone else to fill my bottles with the correct gas, at a safe place.

Peter

I agree you cannot be too careful with LPG , that said if you use the correct connections and do all the decanting outside away from sparks open flames etc and have good knowledge of what you are doing there are no problems.
I have seen some so called trained service station attendants who are supposed to know what they are doing filling bottles and I have left the area quick smart, just unbelievably dangerous.
As was mentioned earlier by others, go into remote areas and all the gas is the same (Auto Gas) as it is too costly to transport the two different gas types. I have seen it first hand the truck first filled the Auto Gas tank at the service station and promptly filled up the decanting bottle on the other side of the same service station from the same truck and hose, there aren,t two separate tanks in LPG tankers. So much for the legal bullbleepthat you get fed, its just a total rip off.

Treker

Agreed, some service station attendants are there own worst enemies..

Interestingly in the remote area you mention where autogas and bbq lpg are the same they deliver pure propane not the propane/butane mix we get in the city.

Peter

I agree with you pig shooter.

I have smelt the putrid smell of Auto LPG being used in a BBQ and it makes you sick. I have never smelt a sickening smell from either a Propane cooker or a Butane cooker when used with the proper Gas.

Probably in the outback where they fill both bulk tanks from the one tanker delivery, they don't put the putrid stink additive in at all.

I can't believe that people actually worry about the cost of gas for a BBQ - I know my wealth has not been affected by this but my health probably is better!

Gerhard