Winch vs. Diff Lockers

Probably not the response you are looking for but my Ti has a rear locker as standard. I have fitted a winch but never had to use it "in anger" as every time I have got stuck the locker has extracated us. Nothing too extreme mind you.

Trev

Adam, I have had the same thoughts, and today I put in a set of front auto lockers. Air lockers have too many failure points and a elec winch has limited usage. I've got a LSD in the rear so front auto lockers were it! Tested them out this arvo and I'm impressed.
I believe that you should be looking at rear auto lockers to kill two birds with one stone - 1. A set of lockers and 2. Replacing your weak LSD in Prado. This is what I've been told by mates with the same model as you. I believe Lokka have almost finished developing new Prado rear Lokka. Worth a phone call.

Phill

P.S I have no ties with 4WD Systems - in fact I've found them to be quite rude but it seems their product aint too shabby!!

Front locking device, your choice of type.

G'day Adam,
I went through the same thought process last year just before i did a solo trip to Cape York in my 04 Prado. The general concensus seemed to be to fit diff lockers and take a tirfor along for good measure. I went with both front and rear ARB lockers and was amazed at what a difference they made. I have to say the rear is by far the most usefull out of the two as the front essentially locks the stearing in a straight line. The lockers not only allow you to get through areas that would previously have been impassible but reduce the strain on the vehicle (no wheels spinning and the need for momentum/speed to carry you through)and certainly make negotiating slippery/loose slopes much more controlled.
A few words of warning though, whilst the lockers got me through many areas that i would not even have attempted without them, they are also more than capable of getting you into a whole world of hurt, ie all four wheels up to the axles instead of just 2 in the soft stuff!! Thats where the titfor came in.
To sum up i would recomend the rear diff lock, front if you can afford it and then the powered winch. I finished up fitting an electric winch after i got back in preparation for future trips. If you are going anywhere on your own invest in a tirfor.

Depends what you're going to do.

If most of your journeys will be with another vehicle and/or into not very remote country and you want to play in mud or similar then some sort of locker would probably be better for you along with a snatch strap etc.

otoh if, like me, most of your trips are solo and into areas where I wouldn't expect to see another vehicle then a winch has to be the better option because I know (99.5%) that with a winch (hand) and some hard work I _can_ get unstuck - may take a day or two in really bad cases but it'll happen - lockers don't guarantee that.

Horses for courses.

Mike Harding

Having had front and rear air lockers and a winch (not Prado mind you) I would go with lockers as I don't wheel alone and add a winch down the line if funds or need arises but for solo travel some sort of winch would be useful. I use my rear locker a fair bit, the front once in a while and the winch just about never but when I need it I do need it. Just a reminder that front and rear lockers mean that you actually have full 4wd capability unlike those with open diffs or even LSD's.

Hi Adam

Get a $100 set of light snow chains first , I have already extracted myself this year with those where my twin lockers and winch couldn't do the job.

On two other occasions I have extracted myself with winch where lockers failed.

Not talking really serious stuff either , even some 2wd roads like Marginal rd are now so slippery in the wet , that diff locks don't do much in those conditions, and as soon as your more than a winch rope away from a tree you will be very happy you had them.

When dry the lockers are wonderful and come into there own.

In terms of year round ultimate capability overall for my Patrol I rate things as

1/Winch
2/Chains
3/ Front locker
4/Rear locker

Robin Miller

Lockers should help you drive through more smoothly, and hopefully avoid getting stuck in the first place. They also help you do less damage (both tracks and your vehicle) because you will have drive to more wheels (depending on how many lockers) and can therefore take things slower, rather than using momentum to carry you through.

Alas I don't have diff locks, but I've heard people describe the difference between locked and unlocked equivalent to the difference between 2WD and 4WD.

A winch will be more useful getting yourself out when you're already stuck. Just make sure you have all the accessories that go with the winch BEFORE you need to use it. Same goes for using it.

A winch will also add more weight to the front of your vehicle, so you may need to upgrade springs, and it may contribute more wear. You'll need to ensure that you have a bar to mount it on. You'll then probably want a dual battery system if you don't have one already (but doesn't everybody). I've also seen a lot of winches on the front of vehicles that don't get ANY love and the cables rust and kink.

The other option as mentioned earlier is hand winches but they seem to be around $400 for a decent one... alternatively you could use your highlift jack. I've never tried either but I believe they are a long and tiring process if you need to use them for any length of time. Of course to use these you'll need to have some good recovery points, and if you have these and another vehicle, as mentioned above, maybe you just need a snatch strap?

Perhaps it comes down to cost... and if it doesn't, just get everything!

What is written above covers the subject pretty well.

Diff Locks and winches are not the same tool. They are different and do different jobs where one will help the other won't. I am not surprised that this question comes up from time to time but it shouldn't.

I have spent the morning in the garden digging out an old tree stump. I used a mattock and an axe. I sharpened both tools on the grinder before I started and used both of them to cut away parts of the tree stump. Why two different cutting tools because I had two different types of cut to make. I looked at the job at different stages and used the tool most suitable at the time. Same with lockers and winches.

My previous vehicle had 2 ARB Air Lock diff locks and some pretty fancy suspension mods it would go anywhere a (road registered touring) 4wd could go. It did win the Nissan Trials a couple of years in a row (before I bought it). It had no winch.

When we did Cape York I got stuck. I mean really stuck. 2 diff locks in and 4 wheels spinning in slop. I was going nowhere. What got me out was the winch on the front of my mates Land Rover. It not only got me out but got both of us through the obstacle. I also pulled another guy out of a tough situation. By fitting a drag chain and using two diff locks to improve traction I was able to pull him out slowly when no one else there could. A snatch strap was considered dangerous due to the instability of the vehicle being recovered.

I believe the winch will get you out of trouble, the diff locks will make it harder to get into trouble in the first place. But when you get stuck with both diff locks working you want to hope that you have a good winch or another vehicle handy.

Duncs

G'day Adam,
We've got rear ARB airlocker - amazing how much easier to drive through obstacles with it - especially compared to original crap LSD.
Also have an electric winch - Warn XP9.5 - and I'm yet to extricate myself, but have winched others out. Even better, it's the best gardening tool I've ever bought!! Death to all cocos palms!!
Cheers,
Dave.

I face the same dilemma whem i got my cruiser and I settled for the winch.
Diff lockers will only aid traction to get you out OR further in!
not only will a winch get you out but it can be used for other purposes and can be swapped vehicle to vehicle, yes you will need another battery, not many offroaders dont have 2nd battery anyway.
pros and cons for both arguements,this is my line of thought.
Shane

Here's a somewhat left field option. And offered as I don't know your skill level. If you are new to this then I do suggest you spend a small amount of money and do a decent 4WD training course before doing anything else. That way you know the vehicle and your limits. As well adjusting tyre pressures for both rough terrain and sand offers you considerably more traction than running at road pressures. Our 05 Prado (V6) walks up just about anything with that configuration and the standard diffs.

If on the other hand you are wedded to spending money then I suggest you go with a rear air operated locker from either TJM or ARB in the first instance. A front locker is a last resort option in our book and if in then your turning circle is considerably worse.

Winch options get interesting. Do you go with a hand operated on (where do you carry it), electric or hydraulic? All have advantages and disadvantages. As well you have the option of using a hi-lift with the winch option which then allows you to winch from the rear as well. Something most folk don't consider.

We use an Ox 10,000lb electric with Dyneema rope. It spends a lot of time pushing air and working the front suspension. But as ours is a training vehicle it aso gets a lot of work. Somethihng most winches don't get. As welll it gets pulled out and serviced every six months to ensure there is no corrosion build up inside etc. Like all recovery equipment it still needs maintenance

So there you go another option for you to consider

Regards

RobA