New Hilux test drive offroad - Bullbar don't get !

Submitted: Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 20:50
ThreadID: 24700 Views:7923 Replies:12 FollowUps:37
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I test drove the works 05 Hilux SR diesel manual offroad today - handles great on road; small wheels & low ground clearance (about same ground clearance as Prado I reckon from the amount of time it scrapped) were a disappointment campared to old. Inside lots of plastic but it was nice & comfortable. The BULLBAR makes it a dozer - it sticks out far & low down - so don't buy the standard Toyota one wait for TJM or ARB. The Toyota one has big exposed areas for the radiator etc - a stick will easily get up under the bullbar & damge that area - go have a look for yourself. Needs bigger wheels & a 40mm lift atleast.
Cheers Jeff
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Reply By: tessa_51 - Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 21:02

Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 21:02
Beddo
IMHO the truck's a rip-off - price has gone uppppp and quality has gone downnnnnn. Looks like another example of us getting something thats designed for the US market.
Tessa
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Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 21:07

Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 21:07
isnt price up and quality down typical of all now though?

Agree on the US thing though.. I think its all part of a bigger plan thats been in place for 15 yrs to hand Aussie over to bush.. surely howards nose is far enough up bushs bush to be 1 person.
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Follow Up By: Alex H - Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 21:21

Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 21:21
thats why we call him Bonsai - 'cos he's a little bush
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Follow Up By: gramps - Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 21:29

Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 21:29
Alex H,

:-) like that one LOL
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Reply By: TerraFirma - Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 21:32

Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 21:32
Jeez for something that cops some criticism in these forums the new Lux is walking out the door. I agree on the wheels, thats why I'm going with 17", that will give the thing a 5-6" lift also. Lots of plastic, get used to it, find me a ute without it..? I don't believe the quality has gone down, I think the car is fine. It seems a lot of people just don't like new models, nor do they like change.! So what else do you buy..? Find me a better rig for the money, I don't think so.
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Follow Up By: Member - Smocky (NSW) - Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 21:56

Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 21:56
Value is in the eye of the beholder, but I reckon $37,000 for a Navara with a bullbar (the Nissan one looks pretty good) and $1,000 free fuel is a cracking deal.

Standard SR5 4X4 is around $50,000 + onroads + extras. There's not THAT much between them I don't think.

Also, have you seen the reviews? Saying how good it is off road? Yet people who drive them, first thing they say is "great on the road, better than the old one, but they've sacrificed off road for it".

As for quality, time will tell whether moving production from Japan to Thailand will matter. Probably not, but time will tell.

I think the SR5 looks OK, but the lower spec'd ones are a bit iffy. Mind you, I reckon anyone who has one probably LOVES it. They look much nicer inside.

Cheers,

Smocky.
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Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 22:23

Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 22:23
>> thats why I'm going with 17", that will give the thing a 5-6" lift also

how does bigger rims give you 5inch of lift??
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Follow Up By: Member - Norm C (QLD) - Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 22:41

Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 22:41
Especially since the rims are only 2inches bigger. That is a 1 inch lift, assuming tyre profile remains the same. But tyre profile will have to be smaller, I would think, or you will need a body lift to fit them under the truck.
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Follow Up By: GaryInOz (Vic) - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 01:57

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 01:57
$50k or so is a new GU ute............

Tell me which is stronger.
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Follow Up By: Member - Smocky (NSW) - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 08:01

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 08:01
Good point Gary, although that isn't a dual cab :)
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Follow Up By: Utemad - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 09:20

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 09:20
"Also, have you seen the reviews? Saying how good it is off road? Yet people who drive them, first thing they say is "great on the road, better than the old one, but they've sacrificed off road for it". "

I have only looked at one review that was in 4x4 Australia. I was quite surprised when in their sum up they said that the Hilux isn't what it used to be. They said that if you want a capable bush ute to go and buy a Navara or Rodeo!
Toyota mustn't have paid them their dues this time LOL
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Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 09:30

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 09:30
Gary: the Kia is stronger :P

Ute: I agree, I think by lookin at it, it doesnt even give the appearance of being anything like offroad capability the older models.
But then again, I await to see how Darrens (go_offroad) turns out....
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Reply By: Rosco - Bris. - Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 22:42

Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 22:42
Never ceases to amaze me how some ppls will buy something knowing full well it won't do the job it's supposed to ... and then happily spend a motza more trying to achieve that which wasn't there in the first place.

Cheeezzz
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Follow Up By: Member - Davoe (Widgiemooltha) - Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 23:05

Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 23:05
I KNEW IT!! Who else would buy a landie....... Its les Hiddens!!
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Follow Up By: Rosco - Bris. - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 08:37

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 08:37
ROFLMAO
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Reply By: Member - Bradley- Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 23:21

Wednesday, Jul 13, 2005 at 23:21
yeah next door had a mate with a new sr5 tricked up visit the other day, had some big chrome 'homie' rims on it, but bugger me, still got drum brakes on the back. For the price i'd expect a bit more.
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Follow Up By: TUFF LUX - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 11:51

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 11:51
It's still a comercial vehicle mate. You can put a tonne in the back and over two in the trailer... How many trucks do you see with disc brakes on the back? Discs can't handle the heat generated by those loads at a reasonable price/size. Even 'homie' rims won't make it a sports car.
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Follow Up By: Utemad - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 15:29

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 15:29
F250s are a 1 tonne ute and they have disc brakes all round. They weigh in at 3.3 tonne empty in the dual cab too. Although there is a sizeable price difference.

However as for discs not being able to handle the heat with those loads, how is it that the front discs which do most of the braking can handle it but they couldn't on the rear?
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Follow Up By: Member - Bradley- Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 16:50

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 16:50
No its not a commercial ute , its now an action utility vehicle or some similar marketing dribble.

What is the combined vehicle weight rated at ?
i suppose with a ton in the tray it needs 2 in a trailer to even out the chassis bending (just ask eric!!)

Utemad - spot on with the discs , if disc brakes wern't superior in all aspects , then why are all the new trucks using them ?

Drum brakes belong back in the 70's

I couldnt help but laugh when we got a new 2wd hilux in 96, gee whiz, drum brakes AND a carby to boot :-))

i could expect drums on the povo pack but not on the you beaut sr5 model.
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Reply By: TASPAJ - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 08:55

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 08:55
It won't take long for the boys to start fitting raised coils on the front and lifting the rear and the biggest wheels and tyres you can fit on the thing. once you have done that i'm sure they would have enough clearance off road. The new engines sould cope ok with the bigger wheels.
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Follow Up By: GaryInOz (Vic) - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 19:07

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 19:07
It'll be the front diffs that give up, Toyota has never been one for overengineering in that area
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Reply By: Griddo - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 09:31

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 09:31
Just a quick one for all new hilux owners

Have blown up a CV boot already. Don't know how, the car was only driving along some internal minesite roads (gravel/sand) 8500km on the clock

Anyway Toyota are giving me about 6-8 week replacement time for CV boot, ex japan

They are currently trying after market ones to see if possible to fit. Alo trying prado types

I will keep you updated to see the outcomes

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Follow Up By: Member - Jeff M (WA) - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 11:46

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 11:46
Griddo, I hope they replace the CV for you too as driving it around with a split boot will permantally damage it very quickly! If they can't supply you the boot, they will have to supply you the CV to boot! (if you get what I mean! LOL)
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Follow Up By: Griddo - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 12:40

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 12:40
Jeff

The prado one fitted

Toyota where haveing a bit of a nervous time as i wanted them to lend me a vehicle for 6-8 weeks while they got the new cv boot in. Giving a demo vehicle to a mining company for that time makes them look really second hand really quickly

But all resolved
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Follow Up By: Member - Matt Mu (Perth-WA) - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 14:13

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 14:13
For a quick and more permanent fix, you could look at Mecatech boots. Supposed to be a new compound that is extreamely more durable than conventional rubber. They are soo stretchy that there is no dissasembly of the CV!! They can stretch the small end of the boot over the large end!!!

Have a look at the Website Mecatech
I spoke to the Aust dist and he was very informative but havent needed to buy any yet, email mecatech@bigpond.com. I think they were selling for around $30 a boot!

Might tie you over and maybe even fix you problem permanently, just depends if Toyota dont mind you fitting an arftermarket boot (warranty)!

Matt.
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Follow Up By: Griddo - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 14:19

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 14:19
Matt

Thanks for the info but Toyota have fixed the problem, used a prado boot.

Toyota where suggesting using an aftermarket boot as a permanet fix, if they could get one to fit

Doesn't really matter anymore as only have until end of next week and then i am going to a full time office position with another company. No more bashing 4by's, 8x8 amphibious buggies and 4x4 motor bikes around the country side

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Follow Up By: Member - Matt Mu (Perth-WA) - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 15:03

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 15:03
Buggar (pardon the pun) sounds like youu have been demoted Griddo, sorry to hear that you wont be able to bash 4bys, 8x8 amphib buggies or quads around the country!!!!

Glad they got it sorted on the Lux, I thought the Lux was a prado 120(suspension, running gear) as far as that is concerned, guess it just needed someone to try and confirm it!

Just as a side note, Im pretty sure the Mecatch boots only come in the two sizes needed, small for passenger cars and large for 4bys!

Goodluck with the new position!

Matt.
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Reply By: TerraFirma - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 12:16

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 12:16
Yeah drum brakes on the back , same with Navara, not sure why that is. Both vehicles brake very well. I think both the Navara and the new Lux are great vehicles. Sure the Lux is dearer but the equipment levels are a little higher and you can't get an Auto in the Diesel Navara, something that many tradesmen are buying the LUX for. The Common rail diesel engine in the Lux is a gutsier, more refined, more ecomomical diesel than the Navara. For 4WD stuff you'd modify both vehicles to suit.

As for the wheels adding 17" with 275 x 65 x 17 will increase the circumference of the wheels/tyres 5" over the standard arrangement, thus giving the vehicle a lift also. It will also put the speedo out 6.91% making it read 93.4Kmh instead of 100 but this can be adapted.
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Follow Up By: Member - Norm C (QLD) - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 12:41

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 12:41
One thing with drums. You get a better hand brake hold. Helpful when stuck on the side of that cliff!!
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Follow Up By: Rosco - Bris. - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 13:39

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 13:39
Disagree Norm

Give me a transmission hand brake anyday.

And Terra .. 5" increase over std would send the authorities and insurance companies apoplectic.

Cheers
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Follow Up By: Member - Matt Mu (Perth-WA) - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 14:23

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 14:23
Rosco! What type of brake do you think is hanging off the back of your transmission......its a DRUM brake!! Im pretty sure that is what Norm was saying..a drum brake is more effective over a disc brake when used as a parkbrake!!

Nothin like loading up all your UJs everytime you need to use your handbrake and its great when that pi$$y little bit of felt in the rear output lets all you transmission oil leak out into your hanbrake shoes!!

Yeah....love that Rover parkbrake! hahahahahahaha

Work on them every day, at least they keep my employed!

Matt.
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Follow Up By: Rosco - Bris. - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 14:32

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 14:32
G'day Matt

On re-reading Norm's missive I would have thought it obvious he was referring to the rear drums for the h/brake.

As for the rear seal leting go, I must be dead lucky ... never happened to me in 4 vehicles.

Cheers
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Follow Up By: Member - Matt Mu (Perth-WA) - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 14:56

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 14:56
Yep you are right on...he is referring to a rear drum brake, I just assumed you must know that the hanbrake YOU were referring to IS a DRUM brake!!

You are telling him how great your transmission brake is and it is fundamentally the same brake!!

Now Rosco, dont get me wrong and get all defensive, I dont mind rovers, they make great tractors-you-can-drive-into-the-village.

hahha

Matt.
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Follow Up By: Rosco - Bris. - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 15:22

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 15:22
Defensive ... me ... never.

Matt me old son. One thing you should have learned by now is we Landy drivers have no reason to be plauged with doubt or self conciousness about the decisions we make in life.

HAHAHAHAHA

On the other hand ... when it comes to our cobbers from the other side of the fence. I place some faith in the sage words of a wise man by the name of Jules Henri Poincare .......................

"To doubt everything, or to believe everything
Are two equally convenient solutions ....
Both dispense with the necessity of reflection"

Cheers cobber ..... :o)


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Follow Up By: Member - Matt Mu (Perth-WA) - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 16:20

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 16:20
Now Rosco, me old man. Has there ever been a group in the history of the 4wd that could be more defensive or protective of the descision in life to own/drive a Landrover???

For all those that have ever waged into the 'Toyota/ Nissan" debate, it pales into insignificance the second you denounce a Landrover!

Never has there been the ability to provoke such hearty, healthy yet totally biased debate from such a vocal minority, Harold Scruby eat your heart out!

Actually, maybe that is where he gets the strength to wage his fruitless war on 4wds, from the blind dedication and absolute passion of all Landrover owners. Who could not admire them?

So alas, my good man, I am yet to understand why a group who is without " reason to be plauged with doubt or self conciousness about the decisions we(they) make in life" would be so quick to rush to their defence?

Ahh a quaint little bunch, life would be less without them!
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Follow Up By: Rosco - Bris. - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 16:29

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 16:29
Well said old mate ... and whilst I may not agree, I'll defend to the death your right to speak ...... hmmm, think I've heard that one somewhere before ..... must have been one of my Landie cobbers.

Who else would be so forgiving of all you ... mere mortals.

;-]
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Follow Up By: Member - Matt Mu (Perth-WA) - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 16:43

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 16:43
Touche
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Follow Up By: Member - Davoe (Widgiemooltha) - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 21:13

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 21:13
After driving nothing but cruisers for 4 years i am well qualified to tell youse all Handbrakes are for woosies!!
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Follow Up By: Rosco - Bris. - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 21:36

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 21:36
And here gentlemen, we have an excellent example of that unusual species of which we speak.

;-)
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Reply By: TerraFirma - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 14:02

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 14:02
I could be getting circumference confused witth Overall Diameter. Here is a simple run down on changing from the Hilux 15" wheels to 17" with 2 different tyre combo's.

Hilux 15" Wheel & Tyre Overall Diameter Circumference
Standard 29.05" 91.26"
17" with 265x65x17 30.56" 96.00"
17" with 275x65x17 31.07" 97.60"

So if you go by Overall diameter it changes by up to 2".!
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Follow Up By: Member - Matt Mu (Perth-WA) - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 15:14

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 15:14
You are spot on Terra, I just dont think anyone is used to hearing the rolling dia used to compare tyres. Usually width, profile and dia tend to be more commonly used when desribing a tyre.
eg is you someone you increased the tyre 2" they would jump to width or dia (29", 31", 33", 35" etc) but when someone earlier mentioned 5" (circumference)it threw a few!
Matt.
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Follow Up By: Member - Smocky (NSW) - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 21:09

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 21:09
That's a lot of extra cash on a +$50k truck to get some ground clearance.

Not to mention anything above 15% is illegal in NSW.

I think in a few months, the pros and cons of the Hilux will be known and the enthusiasts will have worked out how to trick them up.

If I remember the topic of this thread, it was something about which ute to buy.
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Follow Up By: Member - Smocky (NSW) - Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 21:10

Thursday, Jul 14, 2005 at 21:10
Oops, better make that "Hilux off road" :)

Still, the point is that the old Hilux was great off road stock standard. This new one is substantially less capable as standard I think is what people are saying.

Cheers,

Smocky.
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Reply By: Beddo - Friday, Jul 15, 2005 at 18:47

Friday, Jul 15, 2005 at 18:47
Went into Toyota and mentioned the bullbar issue & they said that they have already had a new hilux in with a stick straight into the radiator - no shielding whatsoever.
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Reply By: hound - Sunday, Jul 17, 2005 at 16:26

Sunday, Jul 17, 2005 at 16:26
Have a new lux, with arb bar & winch, 60mm lift and mud tyres. The new lux is far better offroad than the model it replaces.
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Follow Up By: Member - Norm C (QLD) - Sunday, Jul 17, 2005 at 19:07

Sunday, Jul 17, 2005 at 19:07
Hound. I'm interested in what you have done. How did you get the 60mm lift? How much is chassis and how much body? All the suspension experts tell me I will only get 30 to 40mm max lift in the chassis. Also, ARB keeps telling me their bullbar isn't available yet. Probably early August. Which shop did yours come from?
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Follow Up By: Beddo - Monday, Jul 18, 2005 at 08:41

Monday, Jul 18, 2005 at 08:41
Way to go Hound, that's what it needs, would be great then. The ARB bar what is its approach angle like ? The Toyota bullbar stuck out something cronic out the front & acted as a dozer blade & also had no protection underneath from stick coming up from underneath etc. I thought Toyota would have come up with a centre diff lock like the Prado's & KZN185 Surfs - the SR I drove did not. Would love to see a picture of the bullbar in place.
Cheers Jeff
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Reply By: peteC - Sunday, Jul 17, 2005 at 22:35

Sunday, Jul 17, 2005 at 22:35
Cant believe you people, saying bad things about a Toyota. Thought they were the best ute ever made and ( like all Toyoyos ) dont have problems
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Reply By: hound - Monday, Jul 18, 2005 at 11:40

Monday, Jul 18, 2005 at 11:40
ARB now has a picture on the web site of the new hilux bar. Go to products, protection equipment, bull bars, by vehicle and then hilux.
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