battery chargers

Submitted: Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 23:01
ThreadID: 31275 Views:8555 Replies:5 FollowUps:16
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After a battery charger to charge 150 AH DC Battery, using generator.(for camping)
Anyone got any stories of there setups and success or failure charging batteries back up. I already have a 10amp "calibre" charger that does boost and float charge. I am also looking at a Kipor 1000ti genny.
Any info would be appreciated.
Cheers
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Reply By: Derek from Affordable Batteries & Radiators - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 23:38

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 23:38
What battery type is it ?

Dry, wet or gel cell.

Most good chargers will have a setting to choose the battery type and charge rate. Go for a 3 stage float charger with these settings and you will be able to charge up the DC ok.

Just a note though. On a recent test a 15amp charger running off the Honda eu20 took 4 hours to bring a 90 ah Calcium Battery from 10.75volts back up to 12.7volts after running an Engel SR90E for 38 hours. We did not let the Engel cut out but opted to test the charger before actual low voltage cut out at 10.5 volts.

The 1000w Kipor should run a 20amp charger easily and may be your best solution.

Regards Derek.
AnswerID: 157716

Follow Up By: FREEZER - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 22:03

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 22:03
wet cell derek
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Follow Up By: Derek from Affordable Batteries & Radiators - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 22:41

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 22:41
The 20 amp Smart Charger or 30 amp Smart Charger will be perfect.

These units have adjustable output.

Projecta have just released a new catalogue with some nice looking chargers but I have not read the specs yet.



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Follow Up By: Derek from Affordable Batteries & Radiators - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 22:58

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 22:58
Sorry about the quality of the scan. These are due in April.

Repco, K-mart, Etc.



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Reply By: Sand Man (SA) - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 03:58

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 03:58
Freezer,

Unless you wish to go out and spend money, the battery charger you have should suffice. Just include a charge controller, switchable between wet cell and Gel (AGM) to enable automatic charging.

The 12 Volt, 10 Amp unit (BM140) will match your existing charger and they are available from Repco, KMart, etc., for about $30.

Automatic Charger Control

Bill


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AnswerID: 157742

Follow Up By: FREEZER - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 07:06

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 07:06
sandman,

The charger i have is for wet cell (lead acid) batteries. It will boost charge to 80% capacity @ 10amps, then automatically switches to float charge, which is @ 2amps until battery is fully charged. It will then only maintain the battery, giving it only what it needs to keep it up to scratch. I suppose you would call it a 2 stage charger, i am not realy sure. It seems like a fair unit, just not sure if it is big enough to put back 30-40 amps a day without running genny for 5 -6 hours. If it works the way i understand, a 10 amp charger should put back in 10 amps per hour shouldnt it. Would these assumptions be true:
1. 150 amp hour bank - daily use of 40amp = 110amphour remaining
2. charger charges @ 10amps upto 80% capacity, in this case is 120amp hour. So if i have 110 amphours left,my charger will charge for one hr @ 10 amps. It will then do the remaining 30ampshours @ 2 amps which would take 15hoursto fill the rest.

if this is right would i be better off
1. getting a bigger charger
2. useing current charger and only charge up untill it hits float. which might mean 4 hours per day of genny running
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Follow Up By: Wok - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 07:42

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 07:42
Freezer,

Wouldn't a larger charger reduce the Bulk charge time [1hr]? It wouldn't affect the Float charge time, looks like 80% is it for DC batts using your intended method[unless you intend to run the the genny for yonks!]

eng
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Follow Up By: hl - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 09:01

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 09:01
I wouldn't wast my money on a fancy charger. Just go for the one with the most raw grunt i.e. a 20 amp job. You're not likely to run the genni for long enough to have all the fancy modes (i.e. equalize, float charge) activate. That is if you only want to use it for camping. If you also want to use it at home, different story. You may still be better off buying a lower current "fancy" one and just a "raw" high current one for use with the genni.
Cheers
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Follow Up By: drivesafe - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 09:52

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 09:52
Hi Freezer, before you spend another cent, just try what you have and see if it works for your needs.

If you have a problem, then look for a solution but I think you will find the charger you have will be more than adequate for most of your requirements, as you posted in the other thread, so until try it out and you know if you actually need anything else.

Cheers
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Follow Up By: Nifty1 - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 10:55

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 10:55
Sandman, that BM140 you mentioned - is it effectively a 3 stage charger? I saw one in Kmart but there wasn't enough info for me to figure this out. I just cooked a Trojan leaving it on a basic charger and I'm a bit sensitive about stuffing another battery but I don't want to spend $300 on a fancy 3 stage charger if I don't need to.
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Follow Up By: Mike DiD - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 12:19

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 12:19
"If it works the way i understand, a 10 amp charger should put back in 10 amps per hour shouldnt it."

Yes, charging time is usually determined by charging current, but -

- if it is a Wetcell Deepcycle, you should keep charging currnet to less than C/4 (150/4= 37amps in your case) for long batttery life.

- the battery's ability to accept charge will reduce as it aproaches full charge.

- btw - it's 10 amphours per hour of charging

So if you are taking 40 amphours out of the battery every night, then yes, you will reduce charging time by increasing your charging ability to 20 or 30 amps.
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Follow Up By: FREEZER - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 20:08

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 20:08
WOK

yes 80 % charge would be the most you would bother with on the 10 amp charger i have already. The first night would be a quick 1 hr charge and from then on in it would be 4 hours. Might be worth getting the 20 amp and cutting this time in half.
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FollowupID: 412241

Follow Up By: Sand Man (SA) - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 20:18

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 20:18
Nifty1,

The BM140 utilises a 2 stage charging algorithym to first "bulk charge" a battery then maintain a float charge.
Bill


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Follow Up By: drivesafe - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 21:38

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 21:38
Hi Freezer, unfortunately doubling the size of the charger won’t half the charging time. It will probably speed it up a little.

Not knowing your batteries, I haven’t the exact charge slop figures for you but a very rough slop will still give you some idea.

Wet cell batteries will not charge as quickly as other types of batteries so the charge time is going to be slow even if you put a large capacity charger on them.

During the first hour or so, depending on the output current AND VOLTAGE of the charger, and the state of discharge of the batteries, the batteries will probably take everything that your present charger will put out but after this initial stage, the charge being absorbed by the batteries will taper off over a period of hours and it wouldn’t matter if you had a 1,000 amp charger, your batteries will rule how much current they require.

So having a larger charger will help in the first hour or so but the rest of the time the batteries will draw less and less.

Again, as posted above, save your money for now and try using what you already have and see if there is any real short fall.

Cheers
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FollowupID: 412269

Follow Up By: drivesafe - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 21:50

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 21:50
BTW Freezer, if you do a google search and find the manufactures web site for your batteries, you will most likely find the exact charge slop for your batteries.

Cheers
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Follow Up By: FREEZER - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 22:05

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 22:05
call me stupid but what is is "slop"
freezer
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Follow Up By: drivesafe - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 22:42

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 22:42
Hi Freezer, I will not call you stupid because it’s a fair question.

Basically the charge slop is a graph ( and this may sound like double dutch ) that sets out the amount of current that the battery of a given size can absorb based on the start of charge of the battery and the charging voltage being applied at a given temperature.

Now that should make a lot of sense NOT!

The best way to find out about the charge slop for your batteries is as I posted, to go to the web site for your brand of battery.

Once you look at the slop all you need to do is get a rough idea of how your battery is going to charge and this can give you some idea of whether you need a bigger charger or that the charger you have will be fine.

Remember, these graphs are based on results gained in laboratory conditions, using new batteries for the tests and only have a slim resemblance to what happens in real life, so just view them as a guide.

Cheers
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FollowupID: 412296

Reply By: Geoff M (Newcastle, NSW) - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 09:09

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 09:09
Freezer,
Another point, regardless of the charger you choose, all of the above information is good.
When I'm charging the batteries off the generator and 3-Stage I also connect the fridge to the 240 volt. That way all the output of the charger is going into the batteries.
That's the opposite to what I'm reading into Derek's post. My understanding of Derek's test was to see how long the whole show took to recover with the fridge on 12 volt.

Geoff.
Geoff,
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AnswerID: 157764

Follow Up By: Mike DiD - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 12:24

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 12:24
Geoff - I agree, if you have a 10 amp charger and the fridge draws 5 amps (most probably worst case), you will get much faster charging if you power the fridge off 240 volts rather than 12 volts.

Mike
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FollowupID: 412112

Reply By: Mike DiD - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 11:56

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 11:56
Freezer - if you're thinking of using the "12 volt" output on the Kipor (or Honda or GMC) keep in mind that these are TOTALLY unregulated and will keep on pumping 8 amps into your battery, even when it is fully charged. This is fine if you are going to stay around and disconnect it when it starts to gas heavily. If you forget, you will cook the battery.

A 2 or 3 stage automatic charger is cheap insurance to prolong the life of a 150 amphour battery.
AnswerID: 157795

Reply By: DesC - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 19:20

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 19:20
I JUST BOUGHT A DURST 25 AMP DUAL CHANNEL SMART CHARGER THAT THEY MAKE THEMSELVES, IT DOES A GREAT JOB. THEY ALSO SELL A LIGHTER BLUE COLOURED ONE THAT I DON'T THINK IS AS GOOD QUALITY (MADE IN MALASIA). I RUN IT OFF MY EU20I HONDA.
AnswerID: 157896

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