pirelli atr tires v coopers st v bfg atr

Submitted: Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 20:48
ThreadID: 44941 Views:13532 Replies:13 FollowUps:21
This Thread has been Archived
gda guys know this subject done a fair bit. but im having problems deciding on replacement tires for my r51 pathfinder, currently fitted with factory tyres only 20000k on them. We are about to start a 3 month tour up north and across to Darwin maybe capeyork. Towing an off-road poptop 1800kilo. was going to fit pirrelli at as recommend by 4wd monthly some time ago, but not available anymore only new pirelli atr dont know what they are like. i want good grip on bitumen but also want good offroad ability too. Cooper st or stt will be good in victorian mud tracks but how will they be on Bitumen? Other Forumites seem to like the BFG ats so everytime a make up my mind about a set someone will tell me about another tyre.
The current factory tyres are continentals seem ok on the bitumen and not too bad offroad but i need grip in mud... any suggestions would be handy we leave in 6 weeks so have to make up my mind soon thanks.
Back Expand Un-Read 0 Moderator

Reply By: Wayne-o - Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 21:01

Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 21:01
BFG's are the best....rest are SH_T...
or is that...Coopers are the best....
no hang on bridgestone, yeah bridgestone are the best....wait, what's that?
No....Dunlop are the best.......or is it? Yes it is, the Pirelli's are better.....
NO NO NO, its the Coopers!!!
NO, the BFG's

AnswerID: 236973

Follow Up By: Member - andrew G (VIC) - Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 21:37

Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 21:37
Thanks for the advice So your sying the tires are all the same. I begining to think that anyway..
0
FollowupID: 498024

Reply By: SA_Patrol - Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 21:02

Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 21:02
Whats wrong with the tyres you have now ?
Replace them then you have to.

AnswerID: 236976

Follow Up By: Member - andrew G (VIC) - Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 21:39

Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 21:39
Yes I might just do that but not sure how well the standard continentals will handle 3 months on gravel and rock...???
0
FollowupID: 498026

Follow Up By: SA_Patrol - Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 22:29

Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 22:29
The manufacturers shouldn't stick them on new 4wds if they're going to fail.
they aren't worth anything if you sold them so maybe you could wear them out first, don't deflate them down too much and you'll be fine.
0
FollowupID: 498039

Follow Up By: Member - andrew G (VIC) - Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 23:08

Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 23:08
coming to the conclusion i save me self heap of money and not bother.
wait till they wear out.
0
FollowupID: 498047

Follow Up By: marq - Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 07:03

Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 07:03
If normal H/T tyres - they will fail on dirt roads (I am talking from experience), particularly if they have done over 10k - punctures aren't the problem, H/T's normally blow-out and destroy themselves.

Recommend you obtain A/T tyres if your driving over dirt roads - most of the major brands are ok - just watch the load ratings are up to spec.
0
FollowupID: 498072

Follow Up By: Member - andrew G (VIC) - Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 09:52

Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 09:52
Thanks marq will do that AT for trip, Dont trust the Conti,s on the pathy (not for 3 months on dirt and gravel ) and towing 2 ton of van.
0
FollowupID: 498098

Reply By: Member - Olcoolone (SA) - Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 21:55

Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 21:55
Did a survey the other day on this exact subject.....interviewed 9000 people.

3001 said BF Goodridge
2999 said Coopers
3000 said Pirelli

All off road tyres are going to be better then what you have already, yours would be highway tyres at the moment.

Nobody makes a tyre that is good in the wet on road and good in the dry or good in the mud, that is why alot of people have a couple of sets of tyres.

We have Cooper ATR for every day and medium off roading and never had a problem, we also have a set of cooper st's not as good on the road, not as good in the wet and abit louder but great off road.

It all depends what driving you are going to do there will be a noticable differance between the Pirelli ATR / BFG ATR and the Cooper ST, the Pirelli and BFG are much the much for every day driving and off roading whereby the Cooper ST is more designed for off roading, you have discribed 2 differant types of tyres.

To match the Pirelli ATR / BFG ATR you need to go to a Cooper ATR and to match the Cooper ST you will need to go to a more agresive tyre in the Pirelli / BFG range than the ATR's.

Hope it makes sense.

Regards Richard

AnswerID: 236997

Follow Up By: Member - andrew G (VIC) - Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 22:14

Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 22:14
Thanks I know i was asking a bit much out of a tire to do all i want. I was originally going to fit the agressive coopers st for my trip and save my road tires for when we get back . Then buy another set of rims for the coopers for future offroad work in vic.
Just a bit concernerd about using the Cooper st on bitumen while we are on our trip regarding grip I know the muddies will be great in the rought stuff but there is an awfall lot of bitumen between melb and up north.
0
FollowupID: 498037

Follow Up By: Member - Olcoolone (SA) - Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 22:50

Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 22:50
The Cooper ST's will be fine on the black top, the biggets advantage is punture resistance, there are so many types of tyres avaliable.

Don't get ST's mixed up with mud tyres, there is a special tyre for mud, ST's will work good in the mud, great on dirt, great on rocks OK on the black top, but not so good in sand, a mud tyre will work fantastic in mud, so so on dirt, OK on rocks, poor on the black top and bad in sand.

A standard HT tyre will out performe a mud or off road tyre in sand.

All types of 4x4 tyres will be good, you may just have to go slower in some terrain than others.

regards Richard
0
FollowupID: 498041

Reply By: Trevor M (SA) - Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 22:56

Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 22:56
Don't go the Pirelli's. I have posted many times regarding the sidewall damage I experienced. (sorry to the regular readers who I may have bored to death).

Cheers
Trev
AnswerID: 237020

Follow Up By: Member - andrew G (VIC) - Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 23:10

Monday, Apr 30, 2007 at 23:10
Ok thanks been told by a few others about pirellis wearing out quick too and sidewalls stuffing up
0
FollowupID: 498048

Reply By: Member - Tim - Stratford (VIC) - Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 09:19

Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 09:19
Andrew,

I've never had a problem with the Coopers ST's - HOWEVER - they do not wear as described (for me). I have adjusted pressures etc when fully loaded and off road but the best I got out of the set of ST's was 45,000kms. I have just taken them off as I had another set (2x spares + camper tyres). There was only about 5mm left after the 45k.

I never had an issue with on-road driving. They are a bit noisey - not as much as BFG M/T's and not as noisey as a roof rack. They never let me down in the bush, although I mainly drive on tracks in the High Country - not much mud at the moment.

The new ones on my truck did left me down on the weekend - just filled with clay and no traction - pressure was dropped right down and I had to winch twice. I don't think any other tyre would have performed any better unless it was a M/T type.

I'm thinking of going back to the BFG M/T's - but I've got a while to wait (and save as I'll get 8!!! Truck + Camper) This is only because I'd rather put up with noise and increase my chances of not having to winch whilst offroad and I think the BFG M/T's will last longer than the Coopers. (I got 87,000+ out of the BFG M/T on my Hilux).

Some more info for you to decipher :-)
AnswerID: 237058

Follow Up By: Member - andrew G (VIC) - Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 09:48

Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 09:48
Thanks tim you know what the muds like down here . set of muddies would solve my problems too, but you think i would get away with them on the highway untill we get back to melb. really need two more sets i think bit pricy ie AT for trip on highway and muddies for the mud.. will figure it out soon LOL
0
FollowupID: 498097

Reply By: The Esplanade - Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 09:25

Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 09:25
I am also in the same position. Have at present x4 Cooper ATR's LT285x75x16's.
Looking at getting another x2 as spares for a trip out west. After reading the posts on Coopers looking at getting something else.
Are the thoughts with the BFG's and Goodyear's apply for all sizes and LT models?
Are the Coopers in the LT range ok and the problems are only with the standard patterns/construction?
All very confusing!!
Andrew
AnswerID: 237060

Reply By: Member - lyndon K (SA) - Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 10:21

Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 10:21
No nothing about the Pirelli's, had a set of Coopers once, ONCE. Never again!!
Good luck
Now is the only time you own
Decide now what you will,
Place faith not in tomorrow
For the clock may then be still

Member
My Profile  My Position  Send Message

AnswerID: 237064

Reply By: Member - Brian H (QLD) - Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 10:25

Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 10:25
As I see it ......... does not matter what tyre you have someone will say they are S$IT and what they have is better. Its fair enough to listen to advise but in the end the decision will be yours.

I am in the same situation sort off however I am not hard and fast one brand or the other. I run at the moment Cooper ATR 225 75 16 why because I got a fantastic deal when I purchased them and to date they have not let me down with a Cape Trip and a number of off road runs (not extreme stuff). Still got plenty of tread with 50000 on them.

I managed a run to the tyre places yesterday. So I have the following you can consider.

Cooper ATR - Speed rating 170 klm Load rating 115 kg
BFG - AT - Speed rating 180 klm - Load rating 110Kg
Goodyear Wrangler "Silent Armour" - Speed rating 170 klm - load rating 160 kg
Maxis - Speed rating 210 klm - Load Rating 110 kg
Micky Thompson ATZ - Speed rating 170 klm - load rating 115 kg

Costing
Cooper ATR = $ 243.00
Micky Thompsons = $ 228.00
BFG - AT = $ 230.00
Goodyear SA = $ 259.00
Maxis = $ 187.00

The pesron I was specking with with Maxis tyres and they sell most of the above brands apart from MT and Coopers when I asked about the thinkness of the side walls he said it's not as think as the Coopers but the tyre shop in Darwin Coopers are the most punchered tyre they get to repair or replace. Food for thought?

Mind you, stats can be rigged to read what you want. He also said that the speed rating of tyres is now not required not sure what he meant by that as I had to go before I could get a answer on that.

So where do I sit at the moment the same as I was yesterday to be honest confused LOL. Its hard to move away from the Coopers as they have faired well but If I can get the same out of say the Maxis I will save $66.00 a tyre or two cartons of beer :).

Brian


AnswerID: 237066

Follow Up By: Member - andrew G (VIC) - Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 11:36

Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 11:36
Hi Brian thanks that info is great .. It is very hard to choose...Now to make things even more confusing Thought i would actually do some research on the tyres allready fitted Continentals thoght they were cheap and chearfull nissan specials but the continental website says otherwise.. Very big overseas and the tyres fitted get a good report Bugger.... mayas well leave them on and wait till i come back from trip....??? problem also the guy supplieng my new tyres was giving me a great deal on a new electrick winch nearly 200 bucks off retail price.....and i will need a winch have a hand winch which is great but dam hard to use...not 21 anymore LOL
0
FollowupID: 498108

Follow Up By: The Esplanade - Thursday, May 03, 2007 at 16:08

Thursday, May 03, 2007 at 16:08
Hi Brian
Thay re great prices. Is that for fitting and balancing as well?
I am in Hervey Bay and they want a lot more than the prices you have quoted.
Regards
Andrew
0
FollowupID: 498738

Reply By: Shaker - Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 11:37

Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 11:37
Checkout Post 44831.
AnswerID: 237074

Reply By: dawesy - Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 11:41

Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 11:41
Funny, saw a thread yesterday that was about as long as this just bashing coopers, with the odd 'BFGs are better'. When I first got the coopers all I read on this same site was how bleep BFGs were and Coopers rocked. Seems to be the opposite now, though this thread is favouring the coopers.

I happen to run STs and love them for what I do, tool around town, plenty of open bitumen, play on the weekends in the state forests, go bush once or twice a year in the snowies for a week. Not a chip on them, despite clambering up a set of rocks where my mate tore whole lugs of his Kumo Muddies, and done that climb about 4 times now.

I'm starting to think it's really down to the driver. No matter what brand it is someone has destroyed one. Well, for what it's worth, mine get smashed around the wattagans every 4-5 weeks at 40PSI because I haven't got my compressor yet and they've been run over their fair share of tree roots, rocks, fallen branches and god knows what in the bottom of bog holes. Not a chip on them after 40k about 1/2 worn i'd guess.
AnswerID: 237076

Follow Up By: Shaker - Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 23:45

Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 23:45
Coopers are chip very badly on Gibber tracks in the Outback.
Without a doubt, the worst tyres that I have ever had, also the dodgiest warranty & their rep failed to honour his verbal promises, even after I had asked for it in writing, & he said his word was his bond!
0
FollowupID: 498321

Follow Up By: dawesy - Wednesday, May 02, 2007 at 18:57

Wednesday, May 02, 2007 at 18:57
A lot of people complain about the warranty. It states very clearly it doesn't cover you the minute you leave the blacktop. Yes it's a gimick, but anyone who reads should know where they stand long before they damage a tyre. I must admint I find it strange so meany people bring it up, it's not like they try to hide anything.
0
FollowupID: 498488

Follow Up By: Shaker - Saturday, May 05, 2007 at 16:10

Saturday, May 05, 2007 at 16:10
Then why have their "warranty" advertised on a poster showing red dirt & a Leyland brother??????
0
FollowupID: 499191

Follow Up By: dawesy - Monday, May 07, 2007 at 09:52

Monday, May 07, 2007 at 09:52
That would be called marketing. Anyone who fails to do basic research on a product can't really complain.

I do mean basic too, try the first item on their web-page about the warranty
www.coopertyres.com.au/cooper/warranty.htm

That's one click from the front page of the website.
0
FollowupID: 499445

Follow Up By: Shaker - Monday, May 07, 2007 at 10:51

Monday, May 07, 2007 at 10:51
I don't know what 'barrow you have to push', but I would call it trickery & I work in retail sales including 17 years in the motor industry!
The simple fact is the warranty is crap, the tyres are crap & their representative lies through his teeth .... end of story.
0
FollowupID: 499454

Follow Up By: dawesy - Monday, May 07, 2007 at 12:32

Monday, May 07, 2007 at 12:32
Don't have any barrow to push. I relayed my experiences with the tyres, which are very positive, in the terrain I do. So for people who do similar things the tyre comes highly recommended from me.

I don't see how a clearly worded warranty can be called trickery. Yeah it's an advertising gimmick, but that's hardly uncommon these days. If you got screwed by an individual dealer that's one thing, but it takes 15 seconds effort to get the required details direct from the manufacturer. While you dealt with a crappy individual it has nothing to do with the manufacturer of the tyre.

0
FollowupID: 499461

Follow Up By: Chris & Debbie - Monday, May 07, 2007 at 13:56

Monday, May 07, 2007 at 13:56
I run cooper ATR and have had no problems with them but also use them for their intended purpose, I have had Pirelli in the past and found them to be a very good tyre, again, for the intended purpose which is mainly highway use, they would not stand up to low pressures over rough terrain but again they are not made for this,
Dawesy, if you read the Cooper Warranty it states that it Does cover off-road use (not ST-C or STT as no warranty on these) but warrants against manufacturing or material defects not damage from road hazards. which I Think is fair enough.
Some people seem to think you can get a stake jammed through the side or drive over razor shape rocks and still be covered by warranty.
Chris
0
FollowupID: 499475

Reply By: Moose - Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 13:58

Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 13:58
G'day Andrew
Take care with Coopers if you go that way. The STs are renowned for chipping badly on rocky terrain (have had this happen myself). They brought out an STC which supposedly is chip reistant - don't know if it is.
STT is the mud pattern - good tyres. Look good. I had the old STT pattern for a couple of sets but I hated wearing them out on the bitumen so went to a less aggressive AT tyre (different brand due to cost issue). Haven't heard how the new STT pattern goes wear wise. Really best suited to lots of off-road stuff.
Have a mate that has always had Pirellis with no problems.
If the current ones are not too worn I'd stick with them unless they are a really soft road tyre.
Cheers from the Moose
AnswerID: 237116

Follow Up By: Member - andrew G (VIC) - Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 23:31

Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 23:31
Thanks Moose first reply about pirellis dont seem to popular, Well ill make up my mind soon. Justabout over tyres LOL STT sound like they would be good.
0
FollowupID: 498317

Reply By: Member - Olcoolone (SA) - Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 19:47

Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 19:47
I would forget about all these brand name tyres......so many people have issues with them, I would go Nankang; now there's a tyre noboby complains about....must be good!

Regards Richard
AnswerID: 237224

Follow Up By: Shaker - Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 23:47

Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 23:47
I now use Firestone RMT, about $100 per tyre less than my Cooper STs, & much better. Unfortunately they don't have a large range of sizes.
0
FollowupID: 498322

Reply By: Member - Davoe (Nullagine) - Wednesday, May 02, 2007 at 19:25

Wednesday, May 02, 2007 at 19:25
Have you considered the Goodyear MTR tyre? not the best wearing tyre but probably the strongest radial tyre available (the 15s are of course a bit less robust than the 16s ) they will also slay the the BFG AT for rocky traction (head to head comparison)
Many people run them but yet you wont find too much bad written about them ----- Unlike coopers so many unsatisfied customers cant be wrong.
very good on bitumen for grip wet or dry
AnswerID: 237478

Sponsored Links