OT Going Green-ish...the tanks are full

Hahahahaha

Somehow, I thinlk I am beyond that......lol



Cheers

Gerry

Yes, we have Half an Acre of land in a country town with vehicle access via a wide rear laneway. House built of sandstone and is 108 years of age. Has high pitched roof running east/west like yours buit with northfacing side for continuous heat for solar panels. We also have multiple outbuildings for rainwater catchment.


Cheers

Gerry,
An alternative in your situation might be a "heat pump" water heating unit. In general terms its you refrigerator turned back to front. Those hot coils mounted on the back of your fridge for cooling are wrapped around the water tank, the 'cold panel" that normally chills down the freezer compartment is on top of the roof or in the case of current models are merely mounted above the water tank with a recirculating fan.

Very efficient, reduced my water heating costs by more than fifty per cent.

Ian

Ian...wait till the compressor goes bang
heat pumps are cheaper to run but more ..much more expensive to fix if the heart of the system fails

Gerry,

I support what Ian W said in his reply.
After extensive research we decided on a Heat Pump system as we did not like the idea of putting a typical solar system on our roof (“ugly “.
We chose the Quantum system invented and manufactured in Newcastle.
Ours is a 360 litre one and with 4 adults (3 female and one male = about 6 people) it costs about 25 cents a day for hot water. It is incorrect to say the compressor will not last – they would have a similar life expectancy to a good quality household fridge compressor – about 20 to 25 years. In comparison we have friends whose normal solar panel system on their roof required repairs to the core unit – on a highset house they had to hire a crane to get it off, take to the workshop and then hire a crane to put back on roof again. A VERY expensive process.
As stated above heat pumps work as a reverse air conditioner – in this case cold air is a by product . You can duct this into your home if you want for free “air conditioning” and put a bypass in for winter months. The cold air by product is traditionally 10 degrees Celsius lower than the ambient temperature. They work in all weather sunny or not and are exported to Canada even.
Check out www.quantumenergy.com.au
I am not associated with Quantum – just believe they have the best product of this type. They were the first to make this technology available commercially for heating hot water.
As it is still solar (taking heat from the air) you still get all the relevant State and Commonwealth subsidies that exist.

Cheers,
Glen

firstly and to make a point..i have not said the compressor wont last...its very more expensive to replace the heart of such systems than an electric element

the SA gov have banned (or about tol) replacement electric element type hotwater services...you can still get your heater fixed but it cannot be replaced with a new element type....not sure if its law right now and if not it will apply soon.....

The units that Quantum are quoting are only capable of cooling a small room..if that......

and what is going to cool your house (err bathroom as thats how big a room it can do) when the hot water storage tank thermostat tells the heatpump it does not need to heat the water anymore?...it will not work....

The cooling aspect is a "FREE" by product - so its not an issue how much it will or will not do. This is not the reason you buy one. But if its ducted into the house for summer whatever hours its "on" it helps with your core means of cooling - air conditioning or whatever. With the solar panel type - there is no free by product at all and they only work when its sunny. My point is that heat pump type systems are better (in my opinion) than the solar panel systems as they (1) don't have to be on your roof to look unsightly; (2) they work 24 hrs a day in any weather; (3) cost a minimal amount to operate (about the same as a fridge for 3 or 4 hors a day); and (4) you get free cold air as a by product if you can utilise it (for 3 or 4 hrs per day).
I think you are right about electric element ones - they are about to be (or soon will be banned) in all States for new installations. Its true that a compressor would be far more expensive to replace than an element - but a plumber I spoke to recently said the new electric units only lasted a bout 7 or 8 years anyway and they cost a lot more to run with electricity. I think a compressor should last at least 20 years if its only used a few hours a day.
Its a personal choice but we chose the heat pump type for I believe valid reasons is all i'm saying.
Cheers

"I think a compressor should last at least 20 years if its only used a few hours a day."...yep have seen many last that log and just as many last less than a year...on average say 10-15......and not withstanding the fact that lots of other faults happen that could wipe out the compressor..eg refrigerant leak

gas is better way to go as the maintenance costs are much less but not everyone has access to NG..lpg is expensive

if i had my way an no access to gas i'd go solar....and i'm a fridgie
...might get a heatpump backup ....lol

at the high discharge superheat settings that those things are needed to operate it does put the system under somewhat of strain when its operating...if the water temp is controlled to 60C the discharge temp of the refrigeration system must be around 65-70 whereas as normal heatpump temp is around 50-60 when operating in heat mode....these are very high discharge temps (ie...to pump high discharge temps requires higher pumping (discharge) pressures) which has a direct bearing on compressor life...both mechanically and electrically

Are you referring to Quantum compressors that you say have lasted less than a year or refrigeration in general.
Quantum systems were originally built for the commercial market - Motels, hair Dressing Salons etc that had a high demand for hot water. I would have thought that the compressor would be built to the standard required such as high discharge pressures etc . Domestic use should see the systems used well below their capacity. But I acknowledge I am not an expert in this area as you are - all I have done is research on the various systems and talked to people who are using heat pumps.
PS heat Pump systems ARE considered to be SOLAR systems for compliance with the Government legislation for rebates.

do quantum build their own compressors?...dont think so (but i stand to be corrected) as i reckon they would source from existing manufacturers...i refer to refrigeration in general

i would say that they use Standard off the shelf units ...ie techumseh, copeland, danfoss etc etc...a standard unit can easily pump those pressures...how ever, the main differnece being that heat pump aircon units dont run all day, every time upto or at those limits while the Hot Water systems would and do.... it is this increased workload that puts more stress on moving bits that will reduce longevity.....its a fact of life that more heat means more wear n tear

most reputable aircon units have 5 yr warranty on compressors...quantum have 2...they also only expect 12-15 yrs life cycle on the entire unit....so if its 12 it a bit short of your 20+yrs wouldnt you say......this is "considered" average life span of a heatpump aircon compressor...but will it actually go the distance under the increased working conditions on a HW service?...as i say above, increased heat = more wear n tear to moving parts

Cheezes Member No 1

This is the most you have written in the last 5 years on the forum. Man, you are wealth of information....he he he


Cheers

you have just never read any of my posts, cos your never home...hahaha

Tim

Some locals here have installed Solar Power as well whereby they can put electricity back into the grid. Minimum expenditure think think is $16,000 with an $8000 rebate from the Government.


Cheers

You have done well. I have a solar hot water system that is not worth two bob. I have to put a booster on every day to get water warm enough for a shower. Will probably call someone this week to get an off peak. Looked at heat pumps, but at $4k it's a bit beyond me.

Jack

Jack

I have Off Peak tarriff on a separate switch and have to use the booster in winter. Some mornings even the hot water pipes are frozen and one has to wait for the sun to warm them up. As soon as the weather warms up the J Tarriff stays switched off. Everything is a compromise. My Soloar water is an Edwards from WA.

Cheers

Hahahahahaha Axle

D3 indeed......... OMDB


Thats why I said Green-ish...LOL



Cheers

Mfewster

Had no problems with the toilet rebate. In fact we boke even on that one. But with the tanks they stuffed us around a lot claiming computer troubles etc and in the end we only received $485 rebate instead of about $800. But at least it was something back and that paid for the plumber.


Cheers

W. I have also heard of others who have claimed the $800 and only received about $400 back(eventually) with no understanding of why they didn't get the amount advertised. The rebate system in SA seems very sus. The Minister late last year boasted that over a 1000 rebates has been given out. 1000!!!!!!! Given the water supply issues you would think the number would be MUCH higher than this unless there are issues with the rebate system. I'm also told that if you join a tank to your hot water service and also join to the toilets, they won't pay for both (but this doesn't show in the description of the scheme). My plumber reckons the rebate sytem is a joke and designed to look as though something is being done by the guvvament without actually doing anything at all.

Meant to ask, did you have to put in an electric pump?

Yes, everything this government does seems sus. They even tried to take away our country hospitals. Now they have backpedalled for the time being but it remains to be seen how they will come back with a new stupid scheme. The Gepps Cross Line is alive and well...lol

I did not need to install an electric pump as the main tank is atop an old tank base and there is enough pressure to push through at least 6000 of the 6500litres.

I do have a Davey Pump for pumping between tanks or for whatever I need to do.

Garbutt

And there I was thinking I had reasonable storage...lol

A friend on the outskirts of Melbourne has a 150,000lt tank set between two large sheds.

Anyway, it all helps

Cheers

I'v thought about putting in 90000 lt underground cement but the cost says that even the new water pricing structure says its uneconomical.....when they get the desal plant up and running i want to know where they are going to the power to run it...bugga me looks like i'll have to turn the aircon off and put the tank in anyway & use it as a pool in to keep cool...

wish i new all of this was going to happen 8 yrs ago.... before we did renovations... too hard to put decent sized above ground tanks in now without them being unsightly......would have redesigned land and building layout if i'd known