Bio diesel

Submitted: Friday, Aug 17, 2007 at 17:27
ThreadID: 48799 Views:2234 Replies:6 FollowUps:10
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Gday readers, jus wondering whether any of you have had any success with making your diesels run on Vegie oil or anything besides pump diesel, would you have any websites i could visit to obtain any tips, but mostly i just wanna know is it worth it and are the savings & benefits great or is it just too much trouble & hassle? Good on yez. The Pilbara Earwig
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Reply By: Shaker - Friday, Aug 17, 2007 at 18:36

Friday, Aug 17, 2007 at 18:36
For the miniscule savings that you get with BioDiesel, I couldn't be bothered with all the drama.
AnswerID: 257715

Follow Up By: Ozboc - Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 16:41

Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 16:41
Miniscule savings >? how much is diesel ?? $1.30 Ave ?

I get my waste oil for free
i get my caustic for free
Methanol costs me about $1 per litre ( have to buy in 44 gal drums)

Make up a 150 Litre batch each time - so about 33 litres of Methanol

Not including my time - or the small amount of electricity used....

150 / 33 = 4.54 cpl or about 9 c per litre factoring in other costs

so a tank of bio is costing me about $9 as apposed to $120

then x 52 weeks in a year

think these are Miniscule savings Shaker ????

Boc

P.s not exact figures - but damn obvious there is a saving
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Follow Up By: Member - DOZER- Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 18:29

Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 18:29
A local NRMA breakdown mechanic has been making and running it in his work van and cruiser for the last 8 years, and no problems...as i said earlier...if you have the nouse to do it right, then its worth it....otherwise keep filling up on diesel,.
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Follow Up By: Shaker - Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 18:49

Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 18:49
I was referring to commercially available BioDiesel, as far as making it myself, no thanks, I would rather have a life!

I don't know what you do for a living, but if you are a tradesman you would be earning around $70.00 per hour ..... factor that in & see how cheap it is then.
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Follow Up By: Member - DOZER- Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 21:39

Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 21:39
Im hearing you....and your spot on.
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Follow Up By: Ozboc - Sunday, Aug 19, 2007 at 09:10

Sunday, Aug 19, 2007 at 09:10
HI , yes i am a tradesman ( fitter machinist with a few other qualifications associated to the trade also)

Making bio is like making home brew beer or spirits - time consuming at first untill you have refined the process -

I have made all my own equipment with some level of automation , so it actually requires very little of my time - and since i enjoy making it for the benifits of saving $$ AND knowing i am helping the enviroment rather than putting further burdon on the plannets NON renuable energy sources makes bio production even more attractive

Boc

P.s $70 an hour ? If i was on that i would be earning Over $4000 a week :) would proberbly still make bio though :)
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Reply By: Olcoolone (SA) - Friday, Aug 17, 2007 at 19:54

Friday, Aug 17, 2007 at 19:54
Mmmm....Good luck

Sure, you could save maybe $2000 a year on diesel and spend $8000 on repairs to your injection system.

Regards Richard
AnswerID: 257736

Follow Up By: Ozboc - Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 16:45

Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 16:45
LMAO -- going into my second year running bio ( nissan patrol 4.2 turbo) ranging for B100 down to B10

Not spent $8000 on my injection system as you suggest - proberbly saved $8000 in fuel so far

can you please tell me how YOU have had to pay $8000 in repairs after using bio , or is this just based on hearsay?

Boc

P.s i do make my own - so i know the quality of the fuel - perhaps the dodgey store bought stuff could be of lesser quality ....
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Follow Up By: Andrew from Vivid Adventures - Sunday, Aug 19, 2007 at 08:49

Sunday, Aug 19, 2007 at 08:49
There is a lot of hearsay about this matter, and what is forgotten is that bad fuel issues have happened with every commercially available fuel - Avgas, Petrol, Diesel, Biodiesel.

Sometimes this is due to the laxity of the manufacturer, distributor or retailer. Mostly the consumer isn't in a position to point the finger.

If a Biodiesel vehicle goes in to a diesel mechanic (or worse, alocal mechanic) and anything wrong in the fuel system is the fault of the Biodiesel.

Further, when a backyarder stuffs up, and makes a nasty batch of Biodiesel (it is rather hard to do, but people have) and wrecks his fuel pump or injectors of whatever, the mecahnic instead of blaming the backyarder, blames Biodiesel.

The reality is most of Europe is running Biodiesel. Large companies and organisations are running truck and bus fleets on Biodiesel all around the country.

I've run it for 130Ks or more in my 100 Series 1HZ and it has been absolutely painless.

Cheers
Andrew who has had problems from bad fossil fuel diesel with water in it.
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FollowupID: 519177

Reply By: fj1200 - Friday, Aug 17, 2007 at 20:51

Friday, Aug 17, 2007 at 20:51
http://www.biofuelsforum.com/
http://www.melbournebiodiesel.org/
http://biodiesel.infopop.cc/groupee

Try these sites.
Cost about 30 cents a litre.
All the above is to do with home made bio, not the crap you get from the servo.

AnswerID: 257749

Reply By: Member - DOZER- Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 15:43

Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 15:43
I have a few aquatences that run bio and laugh all the way....one person makes 150 litres in a 44 drum at a time in his garage, for about 25c/l he said to me he hasnt been near a servo for years, and has not had a problem. the worst part is collecting oil oils...the important part is letting it settle and doing it properly...if any caustic is left in the mix, the alloy pump will not last too long.
Sooo, either do it and do it properly, or keep buying from the major companies and hope it is what you paid for....
AnswerID: 257818

Follow Up By: Ozboc - Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 16:49

Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 16:49
hi there - if your friend is doing the bio correctly - there should be very little caustic left as "washing" the bio will remove excess methanol and caustic... but if you are worried then you can easily set up a switch over valve to change from bio to normal diesel if your going to park the vehicle for some time... will just require 2 tanks


Boc

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FollowupID: 519088

Follow Up By: Member - DOZER- Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 18:24

Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 18:24
ii was thinking more along thelines of the servos selling it not worrying about washing and storing to seperate, but simply selling as is....
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FollowupID: 519106

Follow Up By: Andrew from Vivid Adventures - Sunday, Aug 19, 2007 at 08:42

Sunday, Aug 19, 2007 at 08:42
Hi Dozer,

Servos selling Biodiesel have to comply with the Australian Standard for Biodiesel which is much more stringent than that for fossil fuel diesel.

Commercial Biodiesel production includes much more washing than is practical for home brewers, and the need to let it settle is dependent entirely on the process used for the conversion.

You can make Biodiesel out of all sorts of organic oils.

The major companies are now starting to put Biodiesel into their low sulpher diesel to aid lubrication and improve the efficiency of the burn.

The servos themselves will get the Biodiesel from a producer who will or should have ensured that it complies with the standard. Same issues about fuel storage and cleanliness apply to both fossil fuel and Biodiesel.

Cheers
Andrew.
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FollowupID: 519175

Reply By: hoyks - Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 17:16

Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 17:16
A guy at work lived in Katherine for years and only bought about 4 tanks of fuel in that time.

He had a tank on the back of the ute that he filled with filtered cooking oil. The heater was disconnected from the cab and run to a copper tube coil. The tank had a filter installed in the fuel line just before a solenoid spliced into the standard fuel line.

He would start it on diesel and let the engine warm up, then switch over to cooking oil. 2min before shut-down for the night he would switch back to the diesel tank again. In the heat up there he had no problem with gelling of the fuel and had done 200 000km without touching the injectors or pump, all from free oil.

The filter system was all gravity powered so required minimal effort to run.
If you have the room in the vehicle to add a second tank, it saves a lot of messing around.
AnswerID: 257831

Reply By: Tim HJ61 (WA) - Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 21:23

Saturday, Aug 18, 2007 at 21:23
earwig65,

I've been running my HJ61 Landcruiser direct injection 12HT on varieties of vege oil and bioD, plus a few bits of other stuff, and am confident it is not causing me any problems. It's probably close to two years now.

It is important to have a two tank system as others have described, and during winter I'm finding the 8mm fuel line is too small for 100% vege to be drawn through by the lift pump as well as sucking it through the main filter. For my own reasons I have the main filter on suction not under pressure and will soon be moving to 12mm fuel lines and installing an extra Pollack so I can have the main filter back under pressure again.

Anyway, that's more technical than you wanted to know. Short answer is yes, of course you can run your old fashioned diesel on vege oil. I would not suggest it is used on the high tech diesels and would recommend bioD for those users.

This is not the best site to find good technical info and support, too many nay sayers and it's off topic really - the sites listed above are excellent resources. Google WARFA for the WA Association.

I understand there is a group in Tom Price making BioD from the Pilbara's waste oil. I just picked up 120l of Canola fuel for $30 from a local fish shop. It gives me the same performance as dino diesel.

The biggest downside to vege or backyard BioD is the time and the learning curve. You MUST also be a tinkerer - these are very hands on fuel systems and don't try calling your local mechanic when you have a problem - you'll have to figure it out and fix it yourself.

If you have time to work out your vehicle set up, your home storage and processing systems, a resource of good oil, then once it is all 'perfect' it might take me three hours on an average week to do all I need. Getting to 'perfect' is the interesting journey!

Tim

AnswerID: 257859

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