4wd systems winch bar

Submitted: Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 21:01
ThreadID: 31265 Views:3084 Replies:5 FollowUps:21
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Have done an archive search on 4wd systems and have heard varying stories about the quality of some of their products. Found nothing on their winch bars. They seem to be of equal quality to ARB or TJM but for $300 cheaper for my GQ. Maybe they are cheaper because they don't advertise as much? Has anybody heard of or had any experiences with these bars?

Thanks

Barnesy
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Reply By: Haza - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 21:07

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 21:07
Barnesy,

I brought a TJM bar, but next time I will get myself a custom bar made up. A lot stronger and cheaper. Also get it made up for extras like CB mounts, spotlight mount heat exchanger. Just a tought!!. And somthingthing different. Though my fourby dosen't have Air bags.
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Follow Up By: Barnesy - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 22:42

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 22:42
Haza, would you have any idea who could manufacture a good, solid winch bar in Adelaide for reasonable price?
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Follow Up By: Haza - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 06:57

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 06:57
I suggest trying some of the smaller 4x4 shops or if you see one while your travelling around enquire to the owner. You could also ask on the outerlimits web forum.
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Reply By: apwaddo - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 21:25

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 21:25
I just bought a steel winch bar from ARB for $1350 fitted complete with arial mounts, spot mounts, fog light mounting recesses, jack points etc for a Navara ST-X, so I was pretty pleased. Mind you the only reason i got an ARB was that Nissan could not provide one, despite prdering with the new vehicle over 2 months ago!
And yes I know ARB make the Nissan ones!
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Follow Up By: ACDC - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 21:45

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 21:45
TJM steel bar is only $900.00
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Follow Up By: apwaddo - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 21:46

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 21:46
fitted?
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Follow Up By: ACDC - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 22:08

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 22:08
I think fitting was another $130.00
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Reply By: John Davies - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 09:23

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 09:23
I have a 4wd systems winch bar on disco. It is about 8 years old and quite well built.
It has lost some of its powder coating from being scrapped along embankments.
I had to modify the winch mount slightly to fit my X9 superwinch as they are designed to suit warn only.

If the quality is still the same I think they are a good buy.

John D
AnswerID: 157766

Reply By: Member - TPM (SA) - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 17:47

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 17:47
Check out this site, www.accc.gov.au type in 4wd systems in the search box.

Try a bigger vendor.

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Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 23:19

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 23:19
wow... they could have their own server for their complaints!
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Reply By: DesC - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 19:29

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 19:29
Ring Ivan Wines @CVT Bullbars Mt Isa. His bars actually work unlike all that other crap on the market that fold up like newspapers on a sunday afternoon.
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Follow Up By: Rock Crawler - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 20:20

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 20:20
Just a a suprized at your coment, never seen a ARB bar fold up . I even got away with writing off a camry lol .

Have you experienced something we havent ?
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Follow Up By: Wayne (NSW) - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 20:29

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 20:29
DesC,

You are on the ExplorOz forum.

Comments like that don't belong here, we all know better.

Where does Ivan get his bars tested for Air Bag compliance and does he comply with ADR for frontal protection.

Wayne
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Follow Up By: DesC - Thursday, Mar 02, 2006 at 14:11

Thursday, Mar 02, 2006 at 14:11
Give him a call and ask him. All i know is that if you live in the bush and you have to use your bullbar than the others just aren't up to the job. That is why i have bought several of his.
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Follow Up By: Rock Crawler - Thursday, Mar 02, 2006 at 23:47

Thursday, Mar 02, 2006 at 23:47
arn't up to it in what way ?
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Follow Up By: DesC - Friday, Mar 03, 2006 at 09:36

Friday, Mar 03, 2006 at 09:36
They rotate on the mounts and plough into your bonnet in a pretty average hit and fold up on the outside wings and #$%@ headlights and guards and what ever else.
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Follow Up By: Wayne (NSW) - Friday, Mar 03, 2006 at 10:09

Friday, Mar 03, 2006 at 10:09
DesC

That is funny I am in the bush a lot and my bull bar does not crumple.

I would be interested to see one, how about a photo.

Wayne
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Follow Up By: Wayne (NSW) - Friday, Mar 03, 2006 at 10:53

Friday, Mar 03, 2006 at 10:53
DesC,

I did ring Ivan, and for a start his phone manner leaves a lot to be desired. After a brief intro he was swearing his head off, not abusive but I think he must talk like that all the time. This is not the way to do business over the phone.

He has a lot to learn about building a bull bar. If I was to have one of his on my vehicle it would be hit with a defect notice that fast it would not be funny. I would not be able to get the vehicle registered or insured because of the bull bar.

The bars that he builds does not meet any ADR and has no air bag compliance. This is the type of back yard operator that have been outlawed around Australia. It will be only a matter of time before he is in court with a law suite.

He has designed his bars around the idea that ever one will hit a roo or emu other day.

From what he told me is the bar is built to lean forward which is the exact opposite to what every other bar manufacture in Australia is doing. Does he know better that the big 4WD company's with all there crash test and the engineers that design the bull bars.

If the likes of ARB and TJM and the other big company's didn't comply to meet the ADR the bull bar would not allowed at all. Right or wrong this is the way it is and his days of producing his type of bull bar is limited.

Wayne
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Follow Up By: DesC - Friday, Mar 03, 2006 at 19:15

Friday, Mar 03, 2006 at 19:15
It's like this Wayne, if you want to send the boy to do a mans job you go ahead. As for Ivan' s phone manner he's been building bullbars for over 40 years and is dedicated to producing a quality product that works and probably takes exception when talking to people like yourself who wouldn't have the foggiest idea about what is or what is not required in animal strike protection. People who want his quality products are prepared to wait up to 18 months to get them, and they come from all over the country. He has the best name in the business in Nth West QLD and has a yard full of twisted up and bent steel and alloy bars that were removed to fit his bars. I had a 75 series trayback with one of his bars on it and not long ago i was pulled up by a mass police / vic roads roadworthy blitz in Swan Hill Victoria, the most over regulated state in Australia. 6 inspectors went right over the vehicle and commented how the bullbar had the sleekest lines and the least amount of sharp edges of any bullbar they had ever seen. They even asked me what i paid for it and were keen to get one themselves for their personal vehicles. So you just stick to your driving light and arial mounting device that you believe is the go and does the job you need it to do, and for all of us who do a lot of night driving in remote areas where there are 5 beasts and 14 seven ft high roos at every guide post we will buy something that works. As for adr & airbag compliance I would love to see a copy of the regulation. If you could find it that would be much appreciated. I also would love to see an insurance company weigh up replacing 10 bullbars a year compared to NONE on the same vehicle, I am sure they would pick the latter.
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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew W (SA) - Friday, Mar 03, 2006 at 20:14

Friday, Mar 03, 2006 at 20:14
DesC says: "They rotate on the mounts and plough into your bonnet in a pretty average hit and fold up on the outside wings and #$%@ headlights and guards and what ever else."

interesting - for that to happen to the ARB bar I have it would have to shear about 10 x large hardened steel bolts.

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Follow Up By: Wayne (NSW) - Friday, Mar 03, 2006 at 21:34

Friday, Mar 03, 2006 at 21:34
DesC,

You have no idea what I know about bull bars and I know a lot more than you think.
.
You didn't know what I said to Ivan, except what I told you.

Ivan knows all about the ADR that applies to bullbars and he thinks that they are bu.....ht. He told me all about them but does not want to comply because he thinks he knows better.

Building bull bars for 40 years does not give him the right to swear like a truckie. (no offence Bruce)

Wayne
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Follow Up By: DesC - Friday, Mar 03, 2006 at 22:20

Friday, Mar 03, 2006 at 22:20
Horses for courses.The fact of the matter is BULLBARS ARE FOR HITTING ANIMALS IN AN UNAVOIDABLE SITUATIONS. If you find that they don't do the job and cause you greif then try something else, that's what i did. Experience counts for a lot in life you should try this theory.
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Follow Up By: Rock Crawler - Saturday, Mar 04, 2006 at 00:06

Saturday, Mar 04, 2006 at 00:06
1 st , let me say that I have never met Ian or ever seen his bull-bars. So really cant comment on the quality . Now as to compliance , there rules are a little grey.

Mostly it's sharp edges that are a no no RWC item and they must lean back not to force any object they hit under the car.

No as for air bag compatible cars, this is another story , for starters who need to obtain a certificate that your bars will collapse at the right strength ti allow air bags to work , testing cost around $5000 a bar and they usually test till you get it right.

Now there is a issue with to strong a bar , this for death on impact. If you bull bar doesnt give at all , chances are that you will die on impact , even though your car has suffered no damage. This due to the brain continuing to travel forward and touching your scull. For this reason , vehicles are made to crumble these days , so they can save the occupants from death on impact.

I hit a Camry and leveled his back panel with the back window , with no damage to my ARB bar. I don't thing I need anything stronger than that for my outback trips.

Now we all know that thicker steel mean more weight , this is also a problem with making bull-bars , you don't need to try support a extra 20kg over the front axle .

Would be nice to see one of Ian's bars , just to get a idea of what his product looks like

Cheers all
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Follow Up By: DesC - Saturday, Mar 04, 2006 at 11:10

Saturday, Mar 04, 2006 at 11:10
As i have said in previous threads his bullbars do have crumple zones built to fold the bar in the event of a serious impact. You are dead right about airbags being deployed due to decelleration so listen to this scenario. Landcruiser weighing 3500 kg hits 1000kg beast at 100km/h what is the decelleration factor there? Landcruiser weighing 3500 kg towing 2500 kg horse float (6000 kg Gross) hits the same beast at the same speed, what is the decelleration factor there? As for thicker steel in his bars, he uses high tensile thin wall pipe and the steel in the base is half the thickness of other manufacturers, he just puts the steel in the right place ie 4 sided section in the wings, mounting bolts running nth / sth and mounts that group bolts in a wider arc. Don't get me wrong rockcrawler, I would love to be able to go into the After market 4wd accessory shops and buy a bar off the shelf that i would have confidence in but after my experience with them i will buy what works for me. As for the steel bars you are referring to they probably are the best of a bad bunch. Ivan's bars are probably for a small market of people like myself. I have had a few bad experiences that don't just involve animal strikes, corrugations had cracked those quality convoluted mounts on a so called "airbag compatible bar" and over time the mounts broke off and the bar went under the front end. Also was travelling with a mate in the Simpson Desert who had gotten bogged after not making it over one of those bigger dunes. He backed down the dune to get a bigger run up but turned the steering wheel in the wrong direction and got stuck in a big clump of vegetation. He then hooked the winch cable onto my vehicle and proceeded to winch the vehicle up the dune. Where the winch was mounted it pulled and distorted the channel to the point where we couldn't even turn the free spool lever and the bar looked like grandma's glasses after they had been stood on. Talking about ADR's what size lift & tyres are on your shorty? (only stirring)
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Follow Up By: Rock Crawler - Saturday, Mar 04, 2006 at 13:02

Saturday, Mar 04, 2006 at 13:02
I know your only sturring about the shorty but it is only my play car lol By everyday car is a 100 series ,

Funny thing is , the shorty does comply with all the road reg's because I have a enginneers certificae to say so lol .

I agree with the fact that some bullbars should be on the market and some of the bolts to mount them , even from ARB are not my cup of tea
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Follow Up By: Rock Crawler - Saturday, Mar 04, 2006 at 13:04

Saturday, Mar 04, 2006 at 13:04
PS , everything is engineered except for the NOS of course , but keep that shhhhh hhahahahaha
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