What the?? Dealerspeak translation needed

Submitted: Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 20:58
ThreadID: 24583 Views:7184 Replies:14 FollowUps:17
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I"'ve just had an "&interesting experience"' with a Nissan dealer in Qld (yes I do know I am not alone!!!) and need to bounce some ideas off other experienced people before I attempt to resolve the issues. I need to confirm a few things about my 4WD and how things work before I go back to the dealer (and their head office, Nissan head office & Office of Fair Trading, if necessary).

This may go on for a bit, so you may want to fetch a drink of some sort! I had several coffees while I typed the story (in the shortest version that would make sense)

Background: Problem is NATS malfunction in 2000 Nissan Patrol 4.2TD ¡V some may recall some of it as I posted to this forum for advice about 2-3 weeks ago. Before deciding to attempt visit to dealer, I had my auto-electrician visit to fix brake controller and sort out earthing issue as advised in the helpful feedback. I printed out relevant info from forum to show him (being careful not to tell him how to "&suck eggs"', just ¡K. Here are some ideas from others who have my model of patrol and have had similar problems.) He located an earth wire with poor connections and fixed it, but the security indicator light continued to flash and the car continued to "&stutter"'. He could not locate an electrical cause for the problem, so I reluctantly arranged for a visit to the dealer, hoping that their dealer specific diagnostic tools could locate the fault.

Below is the info I provided (in writing) to the service manager when I dropped it off the afternoon before the service date. I also put a copy of this info on the driver seat, for the mechanic.

B'ground of Vehicle:
Patrol purchased 2nd hand early 2003, with cruise control and bullbar fitted - otherwise as factory- incl ABS and passenger air bag. Have since added electric trailer brake control (Tekonsha Voyager 9030) as patrol was purchased for towing horsefloat (2000kg loaded). Yes, the oil leak (injector pump) is on the "&to do"' list, as soon as I can drive again!

Owner: (I provided my contact details ¡V mobile and landline, with ans machine)

Quote: Required before you begin any major work. Ring me if you are not sure. I would like to know what you discover is the cause of the problem, what my options are and their costs.

There are several 'problems' - will describe each, in case they are related.

1. NATS malfunction? The security indicator light (on top of dash) last week started to flash intermittently and stay on for short periods when the car is driven. This is usually accompanied by a 'stuttering"'/intermittent loss of power. Much more pronounced at low speeds/lower gears. Only drove it home (15kms) after I discovered this problem.

If the indicator light had not lit up, I would have interpreted the loss of power as some interruption to fuel supply (water, air, 'junk'). Thought the prob may relate to 'chip' in the key, so took a short test drive with the reserve key - same prob. I have learned that NATS deals with security coded sound sys, remote central locking, engine immobiliser...so suspect other probs (outlined below) may be connected to this.

I am hoping that your diagnostic machines will be able to provide the info needed to get this sorted.
2. Remote Central locking - performance has been variable, sometimes not locking until I press button several times and aim at whatever?? magic spot. I was told that it just needed a new battery, but now I am wondering.

3. Sound system occasionally requesting a 'code"' though it still plays the radio and CDs. This started after I had the car battery replaced about 10 months ago. Where do I get this code from? No code was provided when I purchased the car from (another dealer) in Jan 2003. They sold it new, so would they still have the code?

I had an auto-electrician (named my usual auto elect, in the same town) fix a brake controller problem (mysterious brake lights that come on all on their own!) on Friday and he checked the car to try to eliminate auto-electrical issues as the source of the NATS problem. I"'m hoping that the diode he installed eliminates the brake light problem. I mention this in case it is related to the security indicator problem.

I have brought both keys in with the car in case any "&re-registering"' of keys is needed as part of the "&fixing"'.

(end of info given to dealer)

Now for the service¡K. (time to refill the drink???)

I was not filled with hope when I dropped off the Patrol, 2 keys and information sheet. I was the only customer there. The acting service manager pushed the information page away and handed me a blank piece of paper to write my name, address and contact details. I drew his attention to the info I had given and pointed out that all info (and more) was on that page. After I explained the nature of the problem, he asked why I was handing in 2 keys. I had to remind him that if he worked on NATS, he would likely have to re-register (or at least check the registration of the keys). I drew his attention to the request for a quote and then headed home.

The next day, I had heard nothing by 11.30, so called during my break to see if there was any news. I was told that they were just getting started on it and that he"'d contact me when they knew what the problem was.

3.45 ¡V still no call. Knowing mechanics start early and could soon go home, I call again. I"'m told that they"'re still working on it and the only thing they can find wrong is the injector pump, so it must be causing the NATS malfunction. I find the explanation hard to believe (thanks to the many hours I spent on the internet ¡V thanks guys!- researching my Patrol) so ask him to explain how they have come to this conclusion. He babbles on about how the immobilizer will kick in when there is a problem with the engine. He warns me that injector pumps are not cheap ¡V about $6000 installed. I am stunned, but recover quickly to point out that we are talking about a diesel engine whose basic design has not changed that much over more than 20 years, except to be "&turboed"'. (Its basic time tested design was one of the things I liked about it.) I add that it does not have a "&you beaut"' sophisticated, computerized, engine management system hooked into the immobilizer, so I find his explanation hard to accept.

Then with an amazing sense of timing (or perhaps a growing awareness that this woman owner has been underestimated!), he tells me that the mechanic has just walked in ¡V give him a minute to get the latest. Amazing change ¡K mechanic has found a resistance in one of the wires to ground, has fixed the problem and is about to test drive it. Gee, I wonder what happened to calling with a quote or explanation?? I figure that ii must have been a really cheap fix, so they did not bother.

4.03 ¡V service manager calls back ¡V all fixed. I"'m thinking that should not be too bad ¡V much better than the original discussion about $6000! I"'m thinking, some time to test with superior diagnostic tools, find, fix, test drive. For most places ¡K$100 should cover it. Dealers ¡K.. say $200? Then he tells me it should not be much over $600! I question the cost and ask to get full details explained when I arrive to collect Patrol. He says he"'ll try to get it under $600 for me!

4.45 ¡V NOT HAPPY JAN! Invoice shows Patrol as a 3.0l TD, auto ¡V it"'s manual 4.2TD. Still not happy about cost, I ask about cost of labour ($102/hr) and how long they spent on Patrol (says it was a big job ¡V 5.6 hrs). I ask for an explanation of what was done and he explains that Patrol had a NATS fault (I knew that!), there was some resistance in a wire (could not tell me where as they could not find the fault), so ran a new wire (could not tell me where). Mechanics had gone home. Words synonymous with "&ripped off"' start forming in my brain!

Description of work done as "&explained"' on invoice is reproduced below (complete with codes and interesting spelling) in case any of you can translate it. I really would like to know what you think it means. (I have emailed Principal Dealer requesting fully itemized invoice in plain English, as a first step)

RUNS POORLY AND NATS LIGHT FLASHING.
CHECKED CODES AND FOUND NATS FAULT. CHECKED WIRING FROM
IMMU UNIT TO CONTROL UMIT AND FOUND ALL OK. TESTED WIRE
FROM IMMU CSOLU FOUD HIGH RESISTANCE TO GROUND WIRE.
TRACED WIRES TO GROUND POINTS UNABLE TO LOCATE FAULT.
RAN NEW WIRE AS REQUIRED. AND RECHECKED RESISTANSE OK.
RECODED KEYS AND RELEARNED VALUES IN CONTROL UNIT.
REFITTED ALL REMOVED TRIMS AND ROAD TESTED ALL OK.

„« What are IMMU, CSOLU?
„« "(Ran new wire as required") = find it if you can? Or, temporary fix, as we could not find the fault?
„« Are they saying that they installed an earth/ground wire for $575
„« What trims needed to be removed? Is this why they changed my radio station, played the CD, did not reset the time and left the seat in position for someone nearly a foot taller than me?

Since I needed my car for work, I paid up, checked the location of their head office and advised that I would be back in touch. Someone suggested that I should just have taken the Patrol home; I should not have paid, since they did not quote as requested and the cost seems excessive. That sounds like fraud ¡V since they did do "&something"', though I have do have the option of making a formal complaint.

Later, after I got home and "&cooled off,"' I noticed that their invoice clearly showed work commenced on patrol at 12.45 ¡V not when I called at 11.30. So the $522.75 (before GST) listed as labour covers 3 hrs and 15 mins ¡V since service manager phoned just after 4 to advise that patrol was fixed. $160 per hour ¡V even allowing for overheads, I am definitely in the wrong job. There are no charges listed for parts or materials ¡V whole cost is labour - $575.05 with GST.

Am I being unreasonable in my expectations? Does this sound like "&dodgy practices"'? Once I find out what the translated invoice means and how much others think the repair really is worth, I will contact the Principal dealer asking about the lack of quote and seeking a resolution ¡V at least a refund of the extra hours of labour I paid for.

Congratulations! You have made it to the end of my story. The question is ¡K do you still have time to reply?
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Reply By: Patrolee - Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:05

Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:05
Patrolee here... don't know what some of those funny extra symbols are in my post above! They were meant to be apostrophes and quotation marks - or they were in my original version! Like you needed an extra challenge in a long post.? Once I join a 4WD club, I'll have somewhere else to source responses for big, big stories. Thanks, in advance, for your replies.
AnswerID: 119599

Follow Up By: BLUEBAG53 - Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 00:28

Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 00:28
Name the dealer, i have had problems in the past with Village at Redcliffe, with statements from the senior mechanic of "take it out the back and shoot it" after the car was tuned by them and came out worse than when it arrived. If they have stuffed up put the blade in, spread the word!
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Follow Up By: Patrolee - Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 14:46

Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 14:46
It may eventually come to that, but I want to give them a chance to rectify the problem first. So I have come to this forum to get some information:

1. need to know what the 'job description' REALLY means
2. need to know what is a REASONABLE price for the work done (when I find out what it is)

Then I can make contact with the principal dealer again and say what I want and why and what I am prepared to do if he is not prepared to come to the bargaining table.

I quite like the idea about the wheel cover expressing my views - and I have a good friend who is a sign writer! Could be interesting as this dealer is also a dealer for a few other makes of vehicle!
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Reply By: Member - John (Vic) - Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:13

Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:13
First question is, Whats all the odd symbols and and stuff in your post like the iV and the iY with the line through it etc etc etc ????????

In answer to your story, my view kick them back as hard as you can as a matter of principle, looks like a Bloody rip off and we need to stand our ground and make sure these ba$tards don't keep thinking that they can walk over us without being questioned about there practices.
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Follow Up By: Member - John (Vic) - Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:14

Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:14
Beat me to it in answer to the first question.
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Reply By: Member - Bill S (NSW) - Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:14

Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:14
All I can say if you bought a TOYOTA this would not have occured.

Sorry mate BILL
AnswerID: 119601

Follow Up By: Member - John (Vic) - Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:15

Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:15
Don't bet on it, dealers are dealers and will all have a go at you given the opportunity.
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Follow Up By: Glenno - Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:19

Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:19
At least with Toyota they tell you before hand they are going to ream you, so at least you have a few hours to sit at work and contemplate using the vaseline before going back and picking up the car.

You get reamed either way with dealers, its all about the expectation setting, and Nissan seem to do a really bad job of it.
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Follow Up By: Member - Davoe (Widgiemooltha) - Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:40

Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:40
If it was the toyota dealership they would have reamed you AND not performed the work!!. How do you fit Hilux parts into a camry well I dunno but toyota will charge for doing it.
Seriosly though it isnt just the dealers but they are the worst. Basic problem is they pay bottom dollar for mechanics. Well who in their right mind is going to play with cruisers and listen to customers whinge if they get a grease stain on it for 600 bucks a week when they can earn double that fixing mining tojos with no customer service hassels
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Follow Up By: garrycol - Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:54

Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:54
Toyotas obviously drive on water and the sun shines out of their exhaust pipes.

Wouldn't have happened if it was a toyota - oh pleeeeeaaaassseee

What a lot of w^%*&k
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Follow Up By: Patrolee - Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:57

Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:57
When I went 4WD shopping, I was looking for a Nissan OR Landcruiser and had no preference at all on make. I was more interested in finding something that could comfortably tow my loaded horsefloat (2000kgs) and represented value for money. I spent 6 months researching and getting a feel for the market and decided that my needs would best be served with a diesel 4.2 litre turbo diesel or similar, so looked at Patrols and cruisers.

When I went shopping the best deal came in the form of a Patrol and I have had no problems with it in the 2 1/2 years I have owned it - but then I do not usually have to take it to a dealer. I use a mechanic who only works on 4WDs and has a Patrol TD too. Unfortunately this prob was in the Nissan Anti Theft System (NATS), so I thought it should go to dealer. For me the prob is in the dealers definition of 'fair service'

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Follow Up By: peteC - Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 13:37

Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 13:37
garrycol sounds like a landrover owner, how's his dealer ????????
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Reply By: Glenno - Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:16

Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 21:16
All I can say is, if this website is a cross section of the Nissan owner community, the Nissan dealers do a sterling job of ensuring the Nissan name is mud.

By the way what is the NATS issue?
AnswerID: 119602

Follow Up By: Patrolee - Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 22:06

Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 22:06
NATS is the Nissan Anti-Theft System - involves immobiliser, sound sys and central locking. When it is not working properly, a light on the top of the dash flashes WHILE you drive, not just when car is locked, off or on ACC. In my case the immobiliser also kept cutting in - so I was kanga-hopping down the road (long time since I was that kind of learner driver & hard to hide a hopping Patrol!)
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Reply By: Kazza055 - Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 22:30

Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 22:30
Patrolee - one of the small issues I see with the posting is the fact that you have the Tekonsha Voyager fitted. This unit has a well documented fault which will activate the break lights, cancel the cruise control etc, Tekonsha recognise they have a problem and usually most suppliers of their products will replace it with the Prodigy model for just the difference in price - about $50.00

Do a search thru the archives on the Voyager and you will find it appears about every three months. I am amazed that your auto sparky was not aware of it nether wise the Nissan Dealer.

Bob Cheers
AnswerID: 119608

Reply By: muzzgit (WA) - Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 22:47

Saturday, Jul 09, 2005 at 22:47
DITTO. My auto sparkie has agreed to replace my brake controler, as the brake lights come on for no reason, especially in winter.

Nissan Service..... AS IF !!!!
AnswerID: 119609

Reply By: Member -Dodger - Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 00:32

Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 00:32
Take your story to consumer affairs and your local motoring organisation if you belong and see what they can or cannot do.
Seems like your dealer has no interest in customer care.
I used to have a handle on life, but it broke.

Cheers Dodg.

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AnswerID: 119619

Follow Up By: Patrolee - Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 15:25

Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 15:25
Good idea - will add RACQ (I am a member) to my list of other places to contact if the dealer does not want to deal. Already have their head office, Nissan head office and Office of Fair Trading on that list.

One of the really disappointing things is that I would like to have a dealer nearby that I can trust in case I do need parts and Nissan specific service in the future. Fortunately my regular mechanic is great to work with, but as he is a 4WD enthuiast and owns an accessories shop, he keeps trying to convince me to put all those extra 'decorations' on my vehicle! I tell him that my horse does not care what the tow vehicle looks like - just tow me steady!

The next closest dealerlost my vote when I was initially shopping for a new Navara and I phoned to ask if I could come over on the weekend for a test drive - Sure! just as for ____. Arrived at the appointed time (after 40 minute drive) to be told that they did not have one avail for test drive. Explained that they only had new ones on site and if too many people got to drive them they would not be new! Salesman said he hoped I understood. I said "absolutely! You would prefer that I go elsewhere to buy my new car" and turned and walked off. He chased me down the drive and said he could sort something out straight away. My younger brother was with me, knows me well and was barely containing his amusement. The sales man emerged quickly with keys and handed them to my brother to do the testdrive! He was so flustered he did not check anyone's licence or name details, before eventually handing the keys to me - the prospective buyer. I laugh about that encounter especially after I included it in an article I had published about buying a towing vehicle - unfortunately I could not name the dealer, but from time to time I am tempted to send them a copy with the incident highlighted!
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Reply By: J.T. - Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 00:59

Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 00:59
Having worked in a dealership for a while(nissan)the story sounds typical of bulls!!t made by servicly advisers to reach a budget and hefty bonus.(Allegedly)
AnswerID: 119624

Reply By: uncle - Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 06:24

Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 06:24
I remember an incident that happened here in the Shoalhaven about 8 years ago,dont know the full story but a guy was seen on a daily basis driving his
NEW Patrol wagon around town with the words "I'll never buy another Nissan From .........Dealer again" Professionally sign written on the spare wheel cover.I think the problem was very promptly resolved,as it wasn't long and the sign writing was off. Just a thought.Ps I have nothing against Nissans Either!Cheers
AnswerID: 119631

Follow Up By: Patrolee - Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 14:53

Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 14:53
An interesting thought - especially since I have a friend who is a sign writer! I will however refrain until I have exhaused all other avenues. I want my money back - only some of it as the problem with the NATs has gone away (fixed??). I want answers - in English! I want them to think about cleaning up business practices.

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Reply By: Bob of KAOS - Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 06:28

Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 06:28
Patrolee

I think you have a very strong case for seeking redress in the small claims tribunal. I suspect they are attempting to exploit the fact that you are female, and they consistently get away with it.
AnswerID: 119632

Follow Up By: viz - Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 20:22

Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 20:22
Drives my missus nuts when she gets treated that way - being female it is automatically assumed that she does not know a thing about engines. However there are exceptions - she had Little Willy (name care of Harold Scruby's latest outburst ;) at the automatic man in Narrabeen, who apart from being a great mechanic explained carefully what he had done and why. The boss lady had no trouble working out what were the problems and why the bill was $480 - and was happy with it. And if she is happy, I am happy. (And the auto box was 300% better than what it had been).

Find another mechanic. What most people don't realise is that warranty work - or any work for that matter can be done by *any* mechanic - it does not have to be done by a dealership. Find a good mechanic and stay with them...

/viz

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FollowupID: 374763

Reply By: Member - Trevor R (QLD) - Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 12:07

Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 12:07
Patrolee,

Everyone seems to agree that you have been shafted, but no-one has answered your question re abbreviations so I'll give it a go ?? but not sure if my thoughts are correct so maybe someone else can also verify.
"CHECKED WIRING FROM
IMMU UNIT TO CONTROL UMIT AND FOUND ALL OK. TESTED WIRE
FROM IMMU CSOLU FOUD HIGH RESISTANCE TO GROUND WIRE"

I think maybe it should read -- Checked wiring from immobiliser unit to control unit and found all OK. Tested wire from immobiliser solenoid, found high resistance to ground wire.

This is just my thoughts that they may have made a few typo's and abbreviated a few words. As I said I would verify this with someone with more technical knowledge than me, but there's my effort.
Either way I would still talk to dealer principal or service manager and try to resolve that exhorbanant hourly rate and time variance for labour, good luck I think you will need it.
Final verdict, is the car running better? if so maybe don't waste too much time on this matter as you may be better concentrating on the positives rather than the negatives. Negative energy will tire you out real quick, I found this out when trying to recoup lost money from Nissan due to my vehicle not being able to do the towing job I brought it for ( overheating constantly ). In the end I figured it better to concentrate on fixing the problem at hand.
Good luck and keep us informed of your results.
Regards Trevor.
AnswerID: 119638

Follow Up By: Exploder - Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 14:24

Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 14:24
Trevor I think your interpretation of the code is right.

Patrolee this will get you really steamed, they probably had a 3ed or possibly 4th year apprentice doing the work on you car and he would have been earning a whopping 11.05 up to 16.50per Hour. For 3/12 Hrs work call it $58 Labour, The workshop chargers and copper in the grounding wire must be very expensive and when they did the test drive you can bet they thrashed thebleepout of it.

I would ring up another Nissan dealer and get a price on the same Job RE: Running new NATS grounding wires on 4.2 TD patrol. Then you can cancel out the other cost’s to find out where you got washed. IE: Running diagnostic check $60 (max) checking NATS wires for correct resistance 35 second’s Labour 1/2 a Cent.

When I got my Spot Light’s wired up it cost $160 and I supplied the wiring harness?
When I was working in Kalgoorlie me and another bloke brought some Philips High lumina halogen Globes he just happed to pull up in the Land cruiser with KCGM printed down the side and was wearing his work gear and was charged $135 for them, Then I went in on Saturday morning in casuals and payed $75 for the same product.

The lesion is most people are out to screw you; but you just have to be able to prove it.

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FollowupID: 374727

Follow Up By: Patrolee - Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 15:24

Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 15:24
Thanks exploder. That is useful info. I will call another dealer and get a quote for that work - perhaps the dealer I bought the car from. I did not take it back there as the car was travelling too roughly to chance an hour driving through traffic etc. Would also have been stranded a long way from home.

I think I have a fair chance of proving enough 'misdeads' for them to want to negotiate. And my friends give me a serve for my ' research ethic' and my habit of writing things down to give the various 'fixers' I hire some idea about the 'symptoms' the fridge, car, mower, horse or whatever is exhibiting!
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FollowupID: 374735

Follow Up By: Patrolee - Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 15:34

Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 15:34
Trevor, thanks for your response. Car is running well again - for which I am pleased. I have not lost sleep over this issue, but have a bad habit of wanting to help people learn from the 'silly mistakes' they make especially when they involve me (and my wallet!).

I can do my bit to help some service providers learn that they do not always pick their targets well, so perhaps they should be honest to all. (Duck!! Flying pigs overhead....) This blonde 40ish woman BITES BACK!!! and she tells her friends and they tell theirs and .......
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FollowupID: 374737

Follow Up By: Member - Trevor R (QLD) - Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 21:30

Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 21:30
Patrolee,

Good on you for doing your homework and for biting back, I also bit back at nissan with regards to my vehicle and have been instrumental in swaying at least three customers away from nissan due to their p!$$ poor back up when it comes to warranty claims. Fair enough if you get problems with a product you buy, so long as the seller is prepared to help fix it or put it right, I am happy ( possibly too soft ? ).
As I said good luck with your claim.

Trevor
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FollowupID: 374777

Reply By: 120scruiser - Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 15:41

Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 15:41
The problem with dealer ships is that the service managers don't have anything to do with the mechanics out the back so they know nothing about your car.
Nissan seem to be extra non service orientated.
Our local dealer, far Western Sydney is just as bad as this clown.
Yes they do only have a majority of apprentice's but on the other hand they have access to all the latest diagnostic tools for their own models. If that fails they also have access to intranet service's within their organisation.
They should be able to fix model specific problems way quicker than general repairs who don't get access to specifications and fault codes until at least 5 years after the models have been released.
Yes unfair as a phone call is only 24c and instills customer/dealer relations. Pathetic.
Ditch them.
Sounds like the prob is more than likely found in the brake unit.
One thing though, don't blame the car for the s*@!house dealer service. And I don't drive a Nissan.
AnswerID: 119644

Reply By: Max - Sydney - Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 16:57

Sunday, Jul 10, 2005 at 16:57
Patrollee

Three thoughts occur reading through the posts,

1. They really bore it up women, even worse than blokes. My wife, like you, is quite capable of giving them a hard time when they do, but its rough to have to.
2. You probably have a case to go and have a quiet chat about a refund from your auto electrician, as he was chasing a loose earth (which is plain english for " HIGH RESISTANCE TO GROUND WIRE")
3. I'd have someone check out the Tekonsha controller problem too. Might be relevant.

Good luck
Max

AnswerID: 119655

Reply By: angler - Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 21:01

Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 21:01
My daughter had a RAV4 and had a quite a few peoblems with various bits on the car. Every time she went in with a problem they assured her it was probably operator error. She ended up giving them quite a hard time about a couple of problems and finally had them fixed. During one of her visits to the dealer she happened to read parts of the paperwork whilst the service adviser was out of the room and printed in large letters at the top of her history file was "Note: Problem customer".
To say that started her up is quite an understatement. They would all try and leave the room whenever she drove up. She DID get good service after that. The RAV lasted for about 150,000 K's and was still in excellent condition when she sold it.
AnswerID: 120230

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