Back surgery

Submitted: Saturday, Oct 20, 2007 at 20:56
ThreadID: 50731 Views:22538 Replies:11 FollowUps:12
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I have been putting off the 4WDriving for about 18 months as I get over a back injury. Problem is I may have to go down the track of surgery. Not sure what yet, maybe either disc replacement, fusion, a new one called dynamic fusion or quite possible a combination of 2 of these due to problems with 2 discs.

I was wondering have many of you been down this track? If so, what did you have done, when, and when did you get back to the 4WDriving? Also was it worth going thru the operation(s)?

I can tolerate some driving now but not sure about the bigger bumps etc. If I dont get out there again soon the missus will sell the 4WD out from under me as "it is just sitting there doing nothing". I love the stress relief you get out on the tracks.

Look forward to hearing from you, CHEERS MICK
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Reply By: Austravel - Saturday, Oct 20, 2007 at 21:37

Saturday, Oct 20, 2007 at 21:37
Been there done that but about 20 years ago so I'm sure the techniques are much better.Well certainly hope so. I had a lapendectomy L5 S1, wasn't that sucessfull was left with cronic pain. My view is check out every option you can before surgery, once you do that further options are almost nil.

Have you tried the back clinic at the Mater in Brisy? Julie Hyde developed a program for backs a decade or so back and now it's used by NASA etc. Certainly helped me but due to surgery it was limited. I went from not being able to drive/sit for much longer than an hour to many hours but you've got to be committed to the exercise plan. My drama is there's to many other things out there and I tend to let it lapse and then suffer.

Again if you need surgery then so be it but try every option before you head down this path, wish I did.
AnswerID: 267587

Reply By: Member - steve H (QLD) - Saturday, Oct 20, 2007 at 21:40

Saturday, Oct 20, 2007 at 21:40
Pradoz
I have had the surgery and it is not as bad as people will tell you.Mine was 5 years ago, 2 discs replaced 1 laminated and a double fusion. I also had nerve surgery due to the discs going forward into my spinal cor cavity. What you need is a good surgeon that you trust, a possitive attitude,determination and a good family to support you. As for driving I was told I would not drive a manual again but with determination I was able to drive my Subaru Outback with little problem. Since moving to QLD I now have a GQ Patrol manual which I have no problem driving, as my surgeon says (you will have a tough job breaking Titanium) so i have no problem on the rough stuff. One of the best things I done is Hydrotherapy, It strenthens the stomach muscles and takes a lot of stress of your back.
::Remember

:Possitive attitude
:Good family
:Determination
:Hydrotherary

Hope everything goes well for you

Steve
AnswerID: 267590

Reply By: Laura aka diver 1 - Saturday, Oct 20, 2007 at 21:47

Saturday, Oct 20, 2007 at 21:47
Mum had a disc removed and it took her a good 6months before it felt " normal" shes not a 4wder even though she owns one but it didnt take too long for her to be doing to normal....lots of swimming she reckons.....back felt real nasty if she went 2 days without some laps....even if she managed 1 or 2 laps...she would go....

good luck

Laura

ps....maybe number plate could be:
BrknPrdo
AnswerID: 267591

Follow Up By: PradOz - Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 10:29

Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 10:29
Thanks for the advice. My approved hydro is about to end so I will have to hit the pool on my own since the QBE insurance case manager wont approve any treatment. I am so lucky she is more qualified than my neurosurgeon (NOT). Well she thinks she is.

I was thinking the number plate could be:

ILBBAK

Thanks Mick
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Follow Up By: Newbiesb - Monday, Oct 22, 2007 at 20:52

Monday, Oct 22, 2007 at 20:52
Seek a review with another case manager. I know people that has worked for.
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Reply By: QLD Kev - Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 06:15

Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 06:15
Mick,

I know how your feeling,
I am probably the most recent one around here that had surgery, I had an L5/S1 anterior/posterior Fusion,
which is where they take bone frm your non dominant hip and put a bone graft in the front of the discs. The front incision is about the same size and location as a C Section incision.
Once they had that complete, they roll you over onto your stomach and go in from the back.
Where they inserted 2 titanium screws that hold the disc stable until the bone graft is fully taken/fused.

I had the surgery on the 12 Apr 07 and have only just begun lifting more than 5kg's (yes 6 months of doing nothing).
I had X Rays every month to check the progress of the bone graft etc.
I am now up to 2 monthly reviews.
On the last X Ray they found that the 2 screws have loosened which is the likely cause of the remaining pain. I get pain on upper torso rotation, bending backwards and forwards. SWo at the next review with the surgeon a decision will be made to determine if the screws will come out :((

My first reunion with 4WDing will the the Pyrenees trip, my logic being if I can survive the drive from Sydney, I may be able to do some of the milder track around the area down there. I just have to start somewhere.

I am going to get upgraded seats (suspension seats) in the new cruiser to take some of the harshness out of bumps etc.

The whole sit at home was very stressful, due to my wife having multiple MS relapses whilst I was unable to do anything, having a 6 month old at the time of the surgery as well. Although there were some very generous offers of help from a couple of Forum members (Ray&Jen and Stephen M).
I spent 12 days in the private hospital where I had surgery due to a little issue of a blood clot (it was about 13 x11x 7cm in size LOL) which caused a couple of headaches.

As mentioned above in other replies I recommend that you try everything prior to surgery. Post surgery you will lose a lot of muscle tone, I have lost no weight in the past 12 weeks but have lost 6cm from my waist (ie I lost the fat I put on and replaced it with muscle again).
I am doing 5 days a week Rehab, that includes:
- Pilates x 3 (1 hour per session),
- Stretching x1 (1 hour session)
- Physio (up to 3 sessions a week, it was 5 sessions),
Hydrotherapy (1 session per week, but it was twice a day post Op)
Walking 30-40 mins a day
cycling 30-40 mins a day.

It took nearly 3.5 years for them to determine that I needed surgery and I now reckon that it was the best thing that happened. Even though I still have some pain but it is a lot better than it was.

Cheers Kev
Russell Coight:
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AnswerID: 267613

Reply By: PradOz - Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 10:25

Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 10:25
THANKS EVERYONE FOR YOUR ADVICE. IT IS REALLY APPRECIATED. I GUESS I REALLY NEED TO BE GETTING GOOD ADVICE FROM A SPECIALIST. MY NEUROSURGEON IS APPARENTLY VERY HIGHLY QUALIFIED AND I THINK THE HEAD OF WHATEVER HOSPITAL SHE IS IN (I FORGET WHICH 1). SHE ISNT REAL SURE WHAT SURGERY TRACK TO GO DOWN IF I SAY YES TO THAT WHICH MAKES IT HARD WHEN THE SPECIALIST ADVICE DRIES UP. I JUST DONT KNOW WHICH SURGEON TO SEE. I HAVE HEARD OF SOME TO AVOID.

MY BIGGEST PROBLEM IS IT IS A WORKERS COMP ISSUE. THE QBE INSURANCE CASE MANAGER IS PROVING TO BE THE BIGGEST THORN IN MY SIDE. SHE WONT EVEN APPROVE PHYSIO. I GUESS THAT HAPPENS DUE TO HER QUALIFICATIONS - B. COMMERCE) THAT CERTAINLY WONT HELP ME. MAYBE SHE CAN HELP WITH MY FINANCES AT HOME (LOL)

ANYWAY I WILL PLOD ALONG AND ENJOY THE GOOD MOMENTS (USUALLY MEDICATION ASSISTED) + GET THRU THE OTHER TIMES.

IF ANYONE HAS ANYONE THEY WOULD RECOMMEND PLEASE LET ME KNOW I AM IN SOUTH WEST SYDNEY. LIKEWISE I WOULDNT MIND KNOWING WHO I SHOULD THINK TWICE ABOUT BUT I DONT WANT ANY1 GETTING IN TROUBLE.

THIS SITE IS TERRIFIC. I ONLY DISCOVERED IT A FEW WEEKS AGO AND REALLY LOVE IT. (AND MY WIFE THOUGHT I WAS JUST AN EBAY ADDICT). THANKS AGAIN EVERYONE - A BIG THUMBS UP, OR TEN FOUR OR ...??...

AnswerID: 267631

Follow Up By: QLD Kev - Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 12:31

Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 12:31
In Liverpool I saw

Associate Professor Mark Sheridan, Neorsurgeon
He is one switched on Surgeon although I think he mostly does microdiscotomies (spelling)

Suite 11/41-43 Goulburn Street
Liverpool NSW

I don't have his contact number :((

My Surgeon was
Dr Mattew Giblin, Orthopedic Surgeon specialising in both Knee and Spinal surgery.
Suite 11/41-43 Goulburn Street
Liverpool NSW
Ph 02 9602 9955
Fax 02 9821 4107


Good Luck
Kev
Russell Coight:
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Follow Up By: Member - George (WA) - Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 13:23

Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 13:23
Don't know where you live, but I can give you the details of a highly reccommended Neuro Surgeon, also from personal experience, claimed to be one of the best in Aust. and you don't want to take any risks with your back when it comes to surgery.

Cheers & good luck
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Follow Up By: PradOz - Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 15:50

Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 15:50
Thank you for the information.

I had a guy that I spoke to only 2 weeks ago who recommended Dr Mark Sheridan but I never new he was an Associate Professor. I rang and got an appointment for 21 November but wasnt sure if that was a good idea. Following your opinion Kev I am looking forward to seeing him. You really only want to go the surgery track if necessary and want to totally trust the person doing it. I am currently seeing Dr Renata Abraszko Neurosurgeon, but havent heard much about her from other people that have seen her.

And George thank you also. I believe you need as much info as possible to make the right decision. Who and where is the neurosurgeon you recommend?

Thanks again Mick
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Follow Up By: PradOz - Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 16:01

Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 16:01
Kev

Can you please explain why you seen Associate Professor Mark Sheridan, Neorsurgeon but had Dr Mattew Giblin as your Surgeon?

I dont understand the reason or necessity for doing that so your expert advice is required again please.

Thanks Mick
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Follow Up By: PradOz - Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 16:01

Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 16:01
Kev

Can you please explain why you seen Associate Professor Mark Sheridan, Neorsurgeon but had Dr Mattew Giblin as your Surgeon?

I dont understand the reason or necessity for doing that so your expert advice is required again please.

Thanks Mick
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Follow Up By: QLD Kev - Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 16:53

Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 16:53
Mick,

I initially saw Assoc Prof M Sheridan nearly 3 years ago after yet another recurrance of my injury at that stage I was in his opinion not needing surgery as the history of my back showed that i normally got back to near normal :)
After a further 2 years of no improvement to the injury I was again referred to him as well as Dr Giblin as I required to surgeons to agree that surgery was required for the insurance to pay. As it so happened I saw Dr Giblin first and the rest is history.
Assoc Prof M Sheridan was very supportive of Dr Giblin course of action and with my previous dealing with him I felt that I could trust his recommendation of allowing Dr Giblin to perform the surgery.
I also had a Vascular Surgeon involved with my surgery as he was required to make room around the area the bone graft went, as there is a lot of nerves etc in that part of the spine.

Hope this helps.

Cheers Kev
Russell Coight:
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Reply By: Member - Ian W (NSW) - Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 14:50

Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 14:50
I lived in agony for over 10 years cause I had seen all the scare documentaries about spinal surgery gone wrong.

Eventually one specialist surgeon recommended I talk to Dr. Andrew Kam, Neuro and Spinal Surgeon. Best bloody thing I ever did. Shaved trimmed three discs and then trimmed spurs from the vertabrae and widened/enlarged the nerve canal.

These procedures were done over five years ago at Westmead Hospital, I'm now 61 years of age, 4wd, camp and kayak with no problems. I was surprised at how little time in Hospital - four days - and how quick the recovery period.

In May this year I had a Shoulder Reconstruction - far more painfull than the spinal surgery and I'm still on light duties.

The best thing that ever happened to me was being given Dr.Andrew Kam's name.


Ian
AnswerID: 267652

Reply By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 15:50

Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 15:50
Hi Mick,

I had my spinal fusion in Nov 99. 'Xmas dinner that year I was allowed to sit for 10mins!!

Worked hard at rehab/physio whatever you care to call it and in
August 2000 bought another 4wd and drove from Alice to Darwin, towing a boat, and then flew to Gove where I worked for the following two years plus. Plenty of 4wdíng there.

Everybody will give you different opinions, and for what it is worth all are valid to that individual.

There are so many variables that 'one size does not fit all'

I am quite happy to talk to you via telephone or email if you think
it will help your decision making.

BTW although I am now an 'old chappie' and surgery is long ago
I can still lift a bag of cement, drive a 4wd for as long as it takes--and perform ALL husbandry duties...LOL LOL

Cheers
Michael
AnswerID: 267660

Follow Up By: QLD Kev - Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 17:02

Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 17:02
But a bag of cement is half the weight now when compared to back then LOL

I has taken a while for me to get back to "Husbandry Duties" although the mind is willing LOL

Cheers Kev
Russell Coight:
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Follow Up By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 17:13

Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 17:13
"But a bag of cement is half the weight now when compared to back then LOL"

-and I am only half as strong......LOL LOL

"I has taken a while for me to get back to "Husbandry Duties" although the mind is willing"

Dunno about you Kev, but the older I get the more it is in
"the mind"..............reminds me I must talk to the lady in my
life about this....LOL LOL

Cheers
Michael
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Reply By: Member - George (WA) - Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 17:14

Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 17:14
Hi Mick,
I live in Perth and had my back operation done here. My problem was a narrowing of the disc between 2 of the lower vertabra. This was pinching the ciatic nerve which in turn made it almost impossible to walk. Surgery was; admitted Friday noon, surgery Saturday morning, discharged Tuesday morning and I was walking 2 days later and never looked back until recently when i had a fall from a scaffold and damaged 2 vertabta in my neck which made my right arm useless. Same surgeon, similar surgery, admitted friday noon,. surgery saturday, discharged Monday. result, right arm as good as before. I was a pinched nerve again.
This surgeon is brilliant.
mr George Wong
West Perth

Cheers

ps. not too sure about some of the spelling
AnswerID: 267675

Reply By: Member - Lance S (VIC) - Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 20:48

Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 at 20:48
PradOz,

I had surgery on Febuary 7, 2007. A microdiscectomy on L5/S1.
I spent the first 6 weeks lying on my back watching crappy soapies. Nearly 9 months later i am glad i had the surgery. I had 16 months of Pysio, massages, cortirzones then as a last resort epidurals before surgery.

My rehab is at the moment is;

hydrotherapy 3x1hour per week
Swimming ( just started 10x25metre pool lengths ) 4 per week
gym 4x1.5hours per week
gym includes, treadmill, bike weights 10kg at the most and lots of warm up exercises.

Still get pins and needles and small amount of pain, but nothing compared to what i had. Just listen to my phsio and don't do anything i am not suposed to do

can only sit for an hour at a time and walk for at least an hour.

At this stage there has been NO 4wdring

My surgeon was Greg Malham
317 St.Kilda rd East Melbourne

After seeing some of the other guys who have had back surgey in hydro, i feel like i am one of the lucky ones as most of these blokes are on there 2nd or 3rd op. and we are all about the same age 42.

As SteveH said,
a positve attitude. sometimes it is bloody hard.
great family help
and i beleive most of all is:

HYDROTHERAPY

Everytime you walk or bike , you must suck in the tummie muscles (core muscles ) which helps u strengthen the back.

All the best

Lance
Home Away from Home

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AnswerID: 267715

Reply By: davidta - Monday, Oct 22, 2007 at 07:39

Monday, Oct 22, 2007 at 07:39
HI Mick,

I had a Lamenectomy & Discectomy done about 11 years ago. Disc replaced with a carbon fibre cage, pinned & bone grafted.
Took 3 months to be able to do much at all & a lot more than that to be useful.
Was in permanent 24 hour chronic pain prior.
Mine was a work cover issue & I spent about 16 months fighting for my rights with the pri*ks.
Took all other suggestions for improvement prior to the surgery. I was scared about the surgery - I even nearly left the hospital about 1 hour before the actual surgery - I was in bed & drugged too !.
It all ended well though.

David
AnswerID: 267754

Reply By: Member - steve H (QLD) - Monday, Oct 22, 2007 at 10:36

Monday, Oct 22, 2007 at 10:36
Try this site
This is the guy that done mine

www.moloney.com.au

Steve
AnswerID: 267776

Follow Up By: PradOz - Monday, Oct 22, 2007 at 22:43

Monday, Oct 22, 2007 at 22:43
HI Steve

Thanks for your replies, they are most welcome as I battle the bull$41t of the workers comp system in nsw.

Ilooked at site and looks very promising. WHich 2 discs did he replace? I was told they cannot replace both mine as it was impossible to replace 2 adjoining discs. I wouldnt actually know if thats right or wrong - only what my neuro told me. She wants to do it but says it cant be done so leaves me with a problem of what to do with the 2nd and worst disc. She thinks I need the replacement and then Dynamic Fusion which has only been out for a year in Australia so no known long term effects from that as yet.

So I was wondering which discs you had done what to and how long ago. As someone else here said, it is a real nerve racking time and I too would struggle to remain calm all the way to the op table. How long before you were good enough to be half normal and look after yourself and also how long till all was as good as gold?

Sorry for so many questions but we really only learn from the experiences of others, and there may just be some others reading this that need the great advice that you and all the others here have posted. You are all truly remarkable with your assistance - Thanks again

AND RE
::Remember

:Possitive attitude - TRYING TO - SO HARD
:Good family - I AM REALLY TESTING THEM OUT
:Determination - DESPERATE FOR AN END NOW
:Hydrotherary - BEEN GOING 3 MONTHS NOW AND WAITING FOR MORE INSURANCE APPROVAL FOR THIS AND START PHYSIO IF THEY EVER GET OFF THERE B#MS.

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Follow Up By: Member - steve H (QLD) - Tuesday, Oct 23, 2007 at 00:59

Tuesday, Oct 23, 2007 at 00:59
Mick
L3 L5 and double fusion 5 years ago. I took me about three months to get back to 90%. Mine was emergency surgery so i didnt have time to worry about it. I do still have a bit of pain but that is due to the amount of sciatic nerve damage i suffered. Every back is different but if you have been suffering for 18 months it time to do something. My possitive attitude comes from a long list of illness for me and some have been life threataning (my wife thinks murphy follows me around) but the support from my wife and two teenage sons is incredible.
My advise, Get it done, Get up , Get back into life because we are only here for a short time

Good luck

Steve
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