Land Rover Freelander

Submitted: Monday, Jul 04, 2005 at 12:42
ThreadID: 24417 Views:2915 Replies:6 FollowUps:6
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In relation to previous posts and for the benefit of prospective Freelander buyers, I would like to add that after lengthy investigation it seems the replacement engines supplied by Land Rover Australia to their dealerships at a cost of over $A5000.00 (to the vehicle owner) are exactly the same engines as fitted at the time of vehicle manufacture. This means that even repaired Freelanders will suffer the same fate at between 50000 and 100000 kms. I called Land Rover Australia and asked if the engines they were selling as replacements have had any modification to overcome the cylinder liner problem. The answer was no and the representative said there was no product recall in place and there is “no problem with this engine”. This is despite mounting documented evidence to the contrary, including Land Rover’s own technical bulletin 0036 issued 18 June 04 which was distributed to its dealerships worldwide. This trading practice is incredibly dishonest given that the problem is widely known. Land Rover is the only winner in this whole mess, as they get to sell even more of these engines to the unsuspecting public. If you are living the “Freelander nightmare” right now, I urge you to bring your story to the attention of the ACCC. Regards T. Edwards. (Please withhold my E-mail address).



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Reply By: Member - Banjo The First (SA) - Monday, Jul 04, 2005 at 13:31

Monday, Jul 04, 2005 at 13:31
Sound positively beastly.......is there an information bulletin of some sort somewhere on this ? .......I don't drive one, but the techno babble would make good reading.......
AnswerID: 118760

Reply By: garrycol - Monday, Jul 04, 2005 at 17:27

Monday, Jul 04, 2005 at 17:27
I might add that the problem applies only applies to the 1800 petrol engine and the problems also apply to other car makes such as Rover (remember Rover and Land Rover are different companies) that use the same engine.

The issues do not apply to to the diesels or V6 engines which are BMW sourced engines - oh and by the way has Nissan recalled all their diesel engines that blow up just out of warranty - I think not!

No car company recalls for poor design or failures etc - Recalls are only made if there is a safety related issue.

AnswerID: 118797

Reply By: netspyer5 - Monday, Jul 04, 2005 at 21:48

Monday, Jul 04, 2005 at 21:48
That's right. The flawed design in the cylinder liners applies to all 1.8 K Series derivatives regardless of the vehicle. This engine type has also been used in the KIA Carnival. I can't comment on the response from other manufacturers, however according to Land Rover Customer Care, Land Rover Australia continues to supply this engine without modification, to it's dealerships for replacement of failed engines. Having paid Land Rover Australia over $5000.00 for an new 1.8lt engine I would expect that the design fault would have been addressed. I would also expect to get either written or verbal assurance that I have NOT purchased exactly the same engine with potentially the same defect. Instead I was advised that the Technical department of Land Rover is not available to the public, and I would have to get that information from my local dealership. My local dealership said they have no advice from LR regarding any corrective modifications to the new engine and referred me back to LR. The LR representative's response was that there has been no modification, there is no product recall in place and there is “no problem with this engine”. Call me crazy, but from a consumer's point of view I find this trading practice is incredibly dishonest given that the problem is so widely known. If I have paid over $5000.00 for a replacement I need to know if the defect has been rectified. Those interested in this matter might care to read related posts at http://www.reviewcentre.com/reviews-all-824.html
AnswerID: 118854

Reply By: Gerhardp1 - Tuesday, Jul 05, 2005 at 00:52

Tuesday, Jul 05, 2005 at 00:52
The last Pommie creation that existed in my family was a 1958 Hillman Minx which required regular complete engine rebuilds, caused primarily by the elbow which fed oil from the pump to the rockers had a little hole in it, which allowed the oil to pump directly back down the nearest pushrod hole and starve the rockers of oil. The hole in the elbow also caused a lower oil pressure throughout the rest of the engine. Hence many burned valves, run bearings, worn out rings and cracked pistons.

However, the rest of the running gear was OK.

Sounds like the oil feed elbow design engineer still has a job - now at LR, and they have allowed him to design componets for the rest of the car as well........

So, since 1962 members of my family have owned numerous cars including the legendary Fiats (1100D, 1300, 1500, 124, 124s, 125), then Mazda, Torana, Jackaroo, Daihatsu.

The most soulful were the Fiats, the most reliable the Japanese models. None of the Japanese vehicles over the last 15 years have required anything other than a clutch, and Mum's Mazda 626 needed rear shockers at 145,000k.

The Jackaroo has 105,000k and hasn't even needed brake pads yet. I did change the shockers at 80,000k to allow the lifted coils, but they were still good, just not long enough.

Why do people buy Pommie bleep when they can buy Japanese? I'll never know.

I know that the Japanese vehicles have their moments - the Nissans with engines, Toyotas have flimsy diffs now, the Isuzus have had some transmission issues, and so on, but the wise buyer would still have to avoid the Pommie stuff or accept with pleasure the consequences....

My 2c worth
AnswerID: 118888

Follow Up By: garrycol - Tuesday, Jul 05, 2005 at 11:32

Tuesday, Jul 05, 2005 at 11:32
Heard the term - 'Japbleep' - it did come from somewhere.

I am surprised you even had the courage to to acknowledge you drive a Jack-off - the bar is not set very high with that one!!

I aploogise to you and others reading this for lowering myself to your level. I am sure the Jackaroo is a nice car. It is really not appropriate to slagg of at other peoples cars - we all buy thyem for our own reasons. All cars have their good points and their bad points - yes the Freelander has a dodgy 1800 engine that is supplied by another car maker - it was not a good choice - yes how Landrover has dealt with it is notgood - howver to be fair I don't see Toyota providing better front suspensions when the Landcruisers pack it in - I don't see Nissan providing diesel engines that have their defects fixed when they blow up.

Landrovers are no better or worse than japanese cars - Landrovers they are the design innovators in everyday 4wds and the japs tend to follow and maybe improve - it didn't take long for toyota to mimick landrover with coil springs and constant 4wd - in the late 80s - how long before the Disco 3 is copied.

No all vehicles - even jackaroos have their place and to slagg off on other peoples cars is counterproductive - as well all know better than others the deficiencies in vehicles we drive.

My 10c worth
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Follow Up By: Member - Captain (WA) - Tuesday, Jul 05, 2005 at 11:51

Tuesday, Jul 05, 2005 at 11:51
Hi Garrycol,

While not wanting to get embroiled in this debate, would just like to point out that Nissan DO replace blown GU 3.0TD engine for FREE, even after the warranty has expired and its the series III upgraded engine, not the same original series II engine. Even the wiring harnass has to be upgraded/replaced to accomodate new sensors on the new engine.

While its good that Nissan stand by their product and replace with the improved version, they should have recalled all the series II 3.0TD rather than wait for a failure. They did so in Europe, why not in Aus?

But to Nissan's credit, they seem to stand by their product more so than other makers (early GU's 5th gear replaced out of warranty for free - only if you ask though). But I'm sure other Nissan owners have horror stories about not being looked after, luck of the draw I guess.

Cheers

Captain
Its not what you drive, but how you drive it!
LC 200 + AOR Quantum

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Follow Up By: Gerhardp1 - Tuesday, Jul 05, 2005 at 12:51

Tuesday, Jul 05, 2005 at 12:51
Hi Garrycol, heard the term Garrycol bleep

Your comment that LandRover is some sort of innovator anf the Japs are merely copycats shows that you have no knowledge of Landrover, and haven't stooped to my level at all 'cause you weren't at it in the first place.

Landrover is a Jeep with a Pommy engine........

Here is part of an article you can read here http://www.csse.monash.edu.au/~lloyd/tildeLand-Rover/S1/1993.ajm.html

Land-Rover: The First Seven Years.
Anthony Maeder
22/10/1993
"The first steps towards building the Land-Rover were taken when three ex-WWII Willys Jeeps were acquired by the Rover Company and dissembled for inspection. Using some parts from these (including chassis and axles) together with a customised body and Rover power train, a prototype vehicle was constructed early in 1947. Following this experiment, the detailed design for the new vehicle was completed and 50 full sets of parts produced. From these, 48 pre-production units (of which at least 15 still exist) were built to be used for testing, evaluation, trial modifications and final adjustments to the design."
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Follow Up By: garrycol - Tuesday, Jul 05, 2005 at 13:08

Tuesday, Jul 05, 2005 at 13:08
Hi there Captain - I take it from your comments that you have had the unfortunate problem with the engines - if you did I am really glad for you that Nissan did the right thing for you. However from reading other people's posts on this forum and others this is not always the case - some peole have had to rebuild or replace engines at their own expense and Nissan didn't want to know. Just as Landrover in many circumstances has replaced the 1800 engines at their expense. I agree with the original post that Landrover should do the right thing as Nissan has done for you but in general the car companies do not.

As you said - I guess it is the luck of the draw - I don't really think any company is any better or worse than an other.

Gazz
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Follow Up By: Member - Captain (WA) - Tuesday, Jul 05, 2005 at 13:22

Tuesday, Jul 05, 2005 at 13:22
Hi garrycol,

Fortunately I do not have a problem with my 3.0TD, I have the series III (also the "good" 5th gear, it pays not to buy the first model). But I have keenly followed the series II debarcle as it takes time to show the new model engine actually fixes the faults of the older version.

What I have observed is that Nissan has paid for all engine replacements, even out of warranty, but ONLY after jumping through a few hoops (ie. not instantly offered). But at the end of the day they are a business out to make money and if they minimise warranty claims they make more money (but lose goodwill!!!).

You are right IMHO, no manufacturer has a notably better warranty service. But some do seem to have a better product in the first place, but no mechanical product is ever 100% reliable.

Cheers

Captain
Its not what you drive, but how you drive it!
LC 200 + AOR Quantum

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Reply By: netspyer5 - Tuesday, Jul 05, 2005 at 09:15

Tuesday, Jul 05, 2005 at 09:15
I could'nt agree more.
AnswerID: 118910

Follow Up By: netspyer5 - Friday, Jul 22, 2005 at 07:58

Friday, Jul 22, 2005 at 07:58
For the information of Freelander (1.8lt Petrol) victims in Australia: the ACCC is now collecting data on this matter. They have already received several complaints and agree that a pattern is emerging. They have agreed to contact Land Rover. I strongly encourage you to put your story in writing to the ACCC office in your state.

Addresses can be found at:
http://www.accc.gov.au/content/index.phtml/itemId/54229/fromItemId/3634

Also have a look at: http://freelander.webhop.net
and http://home.austarnet.com.au/edwardsonline/freelanderheadgasket

You can also join the Freelander Action Committee by contacting:
LRLandRover@aol.com

Terry.

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Reply By: Steve - Friday, Jul 22, 2005 at 08:38

Friday, Jul 22, 2005 at 08:38
looks like poor ole Gerdi has his own issues and agendas with Poms. Get over it mate.
AnswerID: 121560

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