More jerry can stuff

Tks Phil G Yes have done this but I've found it safer to use fillers than funnels because the potential for getting dirt in fuel has to be avoided by keeping the funnel scrupulously clean and you end up needing a third hand to hold the funnel reasonably upright.

Theres plenty of people around (including me in my younger days) who have had blocked fuel filters or water in the fuel after using their jerry cans.

I use one of those oval 3-piece funnels with the gauze filter. I find they hold themselves in the filler without the 3rd hand because of their shape. Its stored in a zip-lock bag, so it stays clean.

The reason I prefer the gauze in the funnel is that as you pour the fuel, you'll immediately see any water globules or dirt, and you'll stop pouring. With the fillers, you'll pour all the crap into the tank.

For similar reasons, I've not bothered with Tanami pumps. They pump from the bottom of the jerry first, so the dirt and water will go in first, if present.

Why would their be more likelihood of dirt or water in a Jerry can than in your fuel tank?
Usually they all get filled from the same bowser.

Shaker, should be the same shouldn't it? And for most of us it is.

But
#1 Paint peels off the inside of some steel jerries.
#2 The dregs of Diesel fuel left in jerries grows bugs.
#3 If you get some crud or water in a jerry can, it tends to sit in the bottom and accumulates with time. Not too many people clean out jerry cans.
#4 Jerry cans are often very old. My old steel ones were dated in the 1950's.

Sandy,

What are they worth?

Mick

Does your Tanami Pump have a tyre valve in it?

Mick,
From memory, I paid about $60 from Opposite Lock.

Shaker,
Yep, tyre valve and pressure valve.
Made up a length of air hose with air fitting on each end to lock on to the tyre valves and an air "tap" to control airflow.
Connect it to the pump at one end and the spare tyre at the other. Enough air in the spare for three or four jerry cans.
Can also use a foot pump, or similar to pressurize the can, which only needs 3-4 psi to create fuel flow.

I had a URL saved, but the site is no longer accessible.
Chit, maybe the manufacturer has gone out of business.

Opposite Lock would know.

Thanks, I bought the last one & it didn't have a valve in it.

My home made Tanami Pump only has the valve stem without the valve itself and no pressure valve. Connect airpump and away you go. Takes around 60 seconds to empty the jerry. Works a treat. Use it for diesel only.

Cheers

Tks sandman. What do you mean" only fits a 'standard' j/can." I've got a few Rheem ones and the filler neck is quite different from a Willow. What i liked about the Sceptre's was that they were a heavier grade of 'plastic' than the Willows

Hullo Willem, I'd like to make up one of those air pumps but I'm not even close to understanding what goes where. Since I've now got Rheem and Sceptre J/cans I'll have to make two. Can you explain how to go about it. Do they only work when the j/can has both a sep breather(because the early Rheem ones were pathetic and only had a pourer hole.) What's the danger in using it with petrol? (idle curiosity)

Oh chit......excuse me wigger.
Now I'm tuned in. You have PLASTIC containers.

When I was referring to "standard filler necks" I was thinking of the metal jerrycans

As far as a pump is concerned, it is a "device" that allows you to pressurize the container so that fuel is expelled out of the filler.
A pickup tube runs from the cap down to the bottom of the container so that when air is pumped in, the only avenue for the fuel to go is up the tube and out the top.

I do have a couple of plastic jerrycans I use for water, with a round screw on cap. I think these would be too small a cross section however to fit both an air valve and pickup tube to.

Tks sandman Yes the plastic j c's have only a 28mm neck but in spite of this I'm going to make up some metal discs the same size as the original plastic sealing discs and drill a two holes for the air and fuel pickup line(which I think should be metal tube and go right to the bottom) The airline can be short, Right? What size tube would be most compatible to attach the fittings to a delivery pipe and also the airpump. Any ideas you have re making this up would be welcome.

Wigger,

The airline needs to be nothing more than a standard tubeless tyre valve. As Willem mentioned, he does not have an inner core in his so that air is not retained inside when you disconnect the air pump souce. Just be careful you don't over inflate as you won't have a safety valve like the Tanami does.

The pickup tube will be best if it is metal, about 3/8" diameter will be sufficient and enable a plastic fuel hose to fit snugly over the pipe end protruding from the top.

Special petrol grade reinforced fuel hose is available from Clark Rubber stores, I think it has a red stripe running down the side.
Whatever size this is in internal diameter (12mm?) will determine the diameter of the metal pickup pipe required.

The metal pickup pipe can have a bend towards the bottom so that the end of the pickup sits in the back corner of the container, just off the bottom.

Good luck with your construction.

Tks Sandman. Have I got this right? Intend to make up metal sealing disc and drill two holes in it and braze two metal tubes, one going to bottom of j/can with slight bend near pick up end of it, Other air inlet one goes only 50 mm into can and has 25mm protruding outside. Got a tubeless valve and found that its ID is 5/16 so if i use steel tube with this OD then I can push valve stem onto it. If there is an element of syphon working once you get the flow started (J/can is higher than the vehicle tank) then it would seem that you would only have to presurize the j/can with a few PSI from a footpump. I have had mouthsful of diesel from sucking hoses in the past so this will be a great improvement.
Why did Willem say not to try this with petrol, can't see what the problem would be if you were careful and didn't pressurize the j/c too much.

wigger

In a prervious thread here a while ago there was a lot of talk of static electricity and the possibility of a spark blowing the whole shebang in the air when pumping from a jerry filled with petrol. The need to earth the jerry was raised then.

Dunno, mate, thats what someone else said. I have diesel so it shouldn't be a problem. Haven't had a problem yet.

You metal sealing disc will have to seal well otherwise the pump will not work.

Cheers

Willem Yes you're right, mucking about transferring petrol is risky. It's just that I've done many stupid things with it and haven't had an explosion. Used to carry 100l plus inside my old Lada in j/cans which is not a good idea.
Take your point about the necessity of a good seal round the metal disc. The Rheem filler comes with as screw down collar so hopefully will be OK otherwise I'll hunt round for some 30mm flat rubber rings

Hi again Wigger,

There is very little risk with petrol from static electricity, providing one takes a couple of simple precautions.

The special tubing I mentioned above is specifically designed for syphoning or pumping petrol as it doesn't create static electricity that can occur just by the fuel flowing through "normal" tubing.

Ensuring the jerry is at the same earth potential will also eliminate static electricity build up. Either the jerry can be placed on the ground, or earthed in some other way. When the jerries are sitting in their carriers on my camper, they are earthed to the vehicle via the safety chains. I also clip a jumper lead between the jerry and vehicle to make doubly sure.

If you are carrying your jerries on the roof of your vehicle, they would also be earthed, unless of course they were sitting on a rubber mat, in which case you can use the jumper lead solution.

Tks sandman. I musn't have been paying attention during electrostatics 101. Do plastic J/cans (as distinct from metal ones)hold an electrical charge. Is a charge induced into them by the act of filling. At a Caltex stop one time the operator wouldn't let me fill them while still on the vehicle (in the ute back) but I doubt that he knew a lot about it all and in their sitting on the back on a metal floor, wouldn't they have been earthed?
Because of diesel's higher flashpoint is it necessary to worry about a static buildup?
Have you signed off on my design specifications for the pump so that I don't have to put in a DA to the local Council?

Wigger, you've got my sign off on your design. LOL

I'm no expert, but my understanding is that static electricity canbe "generated" by the fuel flowing through normal plastic tubing.

Tubing, and plastic fuel containers specifically designed for fuel have some sort of conductive property built-in to the plastic material that reduces, or eliminates this.

As far as filling fuel containers is concerned, there is some rule (and logically so) about only filling them in an open space. He was probably being over enthusiastic, as having them in the back of an open ute back would surely constitute an open space.

I myself have never had a problem in refilling the jerries sitting on the A-frame of my camper.

Just a little bit of trivia, every "rubber" fuel hose at any service station also have conductive properties so that static electricity is not created by the filling process. Your vehicle is effectively earthed to the fuel bowser.

12.28 on a work day and you're answering idiot questions. The Government has stuffed the country, recession on the way, and you're just fooling around on the net.
When you've got some time can you tell me about travelling from Wirrealpa to Yunta via Martins Well, Curnamoma, Konnamore , Waukaringa etc. Hard to find good maps of this area and they all show different roads being open. I usually buy Hema maps . Do you think i need to buy the OZi explorer tracks 4 Aust. have a garmin 510 with a 2mb SD card I could load them on to. Is this the best bet.

Wigger

Get yourself an RAA 'Outback' Map which shows all the tracks you mention.

I live just around the corner from the area

Cheers

TKs Willem
On the site raa.net for map retail sales they give an Adelaide address and then for other places they advise that HEMA maps can be purchased. Is the map you are talking about an RAA in house publication or actually a HEMA map that they sell. If RAA, then is it a better map than the HEMA EO 39 'Flinders Ranges' which can be purchased at Explor OZ. Need to be careful if your saying that some of these are tracks rather than roads because at the moment I've only got a 2WD ute at the moment and I can't imagine there being anyone passing too often if things went wrong. In 1994 I only had a Merc 240D and tore a hole in the sump near Wirrealpa in a creek crossing. Managed to get a tow to Blinman and got it welded up there but learnt something about the shortcomings of 2WDs

Wigger

The genuine RAA Map is the best.

These roads/station tracks are driveable by 2wd, no worries. Just drive to conditions

Tks Willem Is the best time for an excursion down that way Mar-April, taking into account the flies. temperature, dust etc. Would the frosts be fairly heavy by end of Aprl if you're in a swag?
Do you know of a good publication I could read to bone up on the history of that area I want to traverse, not so much the F R park.

Wigger

March is still a very warm month. April is a good month. Frosts may start by mid May.

A reasonable publication is The Flinders Ranges, An Adventurer's Guide by Ron and Viv Moon. I think that you maybe able to buy it through this site.

Cheers

willem (resident SA map and knowledge guru)
Have been looking at Google maps while waiting for the RAA map to arrive and find that there are very few name overlays for this area(only Blinman, Belton and Waukaringa) so hard to see where Cunamona an Martin's Well are. Is there something else on the net that will show this detail.
What is the body of water at 32.092464, 139.217033 and is it still there since the road goes through it.(use Sat. view mode)
I'm thinking about getting 'Maps4Aust' loaded onto my Garmin 510
but am worried that the process may not be for dummies. Do you know anything about it?

Mate

Buy yourself a Hema Road Atlas. Used to be about $20. All those stations are marked on that. The RAA map has better road/track detail though.

Looking at my atlas(without firing up the map computer) your body of water looks like a dried up salt lake. THink I went across it once a while ago.

I run Oziexplorer with Natmap Raster and have an old Magellan wioth Australia maps on it. I only use the GPS when seriously off road.

Cheers

Tks shaker. If you're asking me about the Sceptre filler, then it's a 28mm ID, 220mm long with "ce cote en haut' FS910V. stamped on it. The Sceptre ones are designed to go back into the can unlike the Rheem ones

If it is the one that you remove a disc & then put the spout through the black cap to pour, then you can buy spare 'kits' that include the cap, sealing disc & spout from Mitre 10 for around $10.00

Tks Shaker Was at Mitre 10 this morning and noticed that they had all the Sceptre J /cans on special and that 5l ones were $9.95
so it would make sense at the moment to buy this and get a new filler and seal supplied and the can would be a bonus. The 20l yellow diesels were $23.99 so I grabbed two of these and so now have two fillers to use in conjunction with my old Sceptres which i had no fillers for.