Priming a 1HZ (100 series)
Submitted: Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 08:17
ThreadID:
50070
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Replies:
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FollowUps:
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Andrew from Vivid Adventures
I ran a
tank dry a few weeks ago and had the devil's own problem priming the pump from the aux
tank (the Longranger as it happens).
Having rolled into the shade of a tree on the side of the track and the passenger side of the vehicle was considerably raised.
Despite burning my thumb on the hot fuel filter and pumping the primer for 20 minutes I still could not get that firmness that indicates success (I have done this numerous times including at fuel filter changes without issue).
In the end I just resorted to letting the pump pull it hoping that it was mostly primed and that the lean on the vehicle was rendering the primer less effective than usual. It turned about three times and then slowly got going.
Does anyone have any reflections on this situation?
Cheers
Andrew.
Reply By: Willem - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 08:19
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 08:19
MY GQ's pump works very
well. There-in lies an answer?....LOL
AnswerID:
264132
Follow Up By: Andrew from Vivid Adventures - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 08:43
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 08:43
Twit - I was talking about the primer not the pump.
The answer to another question is no answer at all ;-)
FollowupID:
525843
Follow Up By: Willem - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 08:53
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 08:53
Errrr. I meant the Primer. So there!...lol
FollowupID:
525845
Follow Up By: Andrew from Vivid Adventures - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 08:56
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 08:56
Oh, thanks for your help Willem. LOL.
FollowupID:
525846
Reply By: traveller2 - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 08:27
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 08:27
The only time I've ever had problems priming a 1HZ is when low on fuel and their is a partial vacuum in the
tank.
Loosening the fuel cap releases the vacuum and allows the pump to pull the fuel through.
Their shouldn't be a vacuum but that has been my experience on both a cruiser and a coaster bus (same engine).
AnswerID:
264135
Follow Up By: Andrew from Vivid Adventures - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 08:44
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 08:44
Sounds like a good explanation... next time I'll loosen the cap if need be.
FollowupID:
525844
Follow Up By: Middle Jeff - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:07
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:07
Vacuum is a problem also did you pull the outlet hose of the pump so the air in the line can escape, keep pumping until you see fuel then put back on.
have fun
Craig
FollowupID:
525850
Follow Up By: Andrew from Vivid Adventures - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:24
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:24
yep - did that.
FollowupID:
525854
Reply By:- Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:03
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:03
Have similar problem. Investigation shows that my valve between tanks leaks. I mean internal leaking, not external. And although it absolutely unnoticeable under normal circumstances it enough to suck air from empty
tank thus prevent prime properly. Problem was fixed by putting 20L of fuel in dry
tank. After that no priming required and engine starts after four or five cranks.
Cheers.
AnswerID:
264138
Follow Up By: Andrew from Vivid Adventures - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:24
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:24
Yeah -
well four or five cranks is probably more than long enough to run a dry fuel pump (self-lubricating)... that was my concern which is why it is good to prime it if you don't want premature fuel pump failure.
FollowupID:
525852
Follow Up By:- Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:37
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:37
IMHO not a big concern. When you stall because fuel pump seeps air there are aplenty of fuel everywhere and in particular in fuel pump. It is because fuel pump cannot expel fuel out because of air inside get compressed and therefore required pressure cannot be obtained. Even fully rebuilt fuel pump should have enough residual fuel after test/calibration run.
Cheers.
FollowupID:
525857
Reply By: Member - Doug T (Qld) - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:29
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:29
Andrew
I thought you blokes were suppose to be professionals, Did you ever think of taking the filter hose off the top and filling it with fuel from a mug or what ever you can lay your hands on, That is what I did with
mine , started and run for a bit then it gets a little air pass through and away you go, another time my 1HZ started with a 3 or 4 tries on the starter .
AnswerID:
264148
Follow Up By: Andrew from Vivid Adventures - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 10:15
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 10:15
professional photographers aren't diesel mechanics though have too much experience with them...
Question was what caused it really... I didn't need to get out the mug which had a cuppa in it anyways (took the opportunity to take a stop for a cuppa ;-)
FollowupID:
525862
Follow Up By: Member - Doug T (Qld) - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 10:56
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 10:56
Andrew
Well there you go.... now we all know you just turned on act just
for a coffee
.
.
.
FollowupID:
525867
Follow Up By: Andrew from Vivid Adventures - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 11:43
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 11:43
LOL - real funny that you say that.
I had one group tell me some days afterward, that they didn't realise that I was seriously bogged on another occasion I stopped - and that it didn't occur to them that I might have been sweating it until I made such a concerted effort to keep forward momentum getting out!
FollowupID:
525876
Reply By: Member - Doug T (Qld) - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:33
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 09:33
Andrew
....????? I read your FollowupID: 525852 , mate the engine/fuel pump is only turning very slow during cranking, when the motor fires then it must have the lubricating diesel fuel in it or it wouldn't fire ....eh
AnswerID:
264150
Follow Up By: traveller2 - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 10:22
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 10:22
Remember though that the rotary fuel pumps do not like having no fuel in them even for short periods and will wear out prematurely.
I personally know of two friends that were in the habit of running on the aux
tank till it coughed and then flipping to the main
tank, both had to rebuild the injection pump at around 120K.
I stopped doing it then ;-))
I've also heard of the changeover tap leaking between the tanks as has been mentioned.
These days I use a hand vaccuum pump to suck the fuel through the dry filter and then reconnect the hoses when changing fuel filters.
FollowupID:
525863
Reply By: Drew - Karratha - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 10:26
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 10:26
I had a similar problem a few years ago with my 80 series 1HZ. After I changed the fuel filter the primer wouldn't pump up hard again - I think I posted the problem on here and someone suggested to cut a boat fuel-line primer into the line just before the fuel filter - I haven't done it yet (too lazy) but it sounds like a winner to me....
The other suggestions were that the diaphragm in the primer pump is buggered - but you have to buy a whole new unit (about $130 I think).
To get
mine started I got someone else to keep pumping the primer while I turned the ignition - worked eventually
AnswerID:
264155
Reply By: Wayne (NSW) - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 10:41
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 10:41
Andrew,
The people you meet on the Stuart Highway.
I am not sure about the 100Series, but my 80 Series I had to make sure that the ignition was in the on position (lights on the dash were on but the motor not running) and the aux
tank switch on.
The reason for this is that with out power going to the change over solenoid it will stay on the main
tank.
It requires power to change from main to aux
tank, and if power is lost through blown fuse or ignition off the solenoid returns to the main
tank.
If there is a next time, try pumping the primer with the switch on aux
tank and the ignition on.
Wayne
AnswerID:
264158
Follow Up By: Wayne (NSW) - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 10:43
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 10:43
Andrew,
Running the pump dry is not good for it at all, even for a short time.
Wayne
FollowupID:
525866
Reply By: greenant - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 11:38
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 11:38
Sounds like the seals are gone in the primer pump I had similar problem and bought an after market priming pump assembly for $20 off a diesel injection service company Just unscew the original and screw in the new one
Greenant
AnswerID:
264161
Follow Up By: Andrew from Vivid Adventures - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 11:41
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 11:41
Thanks so much greenant - sounds like the issue.
FollowupID:
525875
Reply By: Member - Nick (TAS) - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 12:59
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 12:59
My money is also on the primer pump faulty.Had 4 hiluxes that would not prime on the pump and tossed the std one on our 100 series to go for a cav filter with primer ass in one.
BTW some times if you whack the primer hard a few times sometimes they will start to pump.Rodeos are prone to this one.
AnswerID:
264173
Follow Up By: Member - Jeff H (QLD) - Friday, Sep 28, 2007 at 15:34
Friday, Sep 28, 2007 at 15:34
Interesting Nick. 2001built 3L Rodeo ran dry after a looong down
hill run under first low engine braking. Both pumping and sucking failed. 4 hits with aerostart finally got it running.
Thanks for
the tip.
Jeff.
ps. Prefer the taste of Metho to diesel, eh. jh.
FollowupID:
526004
Reply By: Member - Phil G (SA) - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 13:33
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 13:33
Happens most of the time when after I change filters. I just pump the primer like crazy, and then start the vehicle and let idle for a short while. Occasionally it falters a bit from air passing thru, but only for a few seconds. I've not bothered removing the outlet hose to prime it, even though that is what the workshop manual says.
AnswerID:
264177
Reply By: stevesub - Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 14:25
Thursday, Sep 27, 2007 at 14:25
We have only had to prime our 1HZ troopy once when we ran the sub-
tank dry but worked the primer for about a minute, started the engine, a few coughs for 30 secs or so, then it ran fine
AnswerID:
264186
Reply By: pastie - Friday, Sep 28, 2007 at 15:10
Friday, Sep 28, 2007 at 15:10
The primer is faulty it is a very common problem on hiluxs and some 1 HZS, buy either a aftermarket one or a genuine one if you buy a aftermarket one make sure the barbs are the correct size on your vehicle I believe they are 10mm
AnswerID:
264277