Pre warm up with a diesel first thing in the morning!

Agree! Muzzgit, low revs make sure the oil light goes off REAL quick !

HA HA That dude you mentioned sounded like my previous neighbour with her dato station wagon REV the crap out of it freezing cold and then off!!.(HA HA).

“It didn't take long for the thing to start blowing smoke”

Na Just ask any skyline driver, it’s called “Power Smoke” LMAO, year right Buddy I call it your heap of chit engine is bleep ed smoke.

As for warm up, Well I start my car at 4:55am Monday to Friday to go to work And probably wake half the house up as the thing fires up and the exhaust note hits and radiates of the garage LOL. , The oil pressure gage takes all of oh… around half a second to read normal pressure, seatbelt on in drive handbrake off and out of the driveway and I am off.

Oil reaches the top end within one second fisho64. Do you really think that engine manufacturers/designers would make an engine that runs without lubrication for any more than a second? I assume you have a very old car because that was a problem many years ago and those who run their engine before driving are hanging on to old ideas. Consider also - does it really make any difference to the tappets and their lubrication if the car is moving or stationary??

"Consider also - does it really make any difference to the tappets and their lubrication if the car is moving or stationary?? "
why worry about any other part of the engine then? Ditto the turbo?

If you have an aftermarket gauge you will see that it takes at least a second to raise oil pressure. Unless you have a magical way to make oil flow uphill without oil pressure then it aint gonna get there without it.

Having said that sure its not that big a problem. Its abusing it that will cause far more trouble

Bilbo.
Can see experience here, totally agree ,over head cams" different situation, But! have to be carefull what oil is used !!. Another post maybe, (HA HA)

Cheers.

Bilbo, you done that too!!!!! :-)))) Inquisitive buggers, aren't we??????????

>>> Sitting at idle apperently makes no differencee while warming the engine

I wouldnt bother going back to that mechanic I dont think...

I find the 3.0 you luv truckie takes for ever for the guage to move if idling from cold. Using the heat button a bit faster and driving gently down the road, no time at all.

Leroy

ALL caravan Pullers have done that me included!!

Axle.

a bloke by the name of Bob Magor wrote a poem about guys who do that...Involves a lot of non soto voce discussions, making sure you let your engine idle at 4:00am... lots of noise packing up etc etc.... Yeah I know the type....

Bob's poem is called "Caravanning Bliss"

PeterD

Indeed it is, & it fits perfectly into this scenario. I'd publish the words but that would infringe copywrite & cause magor hassles.....

Mr Fawlty Instead of breaching copyright we can just tell the others that they can purchase his books from Site Link . They are a good read.

PeterD

That makes sense when you think about it, early model petrol engined cars with manual control choke etc, refused to get going until they warmed up a tad.!

Yes thats correct, after start checks in "most" light aircraft:

Engine 1000rpm
Oil pressure in 30 seconds, or immediate shutdown.

Macca

It's not much use asking a diesel mechanic. I have heard them recommend both idle warm up and drive away gently. I have also been told by some that my Discovery Td5 is not a direct injection motor because it has glow plugs – they argue that no direct injection motor has glow plugs.

PeterD

Member No 1,

"if i am not wrong ..not one answer from a diesel mech?...lots of theories but by wouild be mechanics"

What answer would you like to what question?

I'm a diesel mechanic from years ago, but getting old these days.

Bilbo

I'm an expert of anything on the internet.....I can be a diesel mechanic for you if you want me too! I'm also a fridgie when I've had a few ;-))

Leroy

thanks bilbo for clarifying your position...an oldie but a goodie eh?
what differnce does a pushroad v overhead camshaft mean?

i was always told...no taught , with petrol motors to start them and drive gently till up to temp....does this still apply to overhead camshafts petrol motors?...all cars owned by me have been pushrod types.......all cars with overhead cams were company owned...and we know they are always the fastest and can run with only a litre or so of oil for a year.......

so on latest TD 100 i drive gently until up to temp?

Member No1,

The basic underlying principle of starting up any engine, turbine, reciprocating pump, compressor etc, is this,

When an engine or any piece of machinery is cold and stationary, there is no (or very little) oil on any of the bearing surfaces. These surfaces include big end bearings, main bearings, pistons, cylinder walls, valve stems, camshafts - all are designed to have a film of pressurised oil (or splash oil in the case of a piston and cylinder) between them and whatever is running against 'em or in 'em.

When you start an engine from cold, the oil pressure is zero, the oil circulation is zero. So all the metal surfaces are literally scratching each other at high speed and high friction rates - ouch!

Start the motor and let the oil pressure build up. It only takes a few seconds. But that few seconds is where most engine wear occurs. These early seconds are where you can add 1000s of kms to yer engine life.

With modern multi-grade oils the oil will have sufficient lubrication properties to lubricate the moving parts even when it's cold - as long the oil pressure is up to normal. BUT - that doesn't mean that you can then thrash the arriss of it. The engine parts need to expand gradually to thier design operating temperature and this warm up is best done, not so much slolwy, but evenly is a better word.

So how should you start your TD100? Same as I used to start mine and any other engine. Hit the starter, put yer seat belt on, check the oil pressure is up (guage or light gone out), listen to motor and within 20 seconds you'll hear a few engine rattles disappear. That means oil is now circulating around your motor and all the gaps are sealed and all the bearings surfaces have oil on 'em.

Total time about 25 seconds.

Put it into gear and drive along a slightly subdued manner until the water temperature guage comes up to just under normal.

Total time about 15 minutes.

NOW you can thrash the arriss off it.

Bilbo

Member No1,

A psuhrod motor is old technology. It has it's camshaft located about halfway down the cylinder block and uses pushrods to open and close the valves that re located in the cylinder head. Overhead cam engines also have a camshaft that opens and closes the valves but the camshaft sits on top of the cylinder head and acts (in most cases) directly onto the valves. Some use rocker arms and some don't.

Overhead cam engines allow the design engineer to get better gas flow through better more sophisticated valve port design that you can't do with a pushrod engine and valve system. This gives better engine efficiency. BUT - an overhead cam system must have a full pressure lubrication system much like a crankshaft and big end bearings do. On the other hand, a push rod motor will get away with a low pressure, almost a drip feed system to the valves and associated bits.

Hnece when ya start a pushrod engine without the rocker box fitted, it's not much of an issue as there is not much oil up near the valves. But when ya start an overhead cam engine, that oil that feeds the camshaft is FULL engine oil pressure and it spreads further and faster than baby shcitt!!

There is no difference in how you start 'em or drive 'em.

Bilbo

"So how should you start your TD100? Same as I used to start mine and any other engine. Hit the starter, put yer seat belt on, check the oil pressure is up (guage or light gone out), listen to motor and within 20 seconds you'll hear a few engine rattles disappear." good to see i was doing the right thing.

but the girls can do it a bit quicker than us guys...... Hit the starter, put yer seat belt on, and drive.........if it doesnt go, blame hubby for not getting it fixed......

The only instructions on Starting in the Owners Manual states "The engine is well warmed up if the Coolant Temp Gauge needle starts to move.".

Because the Diesel wastes little heat, this can take a long time of Idling in winter ! I don't wait that long !

Mike

I've always driven my vehicle gently down the road when cold. Never had a problem with any of them.
Also what you say reinforces why short trips are bad for your oil!

Leroy

Good advice, with some educated facts to back it and I agree.

As the post above yours mentioned just drive the thing as soon as the oil pressure reaches normal pressure.

Funny thing is I am ½ way throe my trade as a Mechanical/ Diesel/ Marine Fitter; I just pulled out the Textbook for Diesel Engines some 600 pagers worth and had a flip throe the Index and not a thing about Engine warm up in there.

I would say you just stick to what is in the Manufactures Hand book as below and if 1-2 minutes at 1200rpm in an expensive peace of equipment like a John deer tractor is adequate then leaving the Patrol or whatever idling for 5-10 minutes before you drive it is just pointless I reckon.

Cheers.

.

Yeah, like Detroit Diesel 2-strokes on drill rig compressors.
I have heard that Detroits are specially designed to do this (start from cold and go straight to governed revs).

Peter

I don't know a lot about standby power gensets, but I know some do have water jacket heaters or crankcase heaters. They're supposed to keep the genset at a certain temp so that when they are required to start, they are ready to run at the revs required to produce the desired voltage (about 250 volts to get the phases synchronised with UPS power in the instance I'm thinking about). I guess that's the point about standby power; it has to be the correct voltage from the word go, so they have to run at certain revs from the word go. Some diesels may be designed to run from cold to full revs and others need heaters; no doubt those that rev the crap out of their cold engines could do with engine heaters.

I suppose that in other colder parts of the world, engine heaters are used for different reasons, but from what I've seen it is for easier starting and faster oil flow and pressure rise. Interesting subject,

Andrew

Kingsley N

Because more people could drive off in the Nissan than the Kenworth

(maybe)

Richard

and for that reason it is illegal to leave a vehicle running when unattended. oh and I am sure the insurance company would also be impressed!

Having said that I do it from time to time myself.....

Muddy

The Isuzu 700s and 750's have a recommendation that extended idle periods should have the revs bumped up to 1200 on the hand throttle for everything to work properly, including coolant pump, alternator, etc. That's in situations where they are required to idle for extended periods, not just for P breaks etc. That's probably irrelevant in the context of this post anyway.

Andrew