200 series starter motor

Submitted: Friday, Mar 28, 2008 at 21:04
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Have just finished watching the test on the new 200 series cruiser, pointing out some of the not so good and the good. Apparently the starter motor on the V8 turbo diesel is inside the V of the motor. Good thing ??? Bad thing ??? I suppose good as far as not getting wet or getting any mud dirt etc inside of it. Minus would be when it craps its self. I imagine would be some big $$$ involved in getting it repaired. Regards Steve M
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Reply By: Robin Miller - Friday, Mar 28, 2008 at 21:09

Friday, Mar 28, 2008 at 21:09
Strange to see all that technology and in the end the 3lt Patrol stills scores more points than it in the bush Stephen.
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Follow Up By: Martyn (WA) - Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 12:23

Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 12:23
Yeeeeeeessssssssssssss
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Reply By: Member - Axle - Friday, Mar 28, 2008 at 21:35

Friday, Mar 28, 2008 at 21:35
Their Smart Steve!, five grand and we'll fix it, or why not trade it. When a few ks are up that is...lol

Cheers Axle.
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Reply By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Friday, Mar 28, 2008 at 22:01

Friday, Mar 28, 2008 at 22:01
Shame they didnt think of locating the alternator up higher to keep it out of puddles... Michael
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Follow Up By: Gone Bush (WA) - Friday, Mar 28, 2008 at 22:36

Friday, Mar 28, 2008 at 22:36
Michael, have you seen that series of photos of a TDV8 trayback crossing a flooded river in QLD?

It was more than a puddle.

And he just drove away after draining the cabin.

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Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 18:57

Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 18:57
What a dick that guy is!! That was really on the edge of loosing the whole thing in the drink. The boat dragging it of the causeway, I wonder what problems he ended up with after the event if any. Michael.
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Reply By: redfive - Friday, Mar 28, 2008 at 22:31

Friday, Mar 28, 2008 at 22:31
Hi Guys

I to watched that DVD today i look at it this way if your got $80,000.00 to buy one what ever the bill is to fix it shouldnt be a problem

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Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 19:01

Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 19:01
All things considered, they are about 10 grand overpriced.., The petrols are not selling, a mate told me there are the same 4 petrols sitting in a Toyota yard for six weeks.. Michael
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Follow Up By: Member - Matt M (ACT) - Tuesday, Apr 01, 2008 at 18:13

Tuesday, Apr 01, 2008 at 18:13
Well that proves it then.
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Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Tuesday, Apr 01, 2008 at 20:46

Tuesday, Apr 01, 2008 at 20:46
Proves what??
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Follow Up By: Member - Matt M (ACT) - Wednesday, Apr 02, 2008 at 07:22

Wednesday, Apr 02, 2008 at 07:22
That they are not selling.
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Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Wednesday, Apr 02, 2008 at 21:02

Wednesday, Apr 02, 2008 at 21:02
Matt M, i think after the initial buyers who are desperate to buy a new Blandcruiser for different reasons, the sales will slow.. Price is stupid for the diesel. Prices will drop.. petrols are not selling except for the gold necklace set.. Michael
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Follow Up By: Member - Matt M (ACT) - Thursday, Apr 03, 2008 at 07:55

Thursday, Apr 03, 2008 at 07:55
So do sales to the 'gold necklace set' not count?
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Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Thursday, Apr 03, 2008 at 19:40

Thursday, Apr 03, 2008 at 19:40
Matt! A few key words on this site and you always get a bite!! If they can afford to fuel a petrol engine , good luck to them.. Michael
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Reply By: Peter 2 - Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 07:51

Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 07:51
Remember too that the Japs expected vehicle lifespan is 5 years.
Most spending that sort of dough will turn them over every 2 years as they are not directly paying for it, rather the business is.
So very few original owners would ever be faced with the cost of repairs.
Certainly there wouldn't be too many warranty claims for repairs so the manufacturer is in the clear, the poor owner will be the one to foot the bill.
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Follow Up By: Member - Don M (NSW) - Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 09:22

Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 09:22
Peter,
That is a very broad assumption I have to say. I am retired and invested some funds to buy a good 4wd and caravan to go touring and am paying hard earned cash for my new LC200VX TTD...having been in a corporate position for many years, I doubt that many companies would allow such a vehicle. Maybe on a novated lease but then no doubt, the person is sacrificing salary to get it anyway. But in any case, just because you are spending a lot on a vehicle doesn't mean you don't give a hoot how much it costs to repair...pure folly my friend/s.
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Follow Up By: Peter 2 - Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 10:52

Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 10:52
Don
True, but there are plenty of owner operated companies out there that do it, not much you can say when the 'owner/director' are one and the same. Yes I personally would be upset at the repair costs but what they cost to make originally and what they charge for spare parts are totally unrelated.
Look at some of the cheap $14k cars and then look at repair costs after even a minor accident, 1k for a front mudguard! no wonder so many are stolen! Take a visit to a wrecking yard where you can still wander around, amazing to see what is written off as beyond 'economical' repair.
On the 5 year front the Japs have had that system in their domestic market for many years.
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Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 19:10

Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 19:10
Don, There are plenty of employees driving around in large 4x4 company vehicles, thats where most of the new vehicles come from as new vehicles. I guess it depends on the company and the value they put on their employees.
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Reply By: Martyn (WA) - Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 12:22

Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 12:22
Stephen M
One thing for sure the starter will be nice and warm there snuggled up to the cylinders there. I see a lot of threads about keeping alternators out of the water, I read in a magazine recently that if your alternator stops working after a good day out in the mud "wash with water with the engine running", so seems to be OK by all accounts. Not sure I would do this except as a last resort but hey, sems that it doesn't matter as much.
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Reply By: Blaze - Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 14:52

Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 14:52
You would think they would have exchenged places with the alternator. I would prefer to have a starter fail 1000k's from home the an alternator.. You could at least still bump start the thing.

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Follow Up By: Member - Kiwi Kia - Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 15:45

Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 15:45
On an automatic ? :-))
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Follow Up By: Peter 2 - Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 18:50

Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 18:50
They are ALL auto's in 200's too.
Look like a Kluger on the road, spose that's what they are in a way, a Kluger with low range.
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Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 19:15

Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 19:15
NO manuals Peter?? On the complete range?? Michael
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Follow Up By: Peter 2 - Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 20:00

Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 20:00
I vaguely remember reading somewhere that they were only available with an auto.
If you want a manual cruiser its a 70 series apparently.
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Follow Up By: Blaze - Monday, Mar 31, 2008 at 09:54

Monday, Mar 31, 2008 at 09:54
Didn't even notice that it was only Auto, even though I drive a slush box 4X4 I did at least have a choice. Wonder what happens if the CPU gets damp and the DAT and every other elctronic part fails........Hmmmmmmm
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Follow Up By: Member - Kiwi Kia - Monday, Mar 31, 2008 at 10:14

Monday, Mar 31, 2008 at 10:14
Hi Blaze, Yeah I guessed that much. Would have been interested in your method of bump starting an auto :-))
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Follow Up By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Monday, Mar 31, 2008 at 11:16

Monday, Mar 31, 2008 at 11:16
I just loved the sound of that downhill control system.... reminded me of when I was a kid; the old Westinghouse washing machine that mum had...... what a terrible bloody noise!!!!!

Sorry, but after seeing that CD on the weekend, I've run up this morning and told the local toymota dealer to cancel my order for the 200 series....I've decided to stick with the 6.5 V8
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Follow Up By: Blaze - Monday, Mar 31, 2008 at 11:47

Monday, Mar 31, 2008 at 11:47
Bill, you have my vote.

We looked at the other night and I done some clumsy maths. Buy a Nissan or a Pajero; fit a Chev, Lockers front and back, Full suspension Lift kit, drawers/cargo barrier, Roof rack, Bull bar, Winch, Spots, Fridge. Cost approx the same as the 20 series....

Oops typo, well maybe not:

Which vehicle would go the furthest and be the best drive then off road... ?????
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Follow Up By: richo7 - Monday, Mar 31, 2008 at 16:09

Monday, Mar 31, 2008 at 16:09
Roachie,

I would have thought that the noise of the ABS operating was not a very valid reason for cancelling your order.
What else turned you off the 200? Why did you buy it in the first place?
I'm not having a go - I'm just interested in your comments.
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Follow Up By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Monday, Mar 31, 2008 at 17:13

Monday, Mar 31, 2008 at 17:13
Richo,
Sorry, I really should have put "TIC" beside my response. I have never had any intention of buying one of these new-age computers on wheels. It stems back a month or 2, when somebody else on here was extolling the virtues of these new cars and I jokingly said that I was going be placing an order myself.

However, on a serious note...... those who know me, know that I am a "tinkerer". That's a polite way of saying "mangler". I'm never happy with a stock truck and I refuse to pay the exorbitant cost for any accessory that I can make myself. Likewise, I do almost all of the electrical work on my own too. The reason for this is so that I will be better placed to fix (or at least diagnose) something that goes wrong when I'm remote. I've heard too many stories about blokes who have spent oodles of $$$ at ARB or TJM....they get a great looking truck, but when they're out in the never-never and something stops working, they have no idea what it could be cos they didn't fit it and don't know what should go where etc.

So, in the case of the 200 series, it really worries me that (as a basic example) it doesn't have a power socket in the rear cargo area and (if what the 2 blokes on the DVD said is correct) it's not even the sort of job that a bloke like me could/should tackle on his own. Apparently the electronics are so finiky that woe betide anybody who should be silly enough to start soldering-in any additional stuff..... you could fry some important chip etc.

Also, things like the Kinetic Suspension set-up..... did you see that mother of a car waddling through those large corrogations??? What a load of scrap!!! (in my opinion).

Sorry, but after watching that DVD, I cannot believe that anybody would even consider buying one of those cars IF they intend to do any hard miles. Great for a Toorak Taxi ... safe as hell in a collision with umpteen airbags (I presume) etc etc.

But out in the bush (what the 4x4 magazine normally refer to as "bushability".... a term I notice that they didn't use during the making of the DVD, strangely enough), I work on the KISS principle. My old fashioned 6.5 V8 is nowhere near even being in the ballpark of being as refined or quiet as that new 4.5 V8 in the 'yota, but I'd prefer to rely on it in the scrub anyday.

Horses for courses.....I'm not going to get into a debate; but by the same token, I believe I have the right to let my point of view be known and I certainly respect the view of others.

Roachie
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Follow Up By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Monday, Mar 31, 2008 at 17:20

Monday, Mar 31, 2008 at 17:20
Richo,

After typing all the above, I just checked your profile and notice that you already have a 200 series. Please don't take my rantings the wrong way..... the most important thing/s I said in my above repsonse was in the last paragraph..... You have outlayed your hard-earned dosh on the car of your choice and I wish you all the very best of motoring bliss with it. I'm sure it will serve you well.

Cheers mate

Roachie
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Follow Up By: Richo (SA) - Monday, Mar 31, 2008 at 19:44

Monday, Mar 31, 2008 at 19:44
Roachie,

Agree with you comments - especially about the fitting of aftermarket bits and pieces.
I have actually put 2 12 volt sockets in the back and they are running my fridges just fine. I also wired in spotties, dual battery system, UHF radio, brake controller, Anderson plug and had a local car radio installer put my sat nav in. All are working fine and I know where things go if I do get stuck in the bush.
I went out to Loveday on the weekend and even with the bull bar fitted, the front end certainly sits low and did 'plough' through quite a few times. Other than that it performed brilliantly and was better than my Prado in a lot of circumstances.
It works for me as I am not in to 'extreme' off roading and do a lot of touring. With 3 kids there is plenty of room etc etc - I have my reasons for vehicle choice and it works for me.
What does p*ss me off if other people who think that the 200 series has a lot of electronics and therefore should be taken off the market - they are usually jealous and are just ready to bring others down (tall poppy syndrome ring a bell????)

So there, we agree on some points and there are pros and cons with anything - we all do what works best for us and should encourage others to do the same

Cheers and maybe catch ya round SA sometime!
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Reply By: Richo (SA) - Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 19:56

Saturday, Mar 29, 2008 at 19:56
A few questions..........

How often does a starter motor fail?

When it does fail, isn't it usually because of water ingress or similar?

I doubt that they would need to be replaced in five years time in a 200 particularly because there is no chance of anything foreign getting in there..

How many owners of other 4wd have replaced their starter motor after five years?

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Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Tuesday, Apr 01, 2008 at 20:59

Tuesday, Apr 01, 2008 at 20:59
Richo!! Gee, you are sounding a but serious. Its just the old Ford Holden thing, Nissan V Toyota.. All good vehicles, everyone just having a go.. No one really cares who has what, Jealousy, i dont think so, we all buy the vehicle suitable to our budget and our needs. Some people have raised good point about the 200 series potential downfalls but we could find fault in many other brands and models also. We all hope your vehicle serves you well. Michael.
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Follow Up By: Richo (SA) - Tuesday, Apr 01, 2008 at 21:08

Tuesday, Apr 01, 2008 at 21:08
Well it is the Holden and Ford thing and also the glass half full and half empty. It just gets a bit lame when everyone tries to bring vehicles or people down. How about wondering why they did put it in there and the potential advantages?
And I'm not serious - just putting across the other point of view.
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Reply By: autosparky - Tuesday, Apr 01, 2008 at 23:34

Tuesday, Apr 01, 2008 at 23:34
6 1/2 hr r/r on petrol model 200 series will need to remove fuel lines as well est 10 + hrs
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Reply By: Peter H - Wednesday, Apr 02, 2008 at 23:46

Wednesday, Apr 02, 2008 at 23:46
The V8 petrol cruiser has it in the same place, they are now ten years old (worldwide), yes the starter contacts go in them but as has been said before, 5 years should not be a problem more like 10 unless you drive it to the mall 10 times a day.
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