LIEMACK Fridge users

David the fact is Liemack fridges draw 3 times the power of other fridges, and 12 hours for a battery is not bad.

Sure the Liemack is a good fridge, only problem it sucks power, and at the end of the day, does the same job as a fridge that consumes a 1/3 of the power. The Liemack uses a Mitsubishi 240vAC compressor, and the 12vDC power is converted into 240vAC to run the compressor. This alone is a very wasteful exercise, before you get to the efficiency of the compressor.

Take for example a Chescold 3 way fridge/freezer. Until recently I owned one of these, and even in mid-summer heat never had an issue with it, as it was installed exactly as it should be, and was a great fridge. However, you would never even consider running it from 12vDC on battery, as the current consumption is 10 amps. Your Liemack is about 6 amps. I had a rely on my vehicle, so when I turned my engine off, my fridge 12vDC got disconnected. If I was stopping for any time, I would put it on gas. Unfortunatly you do not have this option with your Liemack.

Your options:
2 x 75w solar panels - minimum
Honda EU1000 generator
Sell the Liemack and buy one of the better quality well insulated Danfoss powered units.

Hi David,
I also have a Leimack fridge, a 90 litre front opener. We did 6 week trip up through the centre in September !999. We only had our original battery in our new Patrol and it performed resonably well considering the extreme temps that we encountered. We found that if we set camp before about 4pm, the fridge would be showing low by about 9pm, then out for a 30minute drive, not the ideal situation when camped next to other campers. Then it would run overnite till about !0am. When i put a second battery (no isolator), it really made the fridge workable it would run about 24 hours. Typical would be an early afternoon camp say, 2pm till 2pm next day, keeping the sun off the fridge is also necessary for the 24 hour run time. Battery set was 11.3 volts with one battery and and 11 volts for two batteries. If you set your temp too low , this can have a huge affect on the run time. I always set mine to 1 deg, that gives about -5 deg in the freezer. My batteries are standard N70ZZ, 15 plate, but find now my batteries are struggling after12 months of running the fridge full time, the constant charge , discharge must take its toll on the batteries. I still believe it is the best fridge on the market, but the battery situation seems to be a problem to most owners. I would be interested to hear what settings you set and the run times in hot conditions. Best regards, Michael

i've got a mate with a liemack who loves it, but I think I get more run time that he does.

Some things to check:

Do you have 10mm2 (starter size cable) from both the positive AND negative battery terminals to your fridge?

If you have a multimeter put the positive probe on the positive battery terminal and the negative probe on the positive cable as close to the inverter as possible (or better still at the inverter) then take a reading when the compressor is running.. That reading is the voltage drop in the cable. The higher the reading the more battery power that is being wasted as heat in the cable and decreasing your run time.

By the way David, Is Liemack still manufacturing Fridges? I read that they had gone out of business. You mentioned Reefer, is it new owners? Its probably the most expensive bit of camp gear I own and I was worried about service and backup long term if my 90 DTV has problems. I've had it for 3 years now and it hasn't let me down. Michael

David ,
I went through exactly the same as you earlier this year-the fridge would run for 20-30 hours using BOTH batteries and then would not shut off at the designated voltage, no matter what it was set at.
I spent fuitless hours & dollars having it checked out by different auto electricians and Liemack checked it twice , but to no avail.
In the end I put in a box & sent it back to Liemack telling them I wanted my money back ( which thankfully they did 6 weeks before they shut down) and bought a Trailblaza.
A very disapointing exercise as I believe the Liemack had all the features design and construction that I was after,but in the end i'm wrapped with the Trailblaza.
Regards Pete

David I wouldn't take to much notice of the start up power consumption, I own a 90 lt DT Liemack, and have never had a problem with it, I've also owned an Engel and now don't. I live in the North of SA and it get pretty warm here, my Leimak works well in this heat, keeps food frozen and chilled although 48C tests its run time. Mine has been through a few musters now on the back of one of our ute's, provided it gets a good clean out with the air gun when we finish it holds up very well, 3 years now. The Liemack, although they're now called Reefers, kicks in at higher power levels than other fridges, but mine probably runs around 3amp/hrs on average. The insulation is far better than the competion and if I'm right is actually thermal rated, although someone may need to confirm this with the new company. My unit dosen't draw masses amounts of power, if a unit _Affordable_Storage_Drawers.aspx a third the power chances are it refigerates a third of what a Liemack does. Its similar to owing a Subaru and wanting it to do the same thing a Land Cruiser can do. Your batteries in parallel are the way I have mine set up, I use 2 Optima batteries, they're expensive but in this country you need something that will do the job. I'd check all connections make sure they're clean and there's no breaks especially in soldered areas. I'd also check the alternator to make sure its charging the batteries properly and lastly are you using the wiring kit Liemack supply with their fridges, that makes a big difference. I'd stick with your fridge regardless of the comments here, and I'd call the company to see what they have to say, the contact details are here on this site.

Firstly David, the best response from your Liemack will be if it is connected up and used as recommended in the owner manual. Twin 10mm cable as supplied with the fridge should be connected direct to the battery(s) Twin batteries should be connected in parralel with NO solenoids or other devices used. The Liemack is the ONLY fridge with a proper battery monitoring and cut out facility built in. Unlike the other so called ' battery protection' promoted by others, the Liemack can be induvidually set so that you establish your own safe low battery cut out value. I would recommend that you install twin 'Optima' batteries and conect as recomended and you will get about one and half to two days without recharge. (These batteries are initially expensive but work out cheaper than often replacing lesser batteries).
Secondly to respond to some misleading rubbish that formed some responses in this forum. The Danfoss BD3 compressor used by others (now BD 50 used in some bigger cabinets) is an excellent small compressor which like ALL recipricating and rotary compressors (except the defunct Italia Colda) uses ALTERNATING CURRENT NOT DIRECT CURRENT. The 12 volt DC is INVERTED into AC. (Have a look at the little black box on the Danfoss compressor!!!!! Next lets look at efficiency...All compressors have what is called a co-efficient factor. This is the amount of refigeration delivered from each electrical power consumed. The commonly used Danfoss BD 3 has a co-effcient (cop) factor of 0.92 while the Mitsubishi (Liemack) rotary has a considerably better cop of 1.07. (Manufacturers figures, Danfoss document CN.46.A1.02.) The Mitsubishi figures are then to have their efficiency decreased by the inverter loss factor which is .94. Therefore inverting to a higher AC voltage to operate a more efficient compressor can produce better results.
The Liemacks much more powerful compressor obviously demands a top power supply and often poor power supplies are misinterpreted as power consumed.
Next.. even the new most powerful 12 volt Danfoss (BD50) only produces 77 watts of refrigeration output while the Mitsubishi produces 119!!! The Liemack is the most powerful portable by a country mile and while it is running uses around 9 amps for each hour of operation while the BD50 would be using about 6 amps, but the Liemack is delivering so much more and has the grunt to keep refrigerating when the others are dying. With far greater refrigeration output, the bigger compressor obviously gets the job done quicker resulting in more off time. Claims that the Liemack uses three times the power of similar Danfoss powered units and that "mob Refrigeration Research has taken over Liemack" are blatant lies. Long established marine refrigeration system manufacturer, Refrigeration Research will provide parts and service for Liemack products and will be 're birthing' the Liemack concept shortly, but have NOT taken over Liemack!
So now some facts and hopefully some help for you David. Liemack like many others, had some isolated batches of insulation that failed after approx 18 months use. You may have an insulation problem but first do the following test (applies to any fridge) ... Time a typical 'on' period then 'off' period. Add these together then divide by the 'on' time to establish a 'duty cycle' percentage. If the duty % is asy 25%, divide this into the 9amp/hr rate to establish your actual hourly consumption. In this example the fridge consumes 2.25 amps / hr. Therefore if your battery(s) only delivers say 10 hours, this means you have got 25 amps only from it.
Next the most difficult thing to explain involves temperature and 'phase change'. This problem effects Liemacks more than others because with their digital temperature control and more powerful refrigeration capability, are more likely to be a the temperatures where this problem occurs. One previous reply correctly mentioned setting temp cut out a little higher for better results. Using water as an example, it takes one watt of refrigeration to lower one kilo of water one degree untill it starts the 'phase' change!!! Phase change is when the refrigerated product is changing status (goin' to ice! or even as this is attempted) This takes up to EIGHT watts per kilo to lower one degree. So if you have your fridge set so that it is near or attempting to phase change, you can be consuming huge ammounts of power for virtually no result!! So try running the temp up a bit higher and if you wish contact RR and instruction on altering the "differential' (and checking insulation) will be provided.
Finally may I suggest that tests done by "Build environs" Qld Uni in a situation where amateurs with advertising dollars were not involved, would find egg on a lot of faces!!
And for you only David, I will accept your reverse call if you think I can assist you. (phone number above the grill! ask for Mack)

Hi Mack,

Thanks for your informed technical reply to one of the most vexing problems regarding refrigeration. Most of the comments by oziexplorer (bit of a hide using that title in my opinion) are certainly misinformed and not just for this subject. It's one thing to have personal comments regarding products but to confuse them with incorrect facts is another. I had thought of buying a Liemack at one stage however was able to purchase a brand new 60 litre Engle for only $900. I am a technician in a thermofluids laboratory and concur with Mack's comments and theory regarding refrigeration. Not saying that the Liemack doesn't have faults I haven't tested or researched this unit so can't, unlike some, give specific references to this product. However the figures quoted by yourself (Mack) certainly seem more realistic to others and are based on on known theory. I'd have to concur with your view on testing procedures, I work for one of those places you mention and it is paramount that unbiased traceable data collection and analysis is conducted. Oziexplorer may have strong personal opinions regarding specific products however in my eyes lacks technical credibility when using exaggerated or misleading facts and data. Not really fair when others may use this forum to make expensive purchases. All I can say is as with other information sources, beware. Certainly by far the majority of users to this forum, that's why it's the best one to use, have general personal or credible responses to subjects that are very usefully. Sorry to change the tone of replies but I got to the point where enough is enough. Keep up the good work ExplorOz team and like minded subscribers.
Regards

Hi All, Some very interesting comments have come from David's original posting. Some people seem to be little confused about wire sizing, it's 10 mm square (10mm2) not 10mm diameter, 10mm square i feel would be perfect for all fridges regardless of brand. Well if Liemack products are 'dogs', i'm keeping my dog because it works for me. It may or maynot draw a heap of power but who cares? Two big batteries, 100 amp alternator,big diesel engine to run it all, 60litres of cold food and 30 litres of frozen meat, PERFECT. Regards to all Michael.

Whooaaa - planet earth to Nigel and Michael (pun), Optima have two models, the red one which is recommended for starting uses, and the yellow one in my kitchen hooked up to a steca regulator going to a solar panel on my roof to keep a trickle charge into it (i use for other things besides camp outs). It is a genuine deep cycle battery with a 65ah rating but amazingly also a 750Ca and 950CCA rating, which is why it is the perfect battery for winching (and starting any engine when the starting battery fails), also because of its advanced construction, it more than happily absorbs a high charging current - when getting low and i am not in a national park i whack it on my christie charger, have a couple beers and within an hour or so it is fully charged unlike for example a 100ah lead acid deep cycle battery which should only be charged at a current approximately 1/10th of its capacity - so charging it at 10amps is like just too many beers to drive home on, though seeing as it would take about 9 hours to fully charge (not bad math, you can't draw 100ah out of a 100ah battery) you would probably pass out or run out of beers.

If you want to know more just do a google search on Optima Battery and you will get dozens of sites and probably Optima's own site.

This topic is developing too much angst, lets move on.

I FISH WITH A MATE OF MINE WHO HAS A LIEMACK AND AFTER A COUPLE OF DAYS HIS BATTERY IS ALLWAY FLAT,WE THROUGHT THE BATTERY MUST BE DEAD BUT IT WOULD SEEM NOT.THE ENGEL JUST GO AND GO.FOR POWER USAGE THEY ARE MILES AHEAD,IT IS THE NEW MODEL WHICH IS HEAPS BETTER THEN THE OLD ONE WHICH I HAD.

I FISH WITH A MATE OF MINE WHO HAS A LIEMACK AND AFTER A COUPLE OF DAYS HIS BATTERY IS ALLWAY FLAT,WE THROUGHT THE BATTERY MUST BE DEAD BUT IT WOULD SEEM NOT.THE ENGEL JUST GO AND GO.FOR POWER USAGE THEY ARE MILES AHEAD,IT IS THE NEW MODEL WHICH IS HEAPS BETTER THEN THE OLD ONE WHICH I HAD.

David,
I purchased a Liemack 50L Duel Temp fridge/freezer back in 1997.....
It runs on 2 x Delcor DT27 deep cycle batteries, they are wired in parallel and also backed up by a Solarex VLX80 solar panel mounted on the roofrack and separated from the vehicles (auto trans) starting battery by a Piranha DBE150S electronic isolater switch.

The duel battery system is fully self sufficient and monitored by the Liemack "cold logic" controll pannel, having enough power available at all times is no longer a problem and I don't have to remember to turn a "manual" isolater switch.

I go away fishing for weeks at a time and never have the hassle of no cold beer... I meet people with other 'popular' brands of fridges up north and they want to put their fish in my fridge 'cause it is colder... that say's something.

Any fridge will work in a cool to moderate climate, spend some time in the far north and you need reliable battery power for your fridge.