Refrigerators.........again!!!!!

Submitted: Sunday, Oct 29, 2006 at 22:01
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I have the chance to buy a Liemak refrigerator,,

I think, but not 100% sure that this company became Reefer a year or so ago.

Other than that I know zilch about the Liemak.

Anyway...anyone with an idea of what a Liemak fridge would be worth,,,,,,,guess it is about 4 years old and looks to be in fair nick.

Cheers
Michael
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Reply By: Willem - Sunday, Oct 29, 2006 at 22:15

Sunday, Oct 29, 2006 at 22:15
Hey Michael

Unless you are getting it for a song, say $50(lol)..............Rather invest in an Engel or a Waeco.

Remember the story about the peanuts and the monkeys.................................

Cheers
AnswerID: 201697

Follow Up By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:02

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:02
You have never heard me sing....lol lol

Seriously, for a minute, at the right price could do until I make THE DECISION...
Engel or Waeco or ??????????

Cheers
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Reply By: Member - Jiarna (NT) - Sunday, Oct 29, 2006 at 22:46

Sunday, Oct 29, 2006 at 22:46
I rented a Liemack a few years ago and it just about put me off 12/24V fridges for life! The fire brigade I was a member of back then also had one, and it went back 3 times in the first year for repairs.

The company that made Liemack is Refrigeration Research, so yes they now market the same fridge as a Reefer.

Perhaps I was just unlucky (twice!) with the Liemack (Reefer) but I now own a Waeco. You never know, you might get a good one - but ...... why is it for sale??

Cheers
John
AnswerID: 201706

Follow Up By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:05

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:05
Hi Jiarna,

The guy that owned, my next door neighbor -or was, died some months ago.

I know that he had not had it too long, so depending on the price may, or may not be, a bargain.

Cheers
Michael
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Reply By: Geoff (Newcastle, NSW) - Sunday, Oct 29, 2006 at 22:51

Sunday, Oct 29, 2006 at 22:51
Nike ad, just do it!!

Top fridge, very easy on batteries, very efficient.
Dollar value? No idea, pay as little as you can, obviously. They aren't "main stream" so you could use that as a bargaining point.

Geoff.
Geoff,

Grey hair is hereditary, you get it from children. Baldness is caused by watching the Wallabies.

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AnswerID: 201709

Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Sunday, Oct 29, 2006 at 23:10

Sunday, Oct 29, 2006 at 23:10
Geoff!! "easy on batteries". Check out my post below. They are anything but!! That is their main problem.. Michael
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Follow Up By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:07

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:07
Geoff/Michael,

Thanks for your input guys, I have the standard twin battery set-up and a reasonable solar panel....and if all else fails will use the..sssshhhhh generator.

Cheers
Michael
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Reply By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Sunday, Oct 29, 2006 at 23:07

Sunday, Oct 29, 2006 at 23:07
Hi Michael, I have had a 90 litre dtv Liemack for 7 years. It has performed faultlessly for the entire time..The problem is only in the huge amount of power they suck. They have a 240volt compressor and a 12volt inverter to run it so it has some losses through the inverter BUT it has the BEST cooling capacity of any fridge. It requires 2 good batteries in parallel and you need to drive your vehicle every day. They have have a smart internal layout with a seperate freezer in the DTV model and no need for a fridge slide with both models as the door drops down fron the side and not the top as most fridges. Battery cutout level can be set and are reliable. But you will need to drive or run your vehicle by about 10am if you pull into camp mid afternoon the previous day. A insulated cover will help and or tinted rear windows to keep the heat of the fridge.. They are a bit of a pain because of the monitoring needed because of the huge power drain.. They are very heavy and if you are only going out for the day, it seems not worth the effort to drag the thing to the car, the 90 litre is about 36 kgs and is a struggle on your own. Having said all that, i think i would buy another but i would definately check out what is available new on the market before i did so.. Hope this helps Michael
AnswerID: 201714

Reply By: TerraFirma - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 14:12

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 14:12
Read this interesting..

Site Link

AnswerID: 201798

Follow Up By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:18

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:18
Thanks TerraFirma, interesting read.

I guess the bottom line is 'is it value for money??'

Most, if not all fridges will perform satisfactorily depends on individual likes and dislikes.

Will wait to see what money is involved and call it as I see it.

BTW my brother used to play drums in a band called TerraFirma..nothing to do with fridges but interesting.

Cheers
Michael
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Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:31

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:31
They are definately hard on batteries regardless. Maybe the 90 litre fridge has something to do with the power drain as opposed to the 50litre as tested. I think they use the same compressor in all models so the 90litre would work harder and the 50 litre probably really efficient. Anyway they are a great fridge but as with all products, they have their good and bad points.. Michael
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Reply By: JR - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:33

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:33
Michael,
Yes they are reefer now, Trisan look after inverters. Look up the website. They havent changed much.
Ive now had a DT50 for 7 years, going well. Its a 240v compressor running through an inverter
They use alot of power but dont run for very long. Around 3Amps per hour average Ive found. The benefit here is they have much more cooling capacity up thier sleeve than others.
They are very expensive to buy and are truly commercial grade, ensure you understand cable requirements before installing as they need heavy cables to prevent voltage loss.
I recommend them highly
JR
AnswerID: 201819

Follow Up By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:43

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:43
Thanks JR,

6mm from the aux battery and a decent Hella plug in the back with a 30amp in-line fuse. Trust that will suffice, my sparkie seems to think so.

Cheers
Michael
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Follow Up By: JR - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:00

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:00
Michael,
I reckon not
Standard supplied wiring loom is minimum 10mm2 and I would use 50Amp andersen plugs especially if its in the back of a ute or wagon. ie more than a few meters of cable. They also recommend a 30AMP HRC fuse to keep voltage drop low. Tell your sparkie it draws 30+Amps on start up and must have zero voltage drop. He is thinking normal 12v fridges.
In my last vehicle Ive gone heavier still.
If you get this part wrong it will give you headaches, wont pull in, use heaps more power, eventually it wrecks inverter.
JR
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Follow Up By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:42

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:42
I will get him to check it out, thank you.

Michael
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Reply By: Member No 1- Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:59

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:59
check the archives micheal

the units which have 240v compressors have an inbuilt inverter which allows them to run on 12v......these use a mitsubishi compressor which is oversized for the job...great cooling no doubt about it, but can you keep up with the power it will require

i believe the newer 12v units use the 12v danfoss compressor
the 12v units with danfoss compressor should be ok

good luck...

AnswerID: 201827

Follow Up By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:47

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:47
G'day #1,

Had a look first but only found one thread,,,,,but I reckon I got the wrong spelling.

Will have another go.

Cheers
Michael
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 17:00

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 17:00
try 30407 for starters or 15611 or type in wanker where I used that word to describe someones intelligence

refrigeration research

else believe me and dont get the 240v compressor model...no matter what refrigeration research or anyone else says to back them up...they are energy hungry

on no what have i done...this will bring em all...the liemack and reefer experts out form under their stupid excuse for a fridge
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Follow Up By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 18:18

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 18:18
I dunno, you've gone and done it again..........lol

-thanks for your help tho'

Cheers
Michael
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Follow Up By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 20:53

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 20:53
Nudie......I've just read those two posts and I am more bluddy confused than ever........think I'll tell her to stick her fridge....too much hard work..LOL LOL

Cheers
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FollowupID: 461291

Follow Up By: Member No 1- Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 08:35

Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 08:35
it will soon be time for it......buy her :))) the fridge for xmas
just get a one of the major brands....waeco engel etc etc
or even a trailblaza..big n bulky but good
i prefer the units with a danfoss compresser as any good fridgie can fix. the engels require specialist test gear when the need arises to check the heart of the system. otherwise both systems are good
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Reply By: Outnabout David (SA) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 17:35

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 17:35
Michael,

The liemack is a good fridge but you must use big wiring and the best is to just buy it from reefer or what ever they trade under at MT Barker. If you have trouble let me know and I will go get it for you as I work a couple of minutes away from them. I had a 50Litre DTV fridge freezer and worked a treat.

Yes they do draw a lot of power on start up but only run for as short period of time.
I thought I had trouble with mine and they actually lent me their test equipment over a weekend. I have the figures somewhre at home but from memory while the start up drew more amps the overall useage over a 48 hr period woked out to be the same as engels/waeco's etc. They are a heavy fridge in comparison and have simple components that any fridge mechanic could fix anywhere rather than having to be fixed by an approved repairer.

But I must stree make sure the batteries are fine and get the correct wire otherwise you will have nothing but trouble and will be dissapointed.

The only people that I have seen dissappointed are thiose that skimp on the wiring or people who listen to hearsay aboout the current draw at startup and assumke wrongly it draws this all the time. If it is at a fair price then buy it and enjoy.

If you want more info or data the MM me offline.

AnswerID: 201838

Follow Up By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 18:19

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 18:19
Thank you David..MM on its way.

Cheers
Michael
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Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 07:48

Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 07:48
Thats a fair and reasonable assesment David.. Michael
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Reply By: acdc - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 19:58

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 19:58
They are unreliable and power thirsty!! don't touch it!!
AnswerID: 201862

Follow Up By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 20:11

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 20:11
acdc,

Take your point, but is what you say from personal experience??

I have absolutely no idea, so am looking for as much info as possible,,,,,but from a first hand experience if poss.

Cheers
Michael
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Follow Up By: acdc - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 21:43

Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 21:43
I was a dealer for Liemack fridges,the odd person would have a great run out of them but the majority were unreliable.
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 08:29

Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 08:29
micheal....the figures quoted by reefer for the 240v compresser unit does not allow for losses in the inverter....
they only compare compresser efficiency in their calculations...they just happen to refrain from mentioning inverter losses, dont they?

an inverter is around 85% efficient...so around 15% of the power used from the battery is lost in the inverter.
they are fast to cool down as outnabout david says.....the reason is as i said earlier...the compresser is oversized.....too hard to explain losses to a layman re the losses involved in the use of an oversized compresser.....if it was good why dont all manufacturers do this ...look at a domestic fridge...do they put in a compresser that is say double the duty the required duty ...uh uh.... ok look at the 12v fridge market....do waeco, tralblaza etc etc use the largest (or even next sized) compresser in their fridges...NO! the more oversized they are they less efficient the system becomes...its best to have a compresser duty matched as close as possible to the refrigeration duty. then we have the other factors as well...like effect of the lower refrigerant pressures have on a/the compresser....a big compresser pulls lower suction pressures and the compresser efficiency drops off. all losses of energy....

what does it all mean...if you get the 240v compresser unit take a genny with you. the battery wont last as long if you had a similar 12v compreser job.

dont get me wrong...i am not knocking the quality of the product as such.
my credentials can be seen in many fridges /freezers and more lately commercial airconditioning repairs and system design and installation.
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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 08:36

Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 08:36
ps ..i have to blow my own trumpet cos no one else will hahaha
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Follow Up By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 09:16

Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 09:16
Thanks guys,

#1, I understand what you are saying, thanks.

acdc, I guess it comes back to value for money, if I pay a 'reasonable' price and get a 'reasonable' run out of I should expect nothing else.

-anyway if I do get it and it doesn't perform I can always flog it off to some unsuspecting person.....providing they do not read this forum........ LOL LOL

Thanks again to all who had an input.

Cheers
Michael

Reckon the next post should be about tyres;)))))))))
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Reply By: silkwood - Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 10:38

Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 10:38
Michael, there are many who will give you their opinion, sometimes well based in fact, sometimes theory. I have had a refrigeration mechanic tell me Liemack are useless, and an engineer specialising in refrigeration for the wine industry tell me how good his was.

My bottom line: yes you do have to have the right set-up (wiring, batteries) and yes they do draw more but, inverter losses not withstanding, if set up properly they perform brilliantly, particularly in very hot conditions. I have had my (50lt) for five years and had some trouble setting it up (usually the reason many get rid of them or knock them) but it has performed in situations where other (popular)makes have struggled (or failed). Would I buy another? YES!

Cheers,

Mark
AnswerID: 202016

Follow Up By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 10:59

Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 10:59
Mark,

Thanks for that, bit like beauty........all in the eye of the beholder;))))))

Cheers
Michael
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Follow Up By: silkwood - Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 11:02

Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 11:02
I'm lucky, my partner has terrible eyesight!

Cheers,

Mark
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Reply By: Member - Norm C (QLD) - Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 13:39

Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 13:39
Michael, I'm not sure what you can make of the variety of opions and information presented in response to your question. Unfortunately an opinion on fridges is like an @rsehole. Everyone has one.

In my view, many of the opinions expressed above are quite unhelpful and quite wrong, but as an opinion, I guess the poster is entitled to it; as long as it is clearly expressed as an opinion and not a fact. On the other hand, much of what can be interpreted as 'statement of fact' or first hand experience above reflect my experience as well.

I am not an expert, but I've had a Reefer 70 Litre DTV (dual temp, verticle) for a couple of years. I bought it largely because of it's shape and front opening, but I did a fair bit of web based research before buying it.

As I understand it, the current Reefer is based substantially on the previous Liemark, but there have been some changes in programming etc.

My fridge is very well built. Powder coated steel outside, all stainless steel inside. It probably uses a little more power than similar ones from other brands, but not dramatically so. I normallly get 2 days running from a 120AH battery, but this varies with ambient temp. On a recent 16 week trip to Kimberly, NT and far North Qld, I ran two 120 AH AGMs. We had many stops of between 2 and 7 days and I only ran the generator 5 or 6 times on the trip. The fridge performed perfectly. It was particularly good at 'pulling down' warm stuff to cold. Meat put in the freezer or drinks put in the fridge were frozen or cooled in about the same time as our home fridge takes. My brother in law has an Engle. Also a good fridge, but it has much less 'pull down' capacity. On a recent trip to Fraser Island, he had it running as a freezer. He put a heap of fish fillets in it to freeze. Three days later they were still a bit soft.

My fridge is cabled via 10mm sq cable.

So, I support the following views:
It (based on mine) is a very good fridge.
It may draw a little more power than similar sized Engles etc, but it seems to have much greater cooling capacity.
If you get it, I recommend a good deep cycle battery, as large as you can carry and afford and minimum 10mm sq cable.
If it is inn good working order and the price is right, it is probably a good buy.

Another fact to consider. I believe Refrigeration Research has gone out of business. Their strength was in portable commercial refrigeration, but this is not a big market. Their smaller fridges (like mine) were just too expensive to compete with Engle, Waeco and the many other brands, which are also good fridges, just with different capabilities.

I paid just under $2,000 for my fridge (RRP at the time was around $2,200). I have seem my fridge recently on a clearance sale in a local camping store for $1,500. Warranty is not an issue for you. Service may be, but due to their design, any fridge mechanic should be able to find his way around it.

Good luck with sorting the wheat from the chaff in the responses you have received.

A thought: If it is your neighbour who has it, see if you can borrow it for a couple of days for a trial. No need for any science, just some basic tests. Can you get 24 hours (or close) from a reasonable deep cycle battery (with cold contents). Will it cool warm beer in a 'reasonable' time.
AnswerID: 202041

Follow Up By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 14:02

Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 14:02
Afternoon Norm,

Thank you for your response, it was an honest post of mine with no hidden agenda at all and I appreciate yours, and everyone elses input..

As you say, everyone is entitled to an opinion, and nobody should have a problem with that, however good to hear some first hand experiences on which to try and base a decision........after all this whatever way it goes could be wrong.......lol lol

True there is a lot of chaff among the wheat but fun sorting it out.....I think;))

Have already thought of borrowing it but need to be a bit tactfull given the circumstances.

Thanks again
Michael
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