Jackaroo Diesel 1998-0n problems

Submitted: Friday, Apr 21, 2006 at 18:06
ThreadID: 33131 Views:7543 Replies:5 FollowUps:7
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Re. problems with Isuzu/Holden Jackaroo TDiesel, 1998-on, with HEUI injection system. I still own a 1998 model, and at about 73,000kms. in late 2003, the motor developed hard starting, and rough running when it did start. To a garage, not a dealer, and the mechanic took it for a run. On his return, the motor would not stop, so had to be stalled. It was running-on on a fuel/oil mix being fed to the pistons via the turbo (bearings stuffed) through the air intake system, and has resulted in many of these engines throughout Australia that I know of totally destroying themselves, and in some cases, causing accidents. Holden resolutely denied any knowledge of the problem for a long time, but eventually did a recall of the model and replaced the injector and injector seat seals, which had shrunk, probably due to the heat of the engine head. In my case, I paid out about $6500 for replacement of turbo, glow plugs, injector kits etc. and was eventually recompensed $1800 by Holden, who then insisted on their own warranty replacement of the O-rings. A new motor for these machines cost around $26,000. A lot of them have had to be replaced, quite a lot under warranty. It would appear that the cost had a hand in sending Isuzu broke, and then GM injected money. Jackaroos were discontinued. It is not known by me if Caterpillar, who designed the system, and it is installed in a lot of trucks, tractors and RV around the world, in Holden and Ford and other vehicles, ever had to cover any of the costs. When the seals were replaced, it was said by Holden that now these O-rings were to be replaced every 80,000km. service for the life of the vehicle. Anyway, what this is leading up to is that around 30,000km. after the double replacement of the faulty O-ring seals, and Holden have admitted unofficially that they are faulty, (the design is completely faulty), I have got the same problem again! I religiously use 5W-40 fully synthetic oil, but for the past 15,000km. I have been making oil in the sump! In one way or another, and for one reason or another, the seal seperating the oil and the diesel in the seat of the injector has again shrunk, and allowed diesel to access the sump. The oil is getting thinner and thinner, and will do damage to my vehicle unless I do some more very expensive repairs. The injector seats, made of stainless steel with 2 O-ring seals, cost about $92.00 EACH, and possibly will have to be replaced complete...again!! Hopefully not, apparently O-ring seals are now available seperately. That is before labour an other seals and parts. Holden offered a limited warranty on their parts from the warranty job they did, about 20,000km or 1 year, which ever comes first, and unfortunately I am well past that in both cases after 2 years. If you are still in the warranty period from the warranty repair, get your oil condition checked asap. It is quite noticeable that your oil gets more in the sump, not less, as time goes on. You may think you are going mad, as I did, but it is not that. I have asked around locally, and know of at least one other Jackaroo diesel, a 2000 model, which has gone futher than my truck and done severe damage, again, although I do not know the intervening mileage. It is in the dealer's workshop. Also, word has it that at least one Caterpillar tractor, on farm, has been noted wth the same symptoms, so nothing appears to be safe from this design fault. 4 x 4 Magazines of all ilk refused to print any of my warnings back in 2003-4, afraid of Holden's response seemingly, although I was advised in one case that they had contacted Holden, and Holden had denied any knowledge of the matter, so nothing was printed. Hmmm!!!! 4 x 4 Magazine in a much later edition did print a retro look at the Jack, and advised that it did have some problems, since cured, according to them, with injector seals. Believe me, the problem has NOT been fixed. Beware if you are a TD Jack owner.
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Reply By: Sand Man (SA) - Friday, Apr 21, 2006 at 18:37

Friday, Apr 21, 2006 at 18:37
So, are you suggesting that this was the reason for the discontinuance of the Jackaroo in Australia?

I don't think so, they sold many more V6 petrol engined Jacks, but still not enough to justify the manufacturing and export costs.

Isn't the same diesel donk used in the Rodeo's, which are still manufactured by Isusu and inported by Holden?
Bill


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AnswerID: 168365

Follow Up By: Trevor R (QLD) - Friday, Apr 21, 2006 at 20:28

Friday, Apr 21, 2006 at 20:28
Sand Man,

It is my understanding the 3lt TD in the Rodeo is a bored out version of it's older brother the 2.8 TD. So to answer your question, no I don't think the Rodeo and Jack have the same T/Diesel engine.
Hope this is correct but I'm sure it is.

Cheers Trevor.
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FollowupID: 423691

Follow Up By: Member - Gecko (WA) - Saturday, Apr 22, 2006 at 09:25

Saturday, Apr 22, 2006 at 09:25
The new rodeo and the jackaroo do have different motors, Holden now own GM Daewoo and were looking at bringing out a musso type of 4b but now looks like they are going to a soft roader similar to the x3 from BMW. The write up can be found on there website.
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Follow Up By: Jack0Dazza - Saturday, Apr 22, 2006 at 11:37

Saturday, Apr 22, 2006 at 11:37
Indeed I do believe from information rceived that the main cause of Isuzu going almost totally broke was the Caterpillar designed head on the Jackaroo/Trooper etc. It cost them many millions, and did much to destroy their reputation for reliability. It was not worth keeping the petrol model going alone. Holden did indeed consider another replacement, but this idea has since been dumped, to my knowledge. Things may have changed. The Rodeo has most definately NOT got the Caterpillar designed injection system it is the old tried and true, if pedestrian, mechanical injection. For the present... it has to be upgraded, they are being left behind by the competition. The motor is indeed a bored out version of the old 2.8 litre. I very much doubt that Isuzu will be in the small vehicle business in the near future, they just do not have the financial resources to do upgrades. GM is in deep troubles, so no more money from them. Word has it that Mitsubishi (Daimler/Chrysler) may step into the breach..maybe! Pity. I owned a Rodeo before the Jack, and it gave me sterling service, went around Australia twice, towing a camper trailer.
Pursuant to my Jack, I find that indeed the faulty O-ring seal has already been superceded...again!!!
No word from Holden that they are accepting any responsibility...for anything! However, the seals are available seperately from the sleeves, this time around, and are about $4 each. 2 each sleeve. Bit cheaper than the $92 each for the entire sleeves. I still think that Holden should be paying for all these repairs. Or Caterpillar!!!
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FollowupID: 423773

Follow Up By: Gerhardp1 - Saturday, Apr 22, 2006 at 12:25

Saturday, Apr 22, 2006 at 12:25
What information do you have that Isuzu is "almost totally broke"

I think you are inventing this. Isuzu is a massive truck manufacturer with a relatively tiny involvment in the Trooper/Jackaroo/Gemini range of vehicles.

I don't think Holden should pay for your injectors forever, you sound like you think they should pay for your brake pads when they wear out.

Why not try the company which makes the rubber the Orings are made from. You might get sympathy there.

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FollowupID: 423777

Reply By: Rigor - Saturday, Apr 22, 2006 at 20:43

Saturday, Apr 22, 2006 at 20:43
My 98 has 110,000Ks on it , Holden performed the sleeve recall at about 70,000Ks and the engine runs as sweet as , yes some people have had a bad run a mate of mine included , on reflection with his problems the local dealer where it was purchased and serviced were complete dunces and never understood the requirements of that engine. Setting up the injectors , sleeves and O rings requires a bit of care and time , something most dealers don't give away. Have read posts in other forums and some owners claim in excess of 200,000 Ks with no probs so far . I fair dinkum do sympathise over your problems , maybe time to move on.

Dave L.
AnswerID: 168501

Follow Up By: Jack0Dazza - Sunday, Apr 23, 2006 at 11:37

Sunday, Apr 23, 2006 at 11:37
Dave L, mine has also done 110,000 now, but has been making extra in the sump for the last two oil changes. Still runs as sweet as pie, but that will not continue as the fuel/oil mix does in the bearings in the turbo, which allows oil to enter the air intake circuit, and then it is all over, Rover! I have been watching the oil level with some disbelief, not quite willing to believe the evidence of my eyes. The smell test does not always work on the oil. But the spare parts man telling me that the oil/fuel O-ring on the sleeve, which was put in my motor in 2004, has already been supeceded, tells me that there has to be more trouble. They do not supercede stuff like that for nothing..but of course, nothing has been said, publicly. As for the installation of the injectors and sleeves, have you any particular information??? I know that the local dealer has done dozens of these vehicles by now, but their mechanics have changed many times also. I could do the job myself if I had the specialist tool for withdrawing the sleeves, without damaging them, for re-use. I have read the Manufacturer's Manual on this section, and it is not specific about anything involving the installation..at the time of the printing, the sleeves were thrown away and replaced. Lining up the intake and exhaust holes of the fuel in both the sleeve and injector seems logical.
Unfortunately, 'moving on' is not available to me in my situation. The re-sale value of these trucks is pretty bad, the word has spread. I have never met an owner of a diesel Jack who has not had fuel/oil/water problems!!! I know of a cattle dealer who does thousands of ks per week, who had one, did high mileage, but had heaps of problems, which Holden was not very interested in fixing. He, like me, was well beyond the warranty period and mileage, when things hit the fan. All related to this O-ring situation. Holden eventually replaced his motor with a new one.
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FollowupID: 423923

Reply By: Rigor - Monday, Apr 24, 2006 at 20:43

Monday, Apr 24, 2006 at 20:43
Hi Jacko , been away for a while , no I don,t have any particular info on the sleeves and O rings other than before the recall I started making oil and replaced the o rings myself . Not hard but you have to be very carefull how you line up and tighten the injector brackets and the high pressure manifold. I would agree that it is not the best design as the cam carrier is a separate item which is bolted to the head and with the injectors going through it . Call this naive but I still believe that if the sleeves and o rings are assembled correctly (and the O rings are the correct material ) they should give good service ! Unfortunately you are right about the resale being crap but that is what you would expect with a discontinued line and further to that GMH have to share some of the blame for the bad press the vehicle has received due to complete ineptitude in the early days.

cheers Dave L.
AnswerID: 168768

Follow Up By: Jack0Dazza - Tuesday, Apr 25, 2006 at 11:15

Tuesday, Apr 25, 2006 at 11:15
I agree completey, Dave L, if only the O-rings had been made from the correct material from the very beginning, it would have been and still would be, a marvellous truck. I will bet that Isuzu and Holden wish that also. Maybe Caterpillar as well. I spent $10,000 extra on it from purchase, fitting it out with upgraded suspension, All-Terrain tyres, front Auto Locker Diff., roof racks etc. for travel in hard terrain, and it worked very well. Very hard to buy a real 4 Wheel Drive vehicle these days, they seem to be almost all soft-roaders. The Jackaroo Standard was a soft-roader out of the showroom, if not as bad as the ones now, which are not designed to ever leave formed roads. It would be extremely hard, if not impossible, to find a new vehicle now which was as good off-road as my Jackaroo. Well, perhaps the new Ford Landie, or Range Rover, if I was to win the Lotto.
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FollowupID: 424229

Reply By: andrewtasker - Tuesday, Apr 25, 2006 at 18:08

Tuesday, Apr 25, 2006 at 18:08
i hve a may 1999 td jack and had the engine blow up due to the issue you raised - it took a t lot of heated betweent eh dealer and holden but in the end they (holden) paid $13 000 for a re-build - hiolden however wudnt pay for new injectors and so after 3 mths or so it was back to the workshop to hve two of them replaced after they totaly failed in huge clouds of balck smoke - however holden would only pay for two new ones so i spose the remaining two are under a cloud (so to speak) - holden will pay for a new motor if pushed and threatned with a lawers letter and if you have a dealer who is happy to provide service like they all used to years ago - apart from that little issue (that had the vechilce off the rd for 3 mths) the jack has been fantastic and will eb rewarded with new suspension soon and a se of coopers
AnswerID: 168931

Follow Up By: Jack0Dazza - Saturday, Apr 29, 2006 at 11:13

Saturday, Apr 29, 2006 at 11:13
Thank you, Andrewtasker, for your input. Looks like it very much depends on what dealer you have.
Mine is not the best, due partly to the fact that I did not purchase the vehicle from him in the first place when he was but a salesman, and he got in strife for a lost sale, and partly due to just plain lack of interest on his part. If I was in the market for a new vehicle, I imagine the response may be a little better. I am not, unfortunately.
As for your adding a set of Coopers to your Jack, would recommend you check around the various forums on Coopers. It seems that they may not be all they are spieled to be. I can not speak from personal experience, having stuck with BFGs., the original recommended alternative for Jacks. Have had a very good run out of them, but they are getting very expensive. Heard rumours that they are no longer made in the USA either. I have an alternate set of Korean LT tyres, Hankook, and they are wearing very well, but are NOT BFGs.
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FollowupID: 424989

Reply By: Jack0Dazza - Monday, May 15, 2006 at 12:10

Monday, May 15, 2006 at 12:10
Follow up. Had my O-ring seals on the injectors and sleeves replaced by Holden dealer last week, cost around $900. No guarantee that this lot will last any longer than the last lot, about 15,000ks. Will pursue this matter with Holden, but do not expect any glee from that quarter, they just do not want to know. I will be watching my sump oil level VERY carefully, and will try for Warranty repacement if I see signs of fuel getting in there again within that period. Still trying to win the Lotto, there is no hope long-term for my Jack.
AnswerID: 172768

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