All Large 4WD tyres to be made Illegal in OZ

"Let’s face it 99% of the vehicles with large tyres fitted are technically already illegal to drive on and off the road anyway."

If this is the case then the cops will deal with them "On the Road" getting to and from Gembrook or wherever they are going.

Myfourby, you are the 'man'

Couldn't agree more.

These fuel guzzling, tractor tired, 'electric christmas trees' need to be eliminated ASAP for the good of all concerned.

myfourby - I'm just curious as to what would be the classification of "large 4WD tyres"? What is large on a Suzuki, is not large on a Land Cruiser... to make the actual tyre illegal to sell would require the seller to know what vehicle its going to be put on. Not all tyres are sold "fitted" so in lies the issue of how this could be policed?

It may amaze you that people with large aggressive tires dont to as much damage as they can do it easier..

People going where they shouldnt on AT's and just sinking the boot in spinning up the tires for hours on end do more damage than someone crawling up a hill on Swampers/JT's etc.

Make them illegal to sell? LMAO.. Why not just ban 4wds?

Is this the "I don't have/need them so why should anyone else" argument? Just like the "why does anyone need a 4wd in the city" argument don't you think?

I agree totally with Truckster.

I agree with Truckster .... and I don't.

Responsible drivers with 38 Swampers may do any given track more easily than someone on 31 AT's.

The problems come from people like I've (and most of you) often witnessed on the trails..... those with the big V8's and 38's that ARE finding a section of track challenging (particularly deep mud). They tend to quickly adopt the "bugger it" attitude more quickly because they seem to have to prove that they are capable of driving everything successfully.... and in the process are far more damaging to the trail than someone on 31's or whatever.

There are two sides to this story.... and neither is right or wrong.

Hi Myfourby,
I agree with you completely. On so many tracks now, the ruts are so deep that standard tyres won't give enough clearance. As soon as it becomes difficult for fire and service vehicles to get through what else are the authorities to do but close the tracks? It's too expensive to repeatedly repair them and if they justify the expense of upgrading the track it ends up passable to two wheel drives and we have lost our exclusive access; the very thing that draws so many to four wheel driving.

Attitudes need to change. The challenge of getting through when others can't drives some folk to be destructive. There may be a track that does well with little maintenance cost and has a large number of 4WDs passing merrily along, then along comes one rambo on a wet day who just can't bring himself to turn back and sections are made impassable.

Every golfer knows they must replace their divots, why can't four wheel drivers do the same thing? If you are likely to do more damage than you can repair then turn back.

Cheers Frank.

You may also find that the biggest reason for the state of our tracks is not from the 4x4s directly but from rain. Once a track has been formed by a 4x4 the soil has no protection and will erode when rain water flows down it.

Also as there are more and more 4x4s about these days there are more people about to make new tracks therefore more erosion.

Perhaps it is the people with stock 4x4s that are creating new tracks around the old eroded ones that they can no longer use whereas the bigger/aggressive tyred fourbies can still use the old tracks? So a stock 4x4 making these new tracks is actually causing more erosion. Therefore it is a logical conclusion to
BAN ALL STOCK 4WDS IN AUSTRALIA!!!! Quick everyone jump on the bandwagon.

Quote...Let’s face it 99% of the vehicles with large tyres fitted are technically already illegal to drive on and off the road anyway. It’s time to make them illegal to sell, and to get the police in the bush to start defecting vehicles using them (for repeat offenders, vehicles should be impounded).

Admin...please inform poeple who post funnies that they are to do it on fridays.


Qoute..I was up at Gembrook (VIC) a few weeks ago - in a friends 4WD with large tyres .....nice mate you are myforby :(

Myfourby,

Next time you are out in the bush, take half an hour to go for a walk beyond the tracks. You will find just as much "damage" being done to the environment (if not more) from natural events such as fallen trees, exposure of rocks through natural erosion, and the like.

General estimates of land usage generally give tracks approximately 1% of the land area of the National Parks, and the so called extensively damaged track areas (ie., THAT YOU CAN SEE!!) would only be a small portion of that. The bits that you can't see can also impact track conditions through erosion (ie on the uphill side of the track). To solely blame large tyres is is just plain naive.

As for tyre size, the lighter and bigger the footprint the less damage you will do, mud, rock , dirt, or sand. ***The most important thing to do is to let your tyres down to an appropiate level for the conditions you are driving in.***

Myfourby, You have jumped on a very old bandwagon that lost its wheels long ago.

surely driver education is more important than banning equipment

"surely driver education is more important than banning equipment "

Exactly!!!!!!

i reckon dirtbikes and rain do more damage than anything!

How about Country fire service , they have really big tyres on their 4x4 Hino trucks maybe they should drive slower and less lamounts of water which would mean less damage to our tracks, just a thought.

Sotty dude . But I think you have no idea . What makes more damage , a car set up to tackle hard terrain ? or a car that isnt. If you dont run big tyres or lockers ect , on a wet day in Gembrook , then dont bother going. And secondly were you go with your stocker , we dont bother .

So you want to give Rankens ago in your stocker on a wet day do you ? or ridge track in Toolangi on any day ? good luck , call me so i can have my video camera .

Some like to go for a pleasure drive a barby and some sights , others want to try something harder , hey , dont matter what you like , just enjoy it and have fun , but please stop pointing the finger . The most lame excuse i hear is , I would have made it if you didnt dig it up. But most of the time , we go up withought wheel spin & the stockers chopping it up from trying .

Hi All.
All I can say is....TREAD LIGHTLY..Go figger..rite gear selection..rite amount of momentom..and away you go..no damage!
JD

lets ban the small tyre

I think every body just bit the hook line and sinker, by the sounds of it he doesnt even own a 4WD ( if he is in a friends 4WD, who dosnt realise he is getting back stabbed) A true purist of offroading would of been there in his own vehicle to show " his mate " how to be a sensible off roader.
If the wheel is in the guard or a sensible flare, its good in my book.

I think he is just a antagonist who drops a insult and sits back laughing !

Tread lightly , leave nothing but footprints or the odd tyre print ON the track.

Spinning wheels, whether wide or narrow, are the source of the "nick points" from which track erosion proceeds.

Using the appropriate gear, and range when attempting a slope, depending upon your vehicle's capabilities, is the most important way to reduce one's impact, and driver education and/or experience are the best way to address incorrect techniques.

Bikes have their own problems, in that they can access additional areas where 4x4's are unable to go - otherwise they have similarly destructive effects if used without thought to their impact on the ground.

Broadly speaking, there are two types of people who are involved in "vehicle based recreation" -

1. "Destination" oriented users.
i.e. those who are interested in accessing areas which they find attractive, but which they are unable to access using conventional vehicles. Organisations such as Rural fires, National parks fit well into this group too.

2. "Vehicle" oriented users.
i.e. those who are interested in their vehicles capabilities and seek out destinations which will test these capabilities. Many 4wd clubs fit into this group.

These divisions are in a sense, arbitary, as there is some degree of "crossover" between the groups, and the "recreational experiences" they are seeking.

Unfortunately, the goals of the second group, and the way they commonly use their vehicles is not particularly compatible with the desires and needs of the first. For instance, users in the second group may not particularly mind if a track becomes badly eroded, as travelling it then becomes a more fulfilling experience for them. However, those from the first group will generally not appreciate the additional effort (and wear and tear on vehicles) posed by the badly eroded track.

Both groups, however, may have significant adverse effects upon the environment, and the difficulty faced by managers is how to reduce these impacts, which often results in track closures, particularly in the absence of :

(a) funding and staff to manage and repair eroded tracks (including policing inappropriate use)
and
(b) volunteers (and the supervision required), prepared to do so.

The only "fixes" possible IMHO, are increased driver awareness and training, and an increase in environmental awareness among those using 4wd's and trailbikes. Banning things does little to address the erosion and management problems which arise, and even track closures usually just relocate the problems to other (sometimes less suitable) areas.

A system of "zoning" of tracks for the differing experiences may work, but can only do so if supported by the majority of users, and by the various governments, in terms of funding.

It is my experience that little cooperation is gotten from either group when attempts are being made to address these problems, indeed many individuals become aggressively defiant when faced with the reality of their diminishing recereational opportunities. Many still refuse to acknowledge their responsibilities for the side effects (upon others, and the environment) of their leisure activities. Continuance of this type of attitude can only result in the least desirable outcomes for all involved.

I have spent a considerable part of my working life seeking a resolution to these problems, as I love the bush, and these are the only conclusions I can offer.

Been having a good read here and this is my thoughts: I go to Landcruiser park allot and every time I go on a track that I have been on before it's like it's getting worse and worse. This can't be from 4x4 going up there it's from the rain...when it rains allot it will do damage to anything on that hill. Most of the tracks don't have grass to cover it and the dirt and gravel will just wash away and make the ruts deeper and deeper. The problem is not the 4x4 tires it's the weather

The bandwagon is leaving in ten minutes, all those that want all 4WD tracks billiard table smooth (+/- bitumen) please leave your softroaders at the door before you enter....

My 4B has 29s as standard :-(

BAN ALL 31" TYRES SO I CAN PLAY TOO ;-)))

Baz.

Mmm, perhaps it's not so much that bigger diameter tyres do damage, but more that some people with bigger diameter tyres are the ones who deliberately go looking for mud/bog holes etc to drive through!

You are all missing the point,the correspondent is concerned that we may use the use of the tracks,and he is right to be concerned.
Living close to one of the popular areas outside Melbourne I can tell you that local pressure is mounting against track use.
It is not the large tyres just OVER USE.
The fact that our recreation is growing in numbers daily means more and more are using the nearest areas such as Gembrook,Toolangie etc every weekend.
Through Healesville on any weekend it is almost a steady stream of heavy vehicles in the mornings and evenings coming or going to local areas.
On top of this you have the trail bikes in equal numbers,now this type of use results in massive erosion regardless of tyre type.
Many of these drivers are non club members and have had no driver training which makes the problem worse,as some one else pointed out aggressive tyres may not cause great damage if used correctly,every time we go out we meet the mad wheel spinners who do not give a hoot for tread lightly and the mess they make.
Something has to be done in the form of self regulation,our best hope is that everyone will join a club,so that we we can claim that our recreation is full of trained members.
This also gives the 4wd association the numbers to have some influence over the politicians that ulimately control our access.
For those who just do not give a stuff and go for it every weekend you are simply just ruining it for every one else in the future.
Regards

We will all have differing opinions here, I whilst I dont necessarily agree with everything Utemad & Truckster said, Utemad hit the nail on the head, when he said we ALL cause damage, whether it be on 29's or 35's etc, or riding trailbikes & the like. Again, the undeniable fact is tracks are closing & if we are to reduce this, we all may need to look at how we approach our 4wding. Some stated the weather as a contributing factor, maybe, but it doesnt help when after a heavy downpour, alot of 4bies hit the trails. We have all heard/read how a trip is arranged on the spot because tracks will be muddy/slippery etc; ie great fun. IMO, this causes the most damage, as every vehicle will have some degree of wheelspin etc. No, I'm not advocating no 4wding in the wet, that is stupid, but maybe give it some serious thought as to whether you should drive down a particular track etc, because if so, you/I could potentially cause far more damage.
If we are all perfectly honest, I think most would agree that the reason some have the huge tyres/body lifts etc, is not to make life easier on the medium type tracks, but to go find the ones with the bigger bogholes, bigger ruts etc that eventually become impassable, & finally closed. Maybe I'm wrong, but I dont believe so, & again is just my opinion.

Cheers

I suspect this is more to do with aggressive tread patterns than size.

I was honestly shocked when I saw what damage the 900 by 16 14-plys Michelin XYL (quarry tyres fitted originally to my own and most OKAs) were doing - and that was on our own property!

I changed them to XL road pattern tyres and this fixed the problem completely.

Curiously enough we found the road tyres almost as effective as the lugged tyres in most places off road, far better (as expected) in sand. They also last about 100,000 km instead of 25,000 km.

I should have expected this tho - in the 1960s I took a big Bedford the length and breadth of Africa (twice). The truck used totally standard 11.00 by 20 road tyres.

I agree re putting our own house in order. Not all the rocks thrown are unjustified.
Collyn Rivers

" I suspect this is more to do with aggressive tread patterns than size. "

I suspect that when people refer to large dia. tyres, that they are talking in reference to them being aggresive pattern. As I would tend to think large dia. ie. 35 inch & agressive pattern go hand in hand.

Would it be fair to say that the ones who use the bush as a mere playground, always have large dia. tyres or to be more correct as Collyn has pointed out - have aggressive patterns?

in my 25 years of experance i can tell you i have seen lots of track get damaged & it is not done by the size of the tyre but by the size of the ego of the driver!
if every driver stoped when it becacme aparent that they were not going tobe successful in their attempt then the damage to tracks would be reduced conciderably.
the other problem lies in the shear number of 4wd , an increase of huge amounts of 4wd over the years & the closing of many of the tracks australia wide has seen more cars placed into less area's thus increasing the traffic flow over tracks hence once damage is done it is then increased by those folowing who alow their ego to drive rather than their commen scence.

the other is as stated is the acts of mother nature who has top obay the laws of physics & make water flow down the lowwest point ie vehicle tracks which then strips more siol out of the track making them deeper, this in turn then attracts bigger egos to the track who have to concer the track & you now have in place the cycle of destruction.

how do we stop it!
drive with your brain not your ego!

myfourby

You my friend are a idiot. You can no longer get up a track that u could befor, now u want to ban all 4x4s that are more capable than your own.

I bet u were one of thoses kids that when u got beaten in cricket u would take your bat and ball and go home.

I think from now on u should keep your small narrow minded comments to your self, and get over the "small man syndrome" that u are obvious suffering from.

It sounds like you are telling the anti 4x4 mobs about the 0.0000000001% of australia that has apparently been cut up buy these large tyred 4x4s. There are pleanty of other 4x4 tracks out there, go drive on them and stop boaring every one with your stupid comments.

Myforby, in case you haven't noticed we are all having a good laugh at your expense, even on other forums.....

"It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to open your mouth and prove it beyond doubt."

Hey wait a second there stop shooting your mouth off before having facts , i do work for national parks and totally diagree with what you assume to be the cause of mass erosion. Errosion is caused by rain ,wind and feral animals and also the bogging of 4wds, most of the 4wd's QPWS use are road registered which means we have to stay within placcard tyre sizes, but at the moment we are exploring the idea larger tyres which are fundamentally more efficient as the spread over the surface in stead of digging into the surface.Did you realise that small tyres cause more harm then larger tyres as it takes more attempts to negotiate a track that is challenging and usually results in bogging which is just the chance mother nature needs to erode the tracks further with rain and wind, national parks are actually looking at ways of fining drivers who do not deflate there tyres as deflating leaves a bigger footprint and impacts less on the enviroment . BTW QPWS have started using good year mtr's on many vehicles .

Myfourby, ever heard the saying, "don't judge a book by it's cover"??? Mate, there's a word they came up with for people like you- "dogmatist".
Here's a couple of other things 'they' banned which didn't quite work out...

BANNED- disciplining children (in schools or by parents)- that's really worked out for the best huh?
BANNED- teachers telling students they've given a wrong answer when they did 'cause it might f@#k with they 'self esteem'- ahhh, NOW we can can call ourselves the clever country
BANNED- Napster... that just stopped copyright protected file sharing on the internet in it's tracks didn't it?
BANNED- drugs! heh
BANNED- the black cash economy in Oz via the GST.... nope, still alive and strong!
(I give cashy discounts every day!)
BANNED- terrorism- doesn't stop the bastards blowing sh%t up!
etc, etc, etc

A lot of people just don't get it- so much better to encourage/ educate people to do the right thing and punish the few that don't, than to punish all "just in case" they do the wrong thing. People respond better to incentives than to punishments. Better yet- solve the underlying problem instead of patching the sore- This relates directly to track/ area closures- yes we are a growing community (and with every community there is going to be problem element), and this is applying more pressure on the resources and areas in which we conduct our activities, but by closing off more and more of these areas, compounding pressure is inevitably applied to the fewer ones remaining. Meanwhile as our recreation group increases in numbers, the goverment departments whose responsibilties include maintenance of these parks and forests recieve less and less funding each year and more and more power is being given to pencil pushing white collar careerists who have never even seen the bush, let alone see it burn out of control- whoops, almost went of on a whole 'nutha topic there! Plus, don't get me started on the bleeding heart greenies, who do more damage, and leave more crap behind in the bush, every time they wanna climb a tree with a banner.
I am currently less concerned with the state of tracks here in Victoria, than with the infestation of weeds in our parks- anyone had a good look around Walhalla area lately!?

I can't say that I've ever known anyone to go to Bunyip state forest to check out the scenery- it's not a pretty place- never has been. Dirty great powerlines running through the guts, sections of swampland, but mainly mud and clay. It's meant to be a playground to have fun in the mud- or are we to be banned from doing that now (you can go play in the mud without shredding tracks).
As others have said- you are blaming a tyre, which is an extreemly NARROW point of view- I'm sick of living in a world where a minority with their narrow point of view tell the majority what they should be doing.
Are tyres over your 31" in size POLITICALLY INCORRECT now??? Well too f*ckin' bad- I LIKE BEING POLITICALLY incorrect- and I reserve my God and country given right to be so!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I BAN YOU from having a voice in the wider community on my behalf- people such as yourself, with your BAN EVERYTHING that might create a problem policy are turning this country into the litigious, bland, directionless and soul-less copy of the USA that it is quickly becoming.

I like being able to choose things for myself- it's been said before, but what a boring place it would be if we were all the same. Some say money is power- rubbish! Choice is power.
Threaten to take away a man's right to choose and you're gunna make that fella stand up on his soapbox and belt out a few choice words- see???........ it worked... my reply and all the others against your post (the majority!!!) are living proof.

I choose to wear 35s, you choose to wear 31s- I choose to wear shorts and shirts, you may choose to wear skirts......... but it's still your choice.

I just came back from Portland last weekend for a play in the sand at the dune buggy club- I drive a dirty old pushrod 4.2 diesel with 35s- yep, I struggled!- but we excell in the high country and mud as we have heaps of traction and great torque, which results in minimal track damage (couldn't get my wheels to spin if I tried!) Anyway- even though we struggled, we left very little evidence of this behind- infact, the next day you couldn't see where any of us (29 vehicles) had been- WHY???... well and sensibly driven vehicles + mother nature ie: wind. An update- there WERE some tracks which were still discernable the next day...those of... a Subaru Brumby!!!- lightweght vehicle, TINY TYRES! (well, a lot smaller than your 31" monsters!- the difference- the Brumby was driven like a cut snake all weekend and was capable of spinning it's tyres easily in the sand. What happened to your generalistic solution now? PS: nothing wrong with the way the Brumby was being driven in this environment as no damage done- ie: proper forum. PPS: Can someone explain to me why beach driving is BANNED in Victoria in un-populated areas- there is no valid environmental explanation.

allanmac856 wrote:
"Couldnt agree more with you Frank & Myfourby. Dont worry though, as before long we wont have to complain, as more & more tracks will be closed. Happening heaps in NSW & now gaining momentum in Vic; places like Bunyip & Gembrook for example."
Allan, you might want to get your facts straight before posting in future- most of the sections of Bunyip State Park that are being shut down is due to the noise of motorbikes "upsetting" neighbouring property owners to the south.
What annoys me, is that these bikes have been going there for years, once again, the minority seems to have gotten their way again. This minority consists and people who have been suckered in to paying too much for a "sea change/ bush change" property close to this well used recreational area. They have made this move looking forward to the 'quiet country life' without doing their research and being aware of this area's level of use until the first weekend living in situ. These new residential (semi-rural) properties are part of the ever-growing urban sprawl into previously rural farming land only. But in a growing trend, instead of blaming themselves for being stoooopid and either dealing with their screw up or moving- they blame the people who have being using this area for years before their arrival.- WHY are we made to sacrifice for these people???????????

If you wanna ban something... BAN STUPID PEOPLE!... BAN YOU!!!

Hmmm....
Maybe I missed it in among all the CR@P about tyre size & "weapons" (a tyre is a "weapon"?????) etc. etc., but it seems to me that one of the *most important* factors (IMO) influencing track surface damage has been overlooked.....

TYRE PRESSURE!!!!!!!!! (sorry for shouting;-)))...

My approach is.... The "tougher" the conditions, the less air the better....

In any given situation, reduced pressures will go a lo-o-o-ng way toward minimising track damage (easier on the vehicle too!), & generally speaking, the larger the tyre (more volume) the lower the pressure required to carry the same weight, therefore a correctly driven vehicle on large tyres & appropriate pressures will do less damage to the surface, so the argument against larger tyres is ill-informed at best...

I'd say that incompetent and ignorant drivers cause far more track damage than tyres do, and 99% of the time, it's partly because they are running TOO-HIGH TYRE PRESSURES!!!! .. (oops, shouting again...sorry;-)))

OK, I'll get off the soap-box now.............

I've said it before and I will say it again - the biggest culprits for track damage would have to be the clowns who deliberately go looking for mud!

It certainly doesn't create a good public perception of 4x4 owners, when the public see a 4x4 (especially a lifted 4x4 with large aggressive pattern tyres) totally covered in mud coming back from a days playing on muddy tracks and in bogholes. It gives us all a bad image!

Whether Myfourby is right or wrong he is entitled to air his opinion.

I'm sorry - have I struck a nerve?

Isn't it funny that when it becomes apparent that the "I own big tyres and I vote" argument hasn't got a leg to stand on, personal insults begin to be used - bring out the tried and trusted scrubby line (please!)- and ganging up with all your mates (even from other forums apparently! - wow - I must have really made the big time!) to ensure that even if someone does disagree, they just couldn't be bothered arguing with the ego's of argumentative big tyre owners. Well -I'm here to tell you - nor could I. I thought I saw the last of this behaviour at pre-school - how wrong I was.

I had forgotten how hard it is to have a decent mature discussion and debate here without this happening.

I wanted to put the suggestion the table - I think I succeeded that far. I was hoping for a few large tyre owners to admit that well oversized tyres 36"+ may have in some way had a negative effect in the last 5 years on the tracks around VIC. But - no - head still well and truly planted in the sand.

It's been fun - but when personal abuse is the only way others think they can succeed when debating - I stop.

-myfourby

I agree mostly with Truckster that a lot of the problem is people attempting go further when the vehicle has lost, or is about to lose traction.

But aggresive tread tyres can cause track damage way even before that point - especially if they scrabble for traction. Unfortunately locking diffs make the damage even worse when these too fail.

As I noted in my earlier posting that my OKA caused quite extraordinary damage on the softer parts of our property on its original (very) aggressive tyres - and very little on road tyres of the same size. I actually saw the original tyres gouging two deep ridges in a bitumen car park the day before I changed them (it was a very hot day ands the bitumin was soft - but other vehicles were causing no damage at all).

Is not the overall problem that there are now so many 4WDs around that if even 001% of them are driven in an anti-social way - that's still one hell of a lot of 4WDs stupidity - and resultant public angst.

Let's not go overboard about this - but I feel we need to accept that some environmentalist criticism is justified -and we should take responsibility for it.

I'm not opposed to large diameter tyres, in fact they often are part of the answer - not part of the problem. But I feel there is no case for overly aggressive treads on tyres of any size - except for competition use on private land (or of course in quarries etc).
Collyn Rivers

Why do all tourist bus operators on fraser island run simex tyres and diff locks? Why do they get through in there 10 tonne busses? Why are QPWS now going for a much more aggresive tyre ? It is because on sand and mud they grip and don't bore holes deep like tyres left aimlessly spinning in the mud or sand i was at fraser at xmas and by far the most amount of damage i seen was caused by people on cheese cutter not deflating there tyres. When you walk up a sand dune how do you get up there...? by pushhing your toes into the sand for grip not walking flat feeted straight up the dune .. same with tyres if the grip in a little bit and pull you along it is much better than a guy in a troopy sitting there spinning his wheels on the spot until he is bogged axle deep as i in my patrol 33 muds drive effortlessly str8 around him then hook up my snatch strap and tow him out ...Well not any more i from now on will drive right by those with cheese cutter tyres who refuse to spend a few dollars on buying a decent set of tyres that actually grip rather then spin.. seeing a person with cheese cutters trying to get up a dirt incline that there car or tyres were not designed for and digging up the ground annoys me far more than someone who takes 4wqding seriously and buys the right equipment for the job ...i bet our m/t's cause less carnage then your skinny a/t's and am willing to prove it just name the place here in qld !!!!!!

myfourby ............. I admire you for having the guts to broach this obviously very sensitive subject, IMHO you are the Pauline Hanson of this 4 wheel drive forum!
Like her you have initiated the most response from those that have some underlying guilt, & most that agree with you are afraid to put their thoughts here in writing, for fear of written abuse & vilification.

I don't understand why people need these massively oversized illegal tyres either, or 6 or 8 driving lights making their vehicle look like it belongs to some Southern American red neck.

It was the people that just can't keep out of the mud that caused the owners of Bollards Lagoon Station to close the Bore Track for a period of time, as she said to me, despite repeated requests from her to go around the bog holes in their track, some idiots (her words) just couldn't help themselves but to ignore the request & cut up the track even more.
As far as rain eroding the tracks, it is certainly a fact on sloping ground, but what about all the bogholes on level ground where there is no flow in the ground water?

Once again, myfourby, congratulations!

As i said shaker mr myfourby is just annoyed that he cannot make the grade and wants to judge everyone else who can .
What i can't see the point in is people like you who constantly rant and rave about this ruining this and these people wrecking that but i guarantee you that it is driver error not big tyres that erode ground. What else i can't see the point in is you owning a 4wd to do leisurely drives you could probably do in a commodore or falcon. You are the guilty one because you are a yuppy 4wder who has no idea and ruin the ground by getting bogged when you go 4wding half heartedly.If governments are going to ban anything they should people that don't use there 4wd's ..USE IT OR LOSE AND STOP BEING A NARROW MINDED FOOL!

Why would i know you and why would i want to you are the red neck talking about pauline hanson too,go back to watching today tonight a for god sakes get a life mate!

Unfortunately, this thread has now degenerated to personal insults, which was one of the reasons I enjoy this forum, because it rarely happened here, unlike some other forums.

Myfourby has expressed an opinion, which many may disagee with, but no need to call him a wanker, not macho enough to cut it etc. Truckster said the key issue is the irresponsible driver, whether it be on 31's or 35's, which I totally agree with. I have been out with many people who have standard & modified vehicles. I find most with the standard type vehicles do not push the boundaries. I have also been out with a few 4wders who have the big tyres/lifts who are no different, do not try to find the limit, but can travel along tracks a little easier & less stress on their vehicles. Then there are those who, because they have fitted the bigger tyres, had body lifts etc, believe they are god & can conquer any terrain. I couldnt care less if you want to fit bigger tyre, get body lifts etc, but for the MAJORITY who do so is not to make life easier, it is to find more challenging stuff.

For those who think myfourby, myself & some others are 'losers' etc & shouldn't be out there; well my job does give me some insight to what may or maynot happen in Victoria at least. Whilst I do not listen to much of the stuff that is said, every now & then a subject comes up that does interest me. Doent' be suprised if many more tracks get closed & there is a blitz on illegal/unroadworthy 4wd's in the near future.

How do I have some idea?, I have those who run this state sit in the passenger seat in a car. Start thinking about it if all of us want to continue to enjoy getting out in the bush. Dont believe me, actually I dont give a rats, but I maybe one day I can say; " I told you so"

I disagree totally and really do think you are ill informed to say the majority and if you believe it is the majority show me the proof .

i wish this thread was banned ...

well that is still not proof in my eyes...that just proves you know some fools who are try hards .. the debate was over tyres that were big wrecking the environment and tracks .. not what a few mindless people do ... if i get stuck i stop and reverse and then forward if that doesn't work i get recovery happening .. My kids (2 girls) hate people who wreck the bush and they would kill me if i did . THE END ....

OK Dirty, I'm guilty of having a go at you, for which I regret, so I appologise. Let's agree to disagree. It is not worth causing grief to those who visit this forum.

Cheers

Well thats 30 mins of my life I wont get back.