batteries and underbonnet heat

CRAIG M

where else does the supplier think that you are going to keep the bloody thing??

sounds like he is trying to dupe you.
ide go back to him and call him bluff with Fair Trading (as much as ther're worth)......

Underbonnet Heat ...

Definitely an issue ... it affects engine performance due to heated intake air. Snorkels dont provide better performance because of forced airflow alone ... its the quality of air provided as well.

The heat also hardens wiring and connectors, engine mounts and causes battery problems - even gel cell ones. The length of time these things take to happen are vehicle specific obviously.

My setup is remove the insulation surrounding the battery and use it or something else as a shield from the exhaust ... also duct some tubing to direct cool air at the battery if you feel its nescessary.

Euro / US vehicles tend to have a battery problem more so than Aust 'specific' models.

And yes you are being shafted on battery quality ... we all are ... they dont last nearly as long today as what they used to.

Excessive heat can be the biggest killer of batteries.
Why not put some insulation around the outside of the battery. I use a small piece of aircell bent around the outside of the battery case. Makes a huge difference to temperature inside. Also I always sit my battery on a 7mm thick rubber base (cut from old ute liner) and this acts as insulation from underneath as well as reduces vibrations for battery (another way to kill a battery). I have been getting between 4 and 7 years out of my batteries as a general rule.
Cheers,
GPM

Craig,
Yes excessive heat can effect batteries, but I'd have thought from the description you have given, you 'should' be OK.

I had a normal lead acid deep cycle in the engine bay of my Hilux fail after about 18 months. As I had AGMs everwhere else (in the back and in the CT), I decided to replace it with an AGM. I got a lot of warnings (including on this forum) that AGMs don't like heat and it was likely to fail in the engine bay.

I spoke to Val Rigoli at Fridge and Solar on the Gold Coast, where I had previously bought some of my AGMs. He said he had only had one reported AGM failure due to heat - it was mounted right next to the turbo. He had a look at where was planning on mounting and said he would cover it under warranty if it failed.

That battery spent 2 years in the engine bay of the Hilux, including two trips to NT. It has now been in the engine bay of my new 79 Series Toyota for 6 months.

If you are concerned about heat, is it possible to install a heat shield - cheaper than moving the battery.

As for warranty, many companies warrant a replacement product as a new item (ie warranty period starts again). Those who do not are probably not breaking any law. But IMO, they are indicating a lack of confidence in their product. I'd be shopping elsewhere next time.

Norm C

What make battery tray do you have?

From a legal standpoint, as long as the installation instructions did not specify 'distance to manifold' or 'do not exceed x temp' then he is blowing hot air up your clacker.

You should get a full replacement, no cost.

What brand/type/size was the battery?

Have a look at the Battery manufacturers datasheet.

If it's an AGM, it most probably specifies no charging above 55deg C. Engine compartments can get up to 70 deg in summer.

I have 2 Optima battery's which by the manufactures data sheet should not be charged when the temp exceeds 50c.

The battery's live in the confines of a 75 series cruiser beside one exhaust bank of the Chev V8 diesel. The engine bay gets extremely hot in North Qld.


The last battery I retired at 8 yrs, not because it failed but because I believed it was close to the end of it's life, well I started the sons car the other day with it and it's age is now 9yrs.

It looks to me like battery's ain't battery's

Have a good one and maybe you might have to buy a better battery

I purchased some from this company. I got it through Repco, it was just over $100 but I spent $550 on my lifeline battery so I just did it (in for a penny...). So far so good, almost 2 years and no issues. You can custom bend the stuff and it has a layer of ceramic between the aluminum.http://www.aclperformance.com.au/prod_heatshield.htm

Thanks for all the input guys. I will answer some of the q's asked tomorrow when I get the battery back. I have decided to just curse the battery, the agent and the horse they rode in on from afar and let it be. As for the insulation idea, maybe a combination of that and a stainless heatshield may do the trick. the battery in question is a low maintenence lead acid deep cycle.

Should I look at a sealed gel cell or something similar or go back to the old lead acid wet battery idea? Which one will stand up the best to my circumstances? The load is mostly a 39l engel with the occasional HF use but only with the motor running. I have a 3 way for standard camping use so the engel rarely runs with the motor stopped.

As an aside on the "warranty for the replacement items" issue - here in SA the consumer affairs staff have publicly stated that a warranty replacement item enjoys the new warranty period all over again - makes sense, is logical, and is law. Maybe QLD is the same ? Whatever - you are moving on - might be the smart thing - save your energy for happier projects :-o)

Many vehicles suffer from battery failure due to heat, the 75 series being one example. To fix it Toyota put a metalic heat shield between it and the exhaust, then insulated the battery & put vents in the gaurds. Home modifications I've seen are putting spacers on the bonnet hinges to let the hot air our in front of the windscreen & putting air vents in the top of the bonnet. Jeep Wranglers actually have a heat reduction bonnet available as they have been been known to have premature failures.
IMHO there is no point putting another battery in the same location unless you put in a sheild of some description & vent the hot air. It's unlikely there was anything wrong with the batteries that failed although there may be a different type available that has greater resistance to heat. If the supplier fitted the battery in that location then a minimum 12 month total replacement should be in place. If you fitted the battery then I'd see it was your mistake mounting it in that location & would be a bit rich to expect the supplier to give you a new one.
Cheers Craig..........

The Jaguar XJ12, there was not much room under the bonnet after that engine was jammed in where 6 cylinders used to be.
Things got pretty warm under there so they put a fan right on the battery box to keep the battery cool.

Dave

Hi Craig, firstly DON'T put a lead acid battery in your TD5, it WILL BOIL and FAIL due to the heat from the Turbo and over charging by the TD5 alternator, use an AGM/GEL or Calcium/calcium battery that what come standard in the TD5 Disco, so he is right about getting a GELCEL battery, THE CHARGE RATE IS WHAT KILLS THE LEAD ACID BATTERY, the standard starter battery in the TD5 is a Delfi 900CCA 100AH Calcium/calcium.

I have a TD5 Disco, you CANNOT use a lead acid battery in a TD5/V8 Disco OR Defender.

More info on where the battery is, you'll need a heat shield on the battery tray, my auxillary is in the same place and i had the same problem your having, it wasn't untill i had stuffed my second battery and covered the firewall with acid that i found out about TD5s over charging lead acid batteries, i now have an AGM 60AH Fullriver as my auxillery battery and has been in for nearly 3 yrs now without any problems.

Go here if you want more info
D2 Dual Battery info

Baz.

A big THANK YOU to all who have posted comments here. You have sorted out my issues and now I have some direction in which to go. I can still live up to the old saying 'I don't know very much myself, but I know where there are a lot of people who do'

Thanks guys, you have saved me a lot of time and money.

Craig