National parks V permited Aboriginal land

Hey Voxson

You are seriously taking the bleep aren't you, I have spent countless hours giving informed replies to 4wd or camping related threads since march when I joined.

The only time I have given one liners as you put it, to stir people up is when people troll this forum.

Not every body likes what I have to say, I respect that if they are fair with their comments, The same as I don't agree with others.

I take offence to your first sentence and would like you to retract it.

Steve

Steve,
Point taken.
I have cruised through the archives and i am wrong and right.
97% wrong and 3% right.
Some of the answers you have given over the time have got under my skin.
I uncovered a lot of good answers from you with my search through past posts.
Before that i had only seen a few of your posts which is what i went off at.
I betchya i am burnt in your head as a number1 bumhole.
Sometimes people go off before they think.
My first sentence says that "i see" which was true at the time i wrote it,, but in hindsight which is 20/20 vision i shouldnt have said any of it,,, so consider it retracted Steve. The whole lot.
Public appology also.

Grant.

OK OK you two get a room!

Vox, it takes a big man to apologise, you have my respect

Hey Voxson

Yeah sometimes you hit the submit button before reading your answer through, It always looks different once its up on the forum.

There are a couple of posts I wish I had not put up.

Thanks for the retraction, No hard feelings.

Steve.

:o)

:o)

Hey Doug

I'm not sure about other places, But in west Arnhemland all you do is ring the art centre and they issue you with a permit straight away,There is a small cost I think it is $12.50.

There is another permit for cobourg that cost $230 and is restricted, this restriction is by parks and wildlife not the black fella's, they only allow 30 cars a day and this is because of the sensitivity of the area.

Perhaps if other art centre's did this it would lessen the agro with most travelers.

1 day a year they have an open day at Oenpelle there are approx 5000 people attend, these people are asked to go straight to Oenpelle with no side tracks, A large # of people choose to ignore this, they stop and fish, go to art sites along the way and take side tracks in to area's that include burial sites.

The permit system is not perfect, But when you see this behavior it is not hard to see why it takes 3 months or more to get a permit, you can also see why these people have reservations letting people through there land.

One must not forget that this land is private property not crown land, this land was given back to these people under the land rights act.

Cheers Steve.

There are plenty of facts in my post , the only thing is you don't like them.

Pre 1973 it was still legal to shoot a black fella, only if you had a good excuse, perhaps waiting 3 months for a permit, would justify a good excuse.

Gday to all on this cool winter eve from here in sunny Perth.
I read Steve's post and the responses that followed with an open mind and a complete understanding about what the topic really is and how it relates to us as a group and as each individual.
Soooooooo,here's my spin on things if i may.
Steve, i grew up around the places that you now "tour" through. It was literally my backyard, from Darwin in the West to Arnhem land in the east, all the way down to the Alice. The "indiginous" peoples of this land are good honest people who live a simple and unfetterred life, untill the "white man" shows his nose in.
The large majority of these people dont really care about the permit system, they care about the land. They respect the land and what it has to offer them and ask that "we" do the same. Thats all.
Everything else that comes along has the taint of the "white man" on it, from permits to no go areas.
As hard as it may be to believe, i know a few of the dreamtime stories of the land you speak about. Nothing in this world, and i mean nothing, compares to sitting at the top of Nourlangie Rock, listening to the stories from a true tribal elder as he related the time"s of his people. There simply is no comparison. Everything he told and taught was about his people and their land.
Respect for the land is first and foremost in the mind of a true Australian, as it should be for all of us.
Time for the government to stop playing to the minority groups who "control" the land and let all people learn to respect it for what it is,,,,,our home.
"Take nothing but photographs, leave nothing but footprints".................so true, yet so unobtainable in the society we live.

rick

DT you presume to know all about this issue then make the No 1 Mistake in the Book - YOU ASSUME....... What makes you think that Steve wasnt bought up in Arnhem Land, What makes you think that Steve hasnt met with elders up there and indeed grown up with some of the legends of the North. Steve may even have been married at Ubirr with specific permission of the traditional elders.

I know this cause I have met the man.

I too have sat at Nourlangie Rock and mused at what connection the aboriginal people have with the land, marvelled at the Lightning Man and spent a few moments of quiet reflection thinking of what drove the innate connection to the land that our aboriginal people have.

Standing on the rock at Ubirr looking out at what is now Universally known as "BilongaMick" is indeed a moving experience. Looking at the Thylacine painted on the rock there is quite amazing.

All that said, I think that you two probably grew up within 100km of each other and in a land as big as ours that makes you neighbours.

Gday Bonz,,,,,,,,,,started at Alice when i was six. Up to Katherine when i was seven,,,,(the year of Tracey), then out to Point Stuart for many years. Followed up with Mudjinberrie for a few more years after that.
Spent alot of time in Arnhem Land and all through that area.
Gove is a special place that deserve's special mention as well.
Me and my mum were the first in a long time to find Stuarts tree up on the coast..
Yeah, you could say i know the area....before all the bloody fences, toll's and idiots got hold of the place,,,,,,,,,when it was a loand that was open for all to explore and respect. ( Who the hell decided it would be a good idea to fence of Swim Creek fer crist sake.....:(:(:(:(:( )

rick.

From what I understand many Aboriginal communities are baffled by this "national emergency". It has been happening for years but all of a sudden it's an emergency? Having said that most communities seem to welcome it. They've been struggling for years to clean up their communities and want the help.

As a worker in the health field, I know first hand the frustrations of reporting domestic (and sexual) abuse in a system full of beaurocrats who don't give a toss what happens to Aboriginal people. If this is a means to get a change in attitude and more resources out bush then I'm all for it.

But the removal of the permit system has met widespread disapproval. What communities are saying is that it will now be harder to filter out the bad people from entering thier communities opening them up to more abuse, sly grog and drugs.

Paternalistic governmental policies can only go so far before an open ear has to come to the fore.

Barnesy

Oh good on us Europeans, do you mean the white ones or the WOGS like ME

HaHa

Cheers

Richard Kovac

Blaze I reckon that the question is not the past 70 years moreover its a wider question. the reason Asutralia was a target during WW2 was due to Australians declaring war on Japan etc, not due to Aboriginals declaring war on Japan, so the question should be differently asked IMHO.

What would have happened to Terra Australis if Europeans hadnt conquered her in the 1700's?

THAT is an interesting proposition. There may have been an Asian invasion same as the European one, and Toyota's may be being made here in their millions.

Now THAT is a fate worse than what we have now....

Richard I think I said (Black, White or Silver), I guess that includes WOGS like you as you put it. Pity we couldn't all be Australians but I have mentioned on here before there are to many on both sides of the coin with hang ups. To many people that believe they should be treated specail and to many that believe some minority races should be treated just like that a minority.

I find it ironic that most people seem to have either a (Italian, Greek, Asain, Yank, Pom, Aboriginal etc) friend yet there still seems to be such a large diecrimination feeling in this country. I TRY to take treat every person no matter what race on their merits.

Bonz a least I am OK, Mitsibishi have a factory here (for now any way) so the invasion had already started LOL

Blaze Hi

I don't have a problem with most people (Poms maybe) lol, I do have a problem with our history and that needs addressing one day a good man may come along and say sorry. Until then we will all have to try to live together,

I have no problem with Aboriginals owning there land and I have no problem with the permit system or getting the apply every year and have no issues. :-)

Toyota still have a factory here in the land of OZ

seems Nissan are the odd man out ;-(

Richard

Richard.
Please don’t refer to your self as a wog. It’s a derogatory term that nobody deserves. You should be proud of your heritage, whatever it is. I read your posts with interest and respect your opinion, Don’t spoil the image.
Regards. CliveG.

PS. Following this debate with interest but not commenting as it’s none of a Kiwi’s business.

Clive.

Thanks, it's OK I'm a Victorian (but don't tell too may people).

I just don't like this us and them, sort of things :-)

Cheers

Richard