Engine coolant – something you may not know
Submitted: Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 16:49
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Mike Harding
On Saturday I popped into my local auto place to purchase some premixed coolant for topping-up purposes. Of course there were a dozen different types on the shelf so I carefully studied the labels to decide which was the right one. I finally settled on one approved to AS2108 Type B. Must be good, it’s got an Australian Standard approval… then I got to wondering what that actually meant so, this morning, I dug out the standard and discovered there are two types of coolant/antifreeze approved for sale under this standard in Oz; Type A and Type B.
Type A is a corrosion inhibitor and proper antifreeze, it must remain liquid to better than -12C.
Type B is simply a corrosion inhibitor and the standard makes no mention of temperature at all, in fact it could raise the freezing point of the coolant and still obtain a Type B approval.
For most people in Oz this probably doesn’t matter but for those of us who travel into the higher regions of NSW/Vic/Tas and the central deserts it may
well matter a lot.
I had always assumed that because the coolant the dealer put into my engine was green it was antifreeze but if you want to be sure of not blowing a welch plug or far worse ensure you specify Type A coolant.
Mike Harding
Reply By: RobAck - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 17:11
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 17:11
Mike the coolant issue is not
well understood and is somewhat more than even you have discovered.
The risk goes
well beyond just matching the colour and type. You cannot simply top up a pink coolant into a Toyota for example. Unless it matches the manufacturers specification exactly you run the risk of accellerated corrosion as a matter of course. If you have a look at the Natrad site the provide some good guidance on how to correctly replace coolant.
Hence we always carry a coolant top up supply which has been mixed by our Toyota service department.
At a technical briefing a year or so back we were shown the results of mixing coolants. The prime example was a very nasty and highly corroded WRX cooling system that had only lasted one month after topping up with the incorrect specification coolant.
Given the cooling system is the lifeblood of modern engines and that combined with the chemical reactions of the various metals that go to make up an engine these days skimping on maintaining a cooling system is not something I recommend
RobA
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Reply By: Member - barry F (NSW) - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 17:15
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 17:15
Thanks Mike, I don't venture into the colder regions as you & others do, but it just goes to show how easy you could come unstuck.
I was told years ago that never to assume anything, as the word stood for : it can make an ASS out of U and ME & how true that can be. Cheers.
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Reply By: Member - Kevin F (TAS) - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 17:27
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 17:27
Hi It is also an unknown that you should within a 2 year period completrly drain and flush both radiator and motor and top up with new coolant to your vehicles specification and I stress the flushing aspect because any residue left in motor or radiator will react with the new coolant.
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Follow Up By: donk - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 17:49
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 17:49
The 2 year rule does not apply in all cases
Toyota's pre 2004 (i cant remember the exact date ) were filled with red long life coolant (50/50
water) that was replaced every 2 years/40,000klms but post 2004 toyota's are filled with pink super long life coolant (premixed) that is not initally replaced until 150,000 klms
There was a specified change point but a lot of vehicles before this change point had pink ex factory
Also my 2005 patrol has the inital coolant change scheduled at 80,000 klms or 4 years
Regards Don
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Follow Up By: Stephen M (NSW) - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 21:14
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 21:14
Was changing the oil n filter the other day on wifes car and noticed a sticker under the bonnet. It says
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Reply By: howesy - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 17:27
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 17:27
And it gets even worse. The reason they tell you to flush the system
well before adding the new coolant is because in rare instances you will find a brand that is completely non compatable and it reacts with the other brand and impurities and turns to sludge which within days will block your radiator to the point where it will overheat ant the radiator will have to be removed and rodded out and reassembled. Always use the same brand or flush
well with the heater tap open.
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Follow Up By: Member - Ian W (NSW) - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 21:51
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 21:51
Oh Yes!
Too true, as I found out the hard way.
Was about to go on holidays and decided to be on the safe side and replace the coolant that had been in the Bravo for yonks with a fresh refill.
Dropped the bottom radiator hose, drained the coolant, ran the garden hose through the system, flushed it out, or so I thought, and refilled with fresh coolant mixed to the recommended ratio.
Travelled from
Sydney up the coast and the beast started pinging, then started to overheat, at Kempsey took it in to the Mazda Dealer who found that the coolant was gelling in the radiator.
Out come thre radiator for rodding.
I have never used anything other than genuine coolant since.
O.K! I now I'm paying a premium for what is actually a Castrol Product but I've not had a problem since.
Yes! There is such a thing as incompatible coolants.
Ian
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Reply By: mr fixit - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 17:45
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 17:45
And use soft
water (distilled
water) with the glycol mix
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Reply By: DIO - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 17:50
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 17:50
Why it pays to consult with the Owner's Manual and use oils, fluids etc that comply with THEIR (stated) standards. Can't go wrong that way.
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Follow Up By: Mike Harding - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 18:05
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 18:05
Most vehicle handbooks will make no mention of Australian Standards and the coolants I looked at didn't make mention of anything else???
Mike Harding
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Reply By: Louie the fly - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 19:45
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 19:45
An interesting read for those of us who think they know everything but don't. (not directed at anyone, just a general statement)
Coolant info
Disregarding any brand names, it's the info that's worth reading.
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Reply By: Member - Phil G (SA) - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 20:27
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 20:27
The solution is simple:
Only use the manufacturer's coolant.
Mixing coolants, even of the same type and specs can result in corrosion and blocked radiators.
So my Toyota vehicles get the correct red Toyota coolant. My Nissan vehicles get the green Nissan Coolant.
And they are both competitively priced.
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Follow Up By: Mike Harding - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 20:41
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 20:41
>Mixing coolants, even of the same type and specs can result in
>corrosion and blocked radiators.
I am compelled to ask; what is the point of having types and specifications (let alone Australian Standards!) if the above is correct.
Indeed how can you be sure a coolant from any given manufacturer which is of the same type and spec as the last one you bought won't result in a stuff up?
Mike Harding
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Follow Up By: Stephen M (NSW) - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 21:22
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 21:22
Having worked for Toyota Phils statement "Mixing coolants, even of the same type and specs can result in corrosion and blocked radiators." is totally correct. We found when we had cressida's (they were the worst) and some of the cruisers, early Tercels (if you remember them) if not flushed properly including heater core, all heater hoses etc when we used the Toyota coolant issued from the spare parts few weeks later you would have the same vehicles back in with blocked radiators. The two would mix, form like a gell and would block them
well and proper. Luckily never had any that resulted in head damage, BUT we could look back and see who serviced them and give a kick in the ar#e for not flushing the system properly still not good though for the customer. Took a while back then to work out that the coolant they were putting in from Japan was different to what we were using (even though they had the same specs !!! Work that one out) Regards Steve M
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Follow Up By: Member - Phil G (SA) - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 22:11
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 22:11
Mike,
Its common knowledge in the radiator industry. The tectalloy link that Louie posted explains it.
This Denso link says the same. I have a good friend who owns a chain of radiator workshops in
Adelaide, and he warned me of this about 10 years ago.
You can save $10 by using a coolant from Supercheap. But using factory coolant is very cheap insurance.
Stephen, the Cressida and Tercel examples occurred at a time when the dangers of mixing coolants wasn't appreciated, and aluminium radiators were becoming more common. I'd be surprised if the same would happen now. I recall VL Commodores and EA Falcons running into similar problems.
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Reply By: jcd - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 21:22
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 21:22
Hello,
Many moons ago I used to be a member of this site and still come
back to it from time to time as it is probably one of the least "contaminated" sites in the 4wd area.
I read this topic with interest and believe my experience with mixing coolants worth telling.
Background: I have an HZJ 105 (1999 model) and owned since new with 195k on the clock - also - I once was a diesel fitter (term shows my age!).
In a moment of weakness (divorce proceedings etc), I allowed and paid for somebody (who is a good honest mechanic) to service my vehicle. Within 20K of said service, the vehicle experienced; firstly some overheating problems and secondly, the radiator header effectively "blew". When I asked the mechanic what he had put in the radiator as a top up, he admitted that a "no name mentioned here" coolant had been used in a fairly small quantity. To put it simply, green had been mixed with red. I should also add that I had to replace the heater core (which is a s**t of a job on this vehicle).
Anyway, a new radiator later and total (and I mean total!) flush of the system, I now only use the same coolant (red/green whatever
takes your fancy) and change yearly - regardless of what is said on the label.
Hope the helps.
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Reply By: Member - Brian H (QLD) - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 21:36
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 21:36
Well now I'll have to read my manual before it goes in for its service (100,000) and if nessacary supply the oils and coolants as set out in the manual.
And make sure it gets flushed completely.
Thanks Mike more for one to remember :).
Brian
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Reply By: troopyman - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 22:34
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 22:34
read this .
mixing coolants
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Follow Up By: troopyman - Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 22:39
Monday, Jul 07, 2008 at 22:39
Every year at the same time (1 year interval) you need to have your radiator properly flushed out (not just a garden hose) and coolant replaced by a reputable radiator place .
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Reply By: TerraFirma - Tuesday, Jul 08, 2008 at 13:49
Tuesday, Jul 08, 2008 at 13:49
Yes it's Pandora's Box..! Check out your local Supercheap store , there are around 20 different brands and unless you read the fineprint they all contain Propylene Glycol.! LOL
I also note some make mention to being suitable for diesel engines, others don't.?
With all this in mind can someone recommend a type a or better brand compatible with all diesel engines..?
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Follow Up By: Stephen M (NSW) - Tuesday, Jul 08, 2008 at 18:23
Tuesday, Jul 08, 2008 at 18:23
Hi there TerraFirma,
"With all this in mind can someone recommend a type a or better brand compatible with all diesel engines..?"
Mate all I can say is go genuine. I will not use anything else in
mine. I have and always will use genuine Toyota coolant,filters, even on the old lux I had with (sold it with 297k on it) till the day I sold it all genuine. I think for piece of mind its worth it.Regards Steve
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Follow Up By: TerraFirma - Wednesday, Jul 09, 2008 at 12:07
Wednesday, Jul 09, 2008 at 12:07
Yes I use genuine for my vehicles, was looking at replacing my coolant in a boat with 2 x Diesel engines and have decided on Long Life Nulon. I trust the Nulon products, was a matter of choosing one of the coolants from their range. They also have the pink replacement for my Toyota if I ever need it.
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