Swipes, surveys and statistics

Agree entirely Lyn. Well put.

Howdy Lyn,
Well said and as far as I'm concerned the journo's can suck on my personal exhaust pipe.

I just surveyed myself and the stats from that survey indicate that I'm a good fairlylooking rooster, in his 30's, married 2 kids, with another on the way, who hates shopping, is not racist, is mildly homophobic, loves to get outdoors and go camping, fishing and generally go exploring. I choose a 4wd because Hyundai excels etc dont accomodate my family, nor do they go too well off the road and I also dont like them much. My favourite places and the best holidays I ever had were mostly in places not accessible by conventional 2wd vehicles. I grew up on tea and coffee plantations in the New Guinea Highlands and the only vehicles I ever knew were old cruiser utes. So this lifestyle is in my blood, and so deeply entrenched it wont ever change, regardless of the crap they throw up.

In all honesty, after I stop being annoyed, I actully feel sorry for these people. They live in a cocoon and really have no idea what they are missing out on. But then I'm also glad, because maybe, if they all knew how good it was, and all got out there too, well...It just wouldnt be quite the same now would it. I

Hi Lyn,

I agree about statistics. It's all in the interpretation. That's how the lies start.

Looking at the recent rubbish, you'll notice that they ONLY surveyed people who live in the city. Having done a mathematics degree at uni, I've learned to loathe statistics with a passion. The main problem I see is that you can take any statistical value you like and use it to prove your case.

For example:
A) People who own 4WD's are 400% more likely to use a mobile phone whilst driving

OR

B) People who own 4WD's are 600% more likely to OWN a mobile phone.

Interesting isn't it how they use whatever results they get to prove what they want. Politicians having been doing it for decades.

Take care,

Jason.

Hi Lyn,
Couldn't agree with you more, I'm late 30's, three kids, 50klm form nearest town, we do 60klm per day for the kids to catch school bus, roads are crappy and ungraded all the time, would knock a sedan out of action quick smart, I also don't care what others think of me because i drive a 4wd, ours is a necessity, our girls have also seen some wonderful parts of this country in the past 4-5 years and hope to see more in the future, these wally's need to take a hike and get on with real life, anyway my 2cents worth. Cheers Michele

Having read the press release two things really concern me:

firstly, publication of the press release or slabs of it without question, demonstrates very casual journalism and contempt for their viewers/readers; and

secondly, publication of emotionally charged, misleading stuff like that is how the seeds of prejudice and hatred are sown by the media. The media doesn't just report news it MAKES news.

The media is largely self-regulating and in a democracy that is a good thing, but this privelege should not be abused. Any journalist worthy of his/her salt would immediately recognise the Institute's stuff as very poorly researched crap disguising a wheelbarrow. The story, if any, was in how various interest groups seek to gain use of the media for their own ends.

I regard lazy journalists as hacks, worthy of contempt. They, their editors and the media barons who profit from this style of journalism really suck.

Here! Here!

Well said Lyn. I couldn't agree more.

I don't feel the the need to justify, or even document, my lifestyle choices to anyone. As long as my activities are sanctioned by law and I abide by my own system of principles governing morality and acceptable conduct I will die a happy man.

ev700 has summed up the quality of journalism which we has been discussed at length on this and other forums during the last couple of days, perfectly.

I would humbly suggest rather than wallowing in self-pity, self-doubt and anger that we get out and enjoy the freedom that a well sorted 4WD allows and live our lives in the manner which each of us, as individuals, sees fit, and judge others as we would want them to judge us. As I said to a close mate yesterday "What goes around, comes around".

Conversely, let the green eyed monsters and ignorant agitators go about their business and try to understand that there are two underlying causes for their actions. Those who generate the hyperbole are driven by a lack of fulfillment and therefore continually denegrate any lifestyle which they see as aspirational, and their disciples generally have very low self esteem and will happily jump onto any bandwagon which they believe has the power to elevate their profile to that of the general populace. Mel Brooks summed these people up perfectly.

I'm not in the habit of quoting the bible . . . but . . . never a truer word has been said than in Proverbs 26:4-5 - "Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him. Answer a fool according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own conceit." In other words you have to use wisdom to know when to ignore a fool and when to answer a fool. Hmmmm, maybe I should take my own advice more often!

Here endeth the preaching.

Extremely well said Lyn.
I drove Commodores for years and they are a great car. After then buying a Camper Trailer which the Commodores towed well, I then realised that there were so many places that I could not go and see. I since purchased the Hyundia Terracan to take me wherever I wanted to go. I did not need a Cruiser or Patrol. I am knocking them either. Also couldn't afford one . I am 56 years old and 135kgs and 185 cms tall and the Terracan suits me fine.
I take all the surveys, etc with a grain of salt. I am very happy with what I drive and everybody should except us for what we drive as we mostly drive that particular type of vehicle for a reason. My best mate has a Camry and never has any intention of going "Off Road" so it suits him fine. I must say that I do keep telling him he is missing out on parts of Australia that should be a must see. Anyway, it suits him for his travels and he doesn't knock me for my choice of having a 4WD.
Lets all unite and enjoy our great country and the great people that live in it.
The Knockers can go jump.
Cheers
The Bigfella

Agree with you entirely Lyn

I read the full piece on which the article is based. A couple of observations:

1. They've used statistics like a drunk uses a lightpost - for support rather than illumination! There is a hugely arrogant presumption that every time a 4WD owner is different to the "average population" that this is a bad thing. Even if you agree with that, then there is a whole range of loaded questions (like the ones they have asked) that would produce results which the average population would aspire to such as "would you prefer to holiday in outback Australia despite the lack of a pool filled with champagne?" - 4WD owner answer 100% yes average 50%?

2. None of the quoted reference are refereed. This might be ok if they were actually factual or at least even-handed but when you look at the titles they are not. This is a scientifically poor methodology which is entirely self serving and results in a work of fiction.

3. The Australia Institute has no official standing. Given that it describes itself as "An independent green think tank dedicated to develop and conduct research and policy analysis and to participate forcefully in public debates" then it is no surprise that this is the flavour of the output.

Maybe we ought to set up an ExplorOz Institute and publish our own version that the lazy journos will also quote.

Adrian (underweight for my height, kids who love camping, friends and work colleagues who are gay, city-based 4WD owner!)

Well said Lyn, thumbs up to EV700, my long standing thoughts as well, Wombat - love that new angle on drink driving :-)))

Best way to respond to this tripe, dont buy their tabloid papers, dont watch their crappy "news" shows, and give commercial radio the flick as well.

The independent media is alive and well, support real journos instead.

goodday all
maybe i should start answering the questions when they ring for a survey

i never see the the % that tell them to rack off at 9.45 pm when your heading for bed

steve

???? the next 1 maybe about 4bs

statistics are only as good as the question asked to obtain them & the results can be riged to suit the out come required

looks like 100% of people from my survey of your post agree with you.
me as well so would that make it 110%?
signed:your mate jim the man who doesn’t live by the creed “born to shop” I’m overweight, I’m ignorant, I'm not racist i hate every one, I’m homophobic, I’m not in my 40’s [still got a lot of years yet], and I don't live in the suburbs.
i drive a 4wd because its big its strong and i can.
cheers