Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 15:11
Diesel Gas Australia.
With that said - do your homework first.
Gas injection on a diesel isn't as effective for naturally aspirated as it might be for turboed engines according to what I've read.
I have the Gas injection on a 4.2 turboe diesel engine & the results are quite good - they might not be as good on a naturallly aspirated 4.2.
Maybe you could get better performance improvement for the same $ from say adding a turbo, or a turbo & intercooler - and then later adding the lpg injection where the engine can then make use of the extra fuel?.
In order to burn that extar fuel in the LPG - you need enough oxygen available and a naturally aspirated engine will only suck so much air.
Making that air comporessed and forced in with a turbo will add more oxygen and get a better burn as will cooling the air charge with an intercooler make the air more dense and hence more Oxygen in eacgh charge.
Then when you add the LPG - the engine can use it.
The principle of LPG injection is supposedly to compensate for the ineficiency inherrant in diesel engines where heat of compression ignites the fuel charge.
This design - manages to not be able to control very
well - where in the pistons stroke the ignition takjes place, and as a result only about 87% efficiency of combustion takes place. When you add the air(O2) and LPG the ignition results in a more complete burn of the available fuel to about 99% efficiency!
Hence you gain a 12% power increase.
Without the extra air - I've read of a Landcruiser diesel naturally injected that got little if any improvement - the air (o2) just wasn't available to get the expected improvement and the vehicles gearing wasn;'t that efficient anyway - meaning what was and couldn't be effectively used anyway....
I reckon with a trucks low gearing that likely you might strike the same scenario.
The attraction of the LPG injection obviously - is because of the Govt rebate/s on installation costs up to $3K depending where you live. ($2K fed grant for eastern staters +$1000 state govt grant for Sandgropers).
If it is a $ constraints leading you toward LPG - maybe get it done while the grants are available,(i.e. before the govt cuts them out under the current fiscal climate)....and tyhen get the turbo and intercooler work done later when you can afford it.
Of course - I have no idea in the Bitsamissing 4.2 desel is designed to take the added HP of a turbo, intercooler or LPG injection - thats for you to determine.
Most Original equipment turbo diesel engines are beefed up considerably to take the added forces involved over their naturaly apsirated cousins.
Usually bigger (4 bolt) mains and larger dia big end journals, heavier con rods, and oil capilliarys that run up the con rods to oil squirters under the piston crown which takles away the higher heat of combustion, into the sump oil to be cooled via an Oil cooler radiator out front & so on.
To add extra HP to an engine not designed from the gorund up to cope with it might not be the wisest of long term decisions, and is something the individual must discern for him her self.
There are a lot of after market turbo fitted vehicles getting around that seem to cope OK with the extra HP of turbos so - it really probably depends on your particular Mitsubishi engine design.
Good luck with it - whaever you choose - keep us posted on how it all goes, what decisions you reach and how the mods work out!
Cheers
AnswerID:
346012
Follow Up By: Member - Scooby (WA) - Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 17:37
Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 17:37
I agree with Flywest. I have had gas on a 3 Litre n/a Hilux for over a year now and while there is a slight increase in power and a drop in diesel consumption I am not sure if it is worth it.
If I had not got $3000 back (I was out of pocket $800 for the install) I would say definitely not worth it on a n/a motor.
There are disadvanteges to fitting gas as
well.
1/ Extra weight in vehicle.
2/ More clutter under bonnet.
3/ Having to fill up twice. What I mean by that is filling with diesel and then moving to the gas pump and sometimes getting chatted by the consol operator as they think you are driving off.
4/ Reliability issues. My system has stopped working 3 times.
So, do the research. There is an interesting post on the Australian 4WD Action
forumSite Link
Regards
Scooby
FollowupID:
614017
Follow Up By: Member - Lance S (VIC) - Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 18:48
Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 18:48
Hi guys,
Originally i was going the chip, but after lots more homework, i decided to go the D-Gas, BUT i can't get it in Victoria.
Scooby, which gas have you got?
They don't know how long it will be before we can get the approval from the AAFRB to have the gas, even though there are cowboys out there who do, do it.
The closest is Albury, but the drive doesn't worry me.
I have a 3lt Navara, 2004 model.
What was the problem when it stopped 3 times?
Was the
tank fitted under the bonnet?
I have been quoted $4500, with 2k rebate and also did you get a bigger exhaust?
I think i'm finished.
cheers,
Lance
FollowupID:
614032
Follow Up By: Member - Lance S (VIC) - Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 18:50
Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 18:50
Don't know why i wrote about the
tank under the bonnet.
FollowupID:
614034
Follow Up By: Rick james - Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 08:23
Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 08:23
Hi lance where abouts are you because there is a place in
my home town in vic that are doing the dgas system, i was quoted $1800 plus the rebate for my 105 series.
FollowupID:
614091
Follow Up By: Member - Scooby (WA) - Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 11:06
Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 11:06
Hi Lance,
I have D-Gas which uses a two stage injection system. The amount of gas delivered is set by fixed jets which are set up by the installer. I have the first stage set to come in at 1200RPM and the second at 2400RPM. There is a debate on the 4WD Action
forum about different gas systems and which is best.
I have had a 30 litre gas
tank fitted under the passenger side of my Hilux. This required the exhaust to be re-aligned closer to the drive shaft.
I have had problems with the gas gauge, on / off switch,
water leaking and bad electrical connections.
Regards
Scooby
FollowupID:
614111
Follow Up By: Member - Lance S (VIC) - Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 14:17
Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 14:17
RJ, I am in Narre Warren
Where abouts is your home town?
Have you got the phone number and address of the installer?
cheers
Lance
FollowupID:
614135
Follow Up By: Rick james - Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 14:59
Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 14:59
Hi lance im in moe the name of the buisness is JSD automotive he is a diesel mechanic the number is 51277888 ask for john.
FollowupID:
614142