Why wagons in preference to dual cabs?

Wagons generally have much more rear leg room than dual cabs.

Wagons keep the dust out much better than aftermarket canopies.

Wagons keep the water out much better than aftermarket canopies.

Wagons are far more secure than canopies.

Most dual cabs are "tradies spec", they don't have all the bells and whistles of the wagons, both in mechanical spec and creature comforts.

I'm sure there's more ;-)

Most dual cabs are IFS with leaf springs so you have virtually no suspension travel....
If you are negotiating heavy undulating rutted tracks,,,, steep rutted creek exits etc etc,,, you will struggle quite a bit more than a coil sprung wagon....
Dual cabs are almost uncomfortable over long distances compared to wagons...
Their ride is rougher.....
Go test drive a Navara and then a Patrol.... or the same sorta thing in whatever brand and see...

Nearly bought a dual cab ( missin navara 2.5 t/d ) but found I would need to lose some serious weight to squeeze thru the front of it and my garage wall!! Too long for most "normal" garages. And too dear for a "truck". Stick discs on the back and some coils and drop the price a bit and I would probably buy one ( minus a foot in extra length )

I had a Defender 110 wagon, now gone the Dual cab 130 and building a special purpose cargo pod on the back to our specs.

The 110 & 130 Cab is the same squashed ergonomic space - but you gotta love it!

I went the dual cab rodeo for the following reasons:
-I like rodoes- it is my second Ive owned (previously had single cab), third Iv driven off road
-I didnt want to have a trailer
-need somewhere to carry the dogs, along with the fridge, tent, camping gear, jerry cans etc etc, I hat e wet dogs in cars, and one of ours has that real clingy white fur urrgh!
-economical (approx 10km per litre +/-)
-Price. A 02 rodeo cost me far less than it would to buy similair year in wagon
-size. Not as tall as a wagon, a bit narrower, but a bit longer
-No frills i.e. no electrics to clog up and go wrong etc
Performs well off road. I have had my rodeo many places that a moded toynisswoo has gone. Only need to keep in mind limitations and approach obstacles a little differently
-doent have the 'stigma' that is associated with toynisswoo's and their owners
-and my man hood is sufficient, hence I dont need to justify anything to myself or others by spending 10's of thousands on upgrades and wank factor LOLOLOLOL

At the end of the day, I like it, it suits our needs. We dont have a canopy as yet. I am looking at building a canvas one at the moment, however I survived this long without, a few more months (or years LOL) wont make too much difference.

Each to their own I say, if you like wagons and the vehicles attributes, get one. However if a dual cab suits your needs, go for it. What does surprise me is the amount of cut down toynisswoos roaming around. Obviously there are people out their looking for the comfort etc of a wagon, but the practicality of a uterus. I wonder if toyota or nissan will ever support this market (large 4wd that is)

my 2 bob

Mike

I agree....dual cab would be great!

If I had the cash, I'd love to get the back of my Patrol hacked off, and either lengthen the chassis or add a 3rd DRIVEN axle, and a lockable box (a la Telstra) added on.......t'would be great!!!!!

Cost of rego is cheaper for a wagon too.

I did all of the measurements between a Hilux DC and a 100 series. I looked at rego costs, economy, cabin space, cargo space, clearance, suspension etc...

I went th eDuel cab TD as iw was th ewinner in most categories. The only thing that the LC had that I would have liked was a rigid front end and a slightly more comfortable rear seat. The rear seat did not count as I sit in th efront and the suspension was no problem as the lux has a good LSD and whinch in case I get stuck with a front wheel in the air. So far suspension is not a problem and I have only been hung up once.

The ute had a far bigger (read 50%) larger carrying capacity with an ARB canopy. It leaks no dust or water and has never been broken into. The back is a hose out job which is far better than the wagon. You can throw in wet muddy recovery gear and it does not fog up all of the windows or make the car dirty. If anything rattles in the back you dont hear it.

Economy is about 25% better

depreciation is the same

Servicing is 20% cheaper as cheaper parts and a lot less oil

rego and insurance are 30% cheaper

They both do the speed limit

Interior size is only an inch narrower and rear leg space is only about 2 cm shorter

etc...

I paid 20 grand less for the vehicle and bought a boat and have change in the bank.

I am happy with the DC

I sat in the back seat of a duel cab and found it was really uncomfortable with the lack of angle. Decided that if I couldn't put up with that then I couldn't expect the kids to put up with it either after all they won't be travelling with mum and dad for much longer as it won't be 'kewl'.

Seating was never an issue as our GQ has always been a 5 seater.

Mrs S

Depends on the dual cab.

Tried a tray back for 5 years - and of course everything in the canvas canopied tray got fairly trashed on long trips not to mention the dust ingress etc but was all I could afford at the time.

Then I went to a troopy for 7 years and a fantastic vehicle but now the grubby bits that did not fit on the roof rack ended up inside with us, including the wet dog, not to mention having to clamber over everything to find the bits and pieces.

Now I've the best of both worlds with this current rig. Bucket loads of space, accessible all sides and everything stays relatively clean with canopy dust and waterproofed into the bargain.

My son with an LC 100 series wagon has no where near the carrying capacity so we find the dual cab becomes the "mule - pack horse" for extended trips and is often set up as a base camp.

Comfort in this dual cab is taken care of with after market seating and ride is improved by the extra wheel length which eliminates any choppiness in the ride.

My two bob's worth

When you have a ute, everyone is your friend,
and you get invites to every house move in the neighbourhood.

Ken

Good discussion. I have an RA Rodeo dual cab with canopy 4x4 diesel. Love it. For me its a work vehicle. Keep in mind utes are commercial vehicles and built to take heavy loads, and there's the catch. As a standard set up you can't have your cake and eat it too. Most wagons payloads are in the vicinity of 650-750 kgs. Add fuel accessories and gear and there ain't much left to play with. When I take the work gear out and go away I load it to the hilt with gear and family without coming close to 1000kgs. If I didn't use it for work I probably still have one. New models coming out from Toyota, Nissan and Mitsubishi are all looking pretty good, and I'm a Holden man from birth. Also with a canopy it makes for a secure dry payload area. Mate has 6x4 trailer with lid total 2 feet deep = around 48 cubic feet- heaps of room. Did the sums to his surprise. Tray of ute around 5x5 and 3 feet deep with canopy less wheel arches around 72 cubic feet of space. Packed properly you can takes heaps.

Mark

I happened to have a loan of a Hi Lux on the weekend whilst my Terracan was being used.

The Hi Lux drove like a truck in comparison. Not at all pleasant.

Versatility was my reason for grabbing a DC ute... I love wheeling, trail bikes and camping with the family... I can get two bikes on the back, the camper in tow and the family and have a good weekend... The canopy(which takes 10 mins to remove on my own) makes it more civilised for the day-to-day... Then there's the load capacity, which craps over any and all of the wagons...

Roachies on the money. Bigger dual cab with a decent tray. 130 system is good and if only Nissan and Toyota did the same with theirs. But still you can't have too many models to add to confusion.

I love my old Lux, very versatile, solid, simple, never have to wash it and the more I knock it around the better it gets....no worries at all.

Why do people buy dual cabs then spend heaps of bucks trying to turn them into wagons....

LOL

I wanted the room, comfort, towing capacity etc. As with nroachie and others, I would like to cut the back off mine, but I do use the 3rd row seats occasionally. The main things I want a tray for would be fuel and outboards, but the crocs are starting to get on my nerve a bit so the bigger boat is the vessel of choice now.

Although I would like a dual cab & slightly longer wheelbase, I can't agree with Roachie on the 6 wheelers. The ones we use at work are shockers, terrible turning circle, stuff breaks in the rear end a lot, during times of limited traction your poor steering is worse as the 4 rear wheels just give you woeful understeer. The OKA's we used to have were better, and I had a low opinion of them as well

Cheers Andrew

Hi Moose, all very good points. I agree that some may decide on wagons because they never considered the alternative. If you don't have youngsters, go the single-cab with more tray space.

It comes down to needs, personal preferences etc. I love the simplicity of a big standard diesel, their engine braking and low gearing and,of course, their life-span. Shopping for second-hand there are no dual-cab 4l+.

I love it when you guys come up with a really good post - this was an excellent question Moose and due to the varied and detailed responses, makes excellent reading - it has inspired me to take on this angle for a future article in the Vehicle Choices Topic.

...and for my 2cents worth - the female ego is less likely (in my opinion) to want to drive a ute/dual cab etc. Too blokely for sure, BUT with one exception - an F250 ;-)

I looked at dual cabs for weeks and weeks before I ended up with a GU patrol wagon. I have had a dual cab before but found the IFS front end to be limiting off-road, although very good on road. I did enjoy the ability to carry whatever I wanted in the back, smelly, dirty or whatever, and just hose it out.

The main reason for getting a wagon was to be able to sleep in it. I am over sleeping in a tent, and a rooftop camper is not an option for Jaqcui, niether is a swag. We do lots of one or 2 night trips and having all the bedding made up in the back ready to go is handy. The only downer is having to shift absolutely everything off the bed [fridge/clothes bag/fishing stuff/recovery gear] and transfer it to the front seats before we can sleep.

just went through that for some time. we wanted to buy our retirement
package and run it through the business for a few years. We wanted some
living space a larger boat, secure storage in the vehicle with alarm, comfort
to ride long distances, power for towing, not needing to slow down uphill,
GCVW sufficient for everything ... for us there was not a single car in Australia fitting the bill .. Wagon ? no .. where do you sleep when you tow a boat ? so .. ute only .. must be a crew cab .. extended cab too small for all my valuable photo gear, fridge etc. well crew cab is a dual cab here in aussieland I guess ... ok so ute it is ..
now where do you sleep ... ? tent ? no way .. too much effort .. not if you live in it for years .. so a bit more comfort please .. ok then .. slide on truck camper !!
hmmm ... weight.. size ? plus extra weight for towing, long range tanks ...
mid size truck camper 1.200Kg .. + 150Kg Diesel in long range tank + 300Kg toung weight + ? + ? ... no way an ordinary ute would carry that .. modification ? extended chassis ? dual axle ?? .. nope ... all these option use trays .. camper sits too high .. no useful ute in Oz with a normal pickup bed for a slide in ..
Ford 250 ? no .. not enough payload ... your overloaded very easily ... F350 ?
all sold .... no more ... chassis only ... basic trim only ... no crew cab ... hmmmm
so what to do ... ok .. only way .. bring in a dual wheel which does all we want ..
and thats exactly what we did ... our truck will be born on the 28th or August this year in Detroit ... they tell you the day when she's rolling off the belt ...
Crew cab, more leg room in the back than any jap car in the front, can load 2.5 tonnes on a 2.4m long bed ... only need 2.2t .. including everything ...
downside: .. its a dual wheel .. limited choices in wheels and tires .. well ok .. so be it .. more trouble in sand .. : ok .. enough space to carry a few grids and enough power to fly when necessary :)) .. width .. uff .. will have to make our own tracks .. :)) .. ok .. two extra spare tires .. wait a minute .. nothing we can do .. the boat trailer is 2.46 anyway .. same width as the truck ... can't go everywhere anyway .. ok we will leave the boat when we have to .. and we can leave the camper when we have to .. still can pack a tent and have all the room we need to sleep on the truckbed .. ah there is special ones for the bed .. pulled up in 2 minutes .. or we could sleep in the cabin and take our motorbikes on the back ? .. nah we put them on our 12000lb hitch ... no problem ... can we tow the boat ?
yep but not too much more stuff on the trailer .. maybe just 500-600 Kg .. why ? with a GCVW of 9860Kg and a tow capacity of 12000lb ?? well camper has an overhang of 24" and requires hitch extension ... hitch extension only has capacity of 8000lb with weight distribution and only if you use the Reese To Beast .. 12000lb hitch 2.5" ... ok then ... throw away the standard hitch and mount the beast ... ahh .. why not putting the standard hitch in the front ? ...want winch and winch mount .. so no room for hitch !? oh wait a minute .. I think I saw a grill guard with a winchmount and a light bar and front bars and a built in hitch reveiver ? does it fit my truck ?? hmmm .. not the diesel .. extra oilcooler in the way .... hmmm ... any other solution ? no .. all winch mounts for 9000lb winches only ... no hope .. want 12000 hydraulic ... want to keep my bumper ..
bloody truck ... get a standard 4wd .. ah can not .. weight ... camper already ordered ... etc etc etc ... :)) ... some of the decisions we went through ...
at the end of the day !! a ute/truck is the far more flexible solution in my opinion and can be adapted to more situations that any wagon ... for me a 4WD wagon is ok for short trips ... holidays etc .. but long term ... ute for me
regards
gmd

I used to own a 2001 Triton V6 GLS Dual Cab. I loved it - for me the decision at the time of purchase was based on available tray lengths - I need something that could fit two dirtbikes in the back (tailgate down).
It was a choice between the Triton and the Rodeo. Fantastic vehicle - did a few trips away in it, but because I was taking bikes away, or need to at short notice, the option of getting a canopy was discarded. I then bought a 21' fibreglass boat which weighes in at about 2.5T fully fuelled, etc.
Towing capacity was the major reason I offloaded the Triton and bought the Landcruiser. Now I know that some of you will say the Nissan Navara can tow 3T; but the cruiser was found alomst accidentally as a "plug-and-play" option - all ARB mods were done to it that could be done, and to this day I do not regret buying it.
Because I bought the Cruiser, I had to buy a 7x4 trailer, which I had custom-made wiht matching wheels for the cruiser (it cost me $1600).
The dual cab ute is an fantastic all-rounder, very handy and if you buy the right one and spec it out suspension-wise they're fine to drive around town.
The Triton did need a load in the back to soften the ride though.
The Cruiser fits more gear in it than the Triton did; primarily because you can load the cruiser up to the ceiling; remembering that I did not have a canopy on the Triton.

Cheers,
Dave

thought about posting this question last week, good on'ya Moose....

mate of mine was moving from old Navara to ? looked at them all but ended up with a DC LX Rodeo TD, manual ute. Has done him well although I question the integrity (wate/dust ingress) of the arb installed canopy (not up to the quality install i would demand.)

he took it on the drive for life (one N Mannell as convoy leader) and we recently spent a weekend travelling through the Ophir goldfields, across the Macquarie (no gold in the pans) down to Sailor's Bluff off the Bridle trail. We took the Daylight Crk trail to Blackbutt Mt trail and up the steep steps off Jackass Ck(where such a vehicle benefited from wheel placement guidance via portable UHF) then on through the Turon, Upper Turon, Blackfella's, Mtn Lagoon, Wheelbarrow Ridge to home.

Was impressed with the capability of the unit but only from the point of getting us through. We were only two and it was only three days but i do believe the rodeo may be the best vehicle gm offer at pres.

If a manufacturer made a full size dual cab with live axles, coils all round, and enough space for rear seats as a wagon then i would buy one. Until then i'll stick to my Patrol.

Looking at second hand it was Patrol or live axle hilux. i thought about the poor wheel travel of the leaf sprung hilux and my decision was made. Coil Patrol. Some may like IFS but to me a fourby should have live axles.

Barnesy