exceeding bag limits

Submitted: Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 17:49
ThreadID: 65434 Views:3834 Replies:9 FollowUps:10
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just come back from a four day fishing trip with the son and his wife. Last stop was at pt Clinton for two days crabbing. got up first morning and out we went, spent about two hours raking to get our bag limit.(40 each). as we could not catch any more crabs we through a line in.
while doing this over about six hours my son notice that the same guy had been coming and going the whole time, back and forth.
My son said that every time he gets his forty crabs he takes the bin back and empties it then out for another load. Didn't see him throw any back, so would say he kept any size he caught. the next day the same thing, back and forth. we estimated he must of got over 500 crabs just in the time we were there.
Son and i went up and chatted the bloke but didn't8 get a good reception. this goes on all the time, according to one of the guys in the shack next to where we were staying.
I know that the fisheries inspectors cant be everywhere but maybe a fishing liecence may be the answer. then we could channel the funds into more inspectors.
cheers shane.
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Reply By: Member - Stephen L (Clare SA) - Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 18:04

Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 18:04
Hi Shane
I hope that you took his vehicle rego and pass it on to the authorities.

Cheers

Stephen
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AnswerID: 346045

Follow Up By: Member - shane (SA) - Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 18:20

Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 18:20
details have been pasted on.
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FollowupID: 614029

Reply By: Madfisher - Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 18:17

Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 18:17
Agree 100% Shane, my motto for the last 30 years is fish with tomorrow in mind. NSW went though a period with no fishing lic at all. Since being reintroduced the fishing has improved especially in our impoundments. Our Lic money also goes to build fishways over weirs etc.
Join a fishing club and get them to lobby for a lic.
Cheers Pete
AnswerID: 346047

Reply By: Member - Uncle (NSW) - Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 19:02

Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 19:02
Reminds me of what happened while we were camped at Red Bluff on Quobba Stn WA. Had a guy near us who fished hard every morning, then loaded all his fish into a freezer he had running off a generator. He then had a guy from another camp come up and abuse him for running the gennie so often, as he was the only guy at Red Bluff with one going. His reply was " I gotta keep me fish frozen till I get home"..
I just can't work some people out sometimes, why not just take what ya need for a quick feed, then go fishing again when you feel like fish for tea again?!.
..
AnswerID: 346053

Follow Up By: Madfisher - Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 20:29

Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 20:29
I love to fish and catch far more then I care to eat, so release most.
The young fella(13) and I spent a week up at lake St Clair and had a gloriuous time catching large bass of an evening on fly. We had bass every day for lunch and brought 8 home and we lost count how many we released. I was pleased as punch as the young bloke outfished me again lol
Cheers Pete
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Follow Up By: Member - Uncle (NSW) - Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 20:48

Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 20:48
Much the same here Pete, we try to do trip down the Shoalhaven River from Tallowa Dam by canoe once a year , if not more. And there are some big Bass down along that route, but all are released. And been a member of Nowra Sportfishing Club and ANSA, since I was 14, (45 now). cheers Unc
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Reply By: Rockape - Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 19:07

Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 19:07
Gotta agree 100% with you, I came from working in the Gulf and seeing half a million pound of prawns in 74 thrown over the side cause no one could process them. Then there was the spanner crabs that they chased up the east coast and destroyed by over fishing.

Pros it must be the pros I here the cry, well it was then but now it is the amateur with the fast boat/Gps/fishfinder and all the goodies that go with them.

I still hear amateurs winge when they close sections of the reef up here, some don't understand that you can't keep taking and taking.

If they want to take all and sundry, bring back the flat bottom punt/oars and handlines rolled on a coke bottle and that will sort the over fishing out.

AnswerID: 346056

Follow Up By: Member - shane (SA) - Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 20:07

Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 20:07
could not agree more, I admit i use to be a hard hunter and fisher
when i was a teenager. Got married, had kids which slowed things down a bit. about 20 years ago i went to cairns with the wife. Did all the usual things but what changed my life was the two days we spent out on the reef with a marine biologist. I now look at the sea totally different, i only go fishing a few times a year and never take more than i need. I have also installed these values in my son who seems to see the would as i do. As far as hunting, i just don't understand that side of it either. But i do respect the choice of others to hunt but try to change their mine when ever i can.
cheers shane.
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FollowupID: 614040

Follow Up By: Member - Brian H (QLD) - Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 22:25

Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 22:25
Sorry cannot see the value as yet in ALL the revenue taken for fishing license, boating rego (boat) trailer rego, camping permit, boating permit, (may need to get out more) been fishing a lot and have not seen a inspector YET, not that it matters I catch and release but do take a feed while camping or a few fillets home for the good lady.

The license thing is a pita really or should I call it a permit local dam you need a fishing licence, boating permit, camping permit to be honest I cannot be bothered going there as it simply costs to much, rather go elsewhere, and now do.

To me a licence / permit is just a TAX named differently all goes in and sweet Fu%K all comes back.

As for hunting don't really care if people do its no different to fishing as I see it.

As for calling the HOTLINE for reporting fishing breaches done that many times before and a TOTAL waste of time and that goes for vehicle rego number unless you have it on video or they are caught in the vehicle red handed with the stuff may as well have saved your phone call.

So now just go fishing and relax when I can.

Brian

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Follow Up By: Member No 1- Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 07:29

Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 07:29
shane,
what is hunting?
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FollowupID: 614086

Follow Up By: Madfisher - Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 16:10

Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 16:10
Goodday Brian,
In NSW fisheries are stocking in freshwater appox 3 million fish ea year. We would not have an impoundment native fishery with out this stocking as in most dams their do not breed very successfully.
I was one fisher who fought long and hard for the reintoduction of a lic, as we had a very poor fishing prior. The cost in NSW is less then a slab. Now in Tassie my eyes water lol.
Cheers Pete
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Reply By: austastar - Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 21:28

Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 21:28
We would only shoot or fish for the pot, never for sport. I can't get my head around the TV fishing programs showing catch and release, why catch if you aren't going to eat it?
But then again I don't under stand football either.
cheers
AnswerID: 346086

Follow Up By: Madfisher - Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 16:04

Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 16:04
The thril of catching a large fish on light sports gear far outweighs the satifaction of eating it. We have a BIG cod on private property that has been caught a no of times by friends and was released ea time. Two years ago my 11 y old hooked and landed it after a torrid 30 min fight. Most of this was captured on video. The fish was released again to breed and give someone else a thrill in the future.
If my friends had killed it my son would not have had the excitment of catching it. Plus this cod has all the carp in the area running scared.
Cheers Pete
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FollowupID: 614153

Reply By: gbdid - Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 23:01

Monday, Jan 26, 2009 at 23:01
Ahh dont worry about it, pretty soon he wont be able to catch any as they will all be gone.
I remember( yes I am old enough to be able to say that) holidaying inStansbury as a kid and the bay was full of razor fish. Last time I was there at low tide it looked like a desert.
Yet they still have a bag limit of 50 razor fish in SA.
Wonder how many people get 50 razor fish at Stansbury nowadays?
Cheers.
AnswerID: 346100

Reply By: paulnsw - Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 03:00

Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 03:00
Somebody bragging here in the last couple of weeks how they took 12 Murray Cod from 1 location. Regardless of it been legal or not, it is disgraceful greed and vandalism to do such a thing. Look how greed is good and great has got the world economic system and we are heading down the same path with our environmental systems.
AnswerID: 346107

Follow Up By: Madfisher - Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 16:15

Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 16:15
Thats shocking, I have not killed a cod for 5 years, even though we caught 12 one week end on lures. Yellowbelly taste similar and fisheries breed these now by the million, so if I want a feed I take a couple of goldens.
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FollowupID: 614157

Reply By: Flywest - Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 15:55

Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 15:55
Shifting goal posts.

I don't think many these days would condone the "freezer fishers" mentality!

As one who in the past has appeared on the TV fishsing shows with the likes of Starlo - and advocated "catch & release" - these days I no longer do.

Thats because the goal posts have changed.

Fisheries managers and professional fishers (who rape and pillage our oceans) have colluded together to create a NEW system that exploits recreational anglers willingness to take bag reductions willingly - in order to disenfranchise them from a fair and equitable share of the "Total Allowable Catch" (part that can be sustainably harvested).

This "new system" is something Fisheries managers call "IFM".

It stands for "Integrated Fisheries Management".

In and of itself - it SOUNDS like a great new tool for management and administered correctly it could well be just that!

The problems arise when we have high value fisheries worth many many $ millions per year of foreign export revenues at risk - if an equitable share were given to recreational anglers - in a climate where fishstocks are unquestionably collapsing!

Examples of high value export fisheries Abalone, Lobsters Prawns Pearls etc

The Lobster industry is a good & currently topical example.

The industry in WA has been worth up to $600,000,000 (Six Hundred Million Dollars) a year in export revenues to the state inyears past - and there are about 600 licenses - so in effect every lobster fisherman makes about a Million a year.

Some 'industry moguls' own large shareholdings of many of the high value industries i.e they own entire prawn trawling fleets and multiple lobster licenses and processing export factories / multiple Abalone Licenses and export factories and Many pearl farms both here in Oz and overseas as well.

These folks make enough a year to be able to successfully bribe our politicians by making very large "annonymous donations" to major political parties election campaigns, in return for "special favors' from Fisheries Minsters & Fisheries CEO's etc when it comes to legislation.

Thats easey to say and usually hard to prove..but occasionally a few of the minions come unstuck via the Crime Corruption Commission hearings etc

eg http://www.thewest.com.au/default.aspx?Men...ontentID=115936

[quote] The department, (Fisheries) which recently lost its chief executive and two senior fisheries officers to a corruption scandal,
[/quote]

So - we have Industry Moguls of the Ilk like Paspaley (Pearl & Prawning interests) who secretly bought out another Fish9ng Monopoly (Kailis Fisheries) but kept it quiet for 6 months or more because it was not advantageous for the public to know that one great monopoly was aiming to own and control ALL high value commercial fisheries in WA, and didn't want it to be "obvious" that official corruption was involved in realizing that dream - the Fisheries minsiter and his party werebeing "paid off" to allow it to happen.

So

How was IFM (Integrated Fisheries Management) an otherwise innocuous fishery managment tool - used against recreational anglers?

Well - one of the tenets of IFM is this.

Once biologiocal assessements of the "total (ecologically sustainable) allowable catch" (TAC) are determined by marine biologists, those TAC figures are distributed among the professional recreational and traditional indigenous user groups on a historical catch percentage basis.

Now as mentioned before Rec anglers have for years willingly accepted bag reductions as part & parcell of the 5 year West Coast, South Coast, Gascoign, etc Review process.

However one of the shortcommings of IFM...is that theres no allowance for the growth of rec anglers numbers as our population increases!

As additional pressure mounts from growing participants the bag limitof Rec Fisheres TAC has to be reduced to go across the increasing participants.

Eventually when theres not enough rec share of TAC resource for a bag limit of 1 fish per angler per day, Rec anglers will be required to BUY BACK from professional anglers at going market rates a percentage of THEIR TAC (Total Allowable Catch) to maintain bag limits!

Yes - we will have to PAY the pros to stay home and watch us go out to catch a fish - that most are advocating we should then release!

So - this is how the corrupt Fisheries Minister and his corrupt Fisheries dept staff "stole" the rec fishers share of the resource ahead of the IFM catch distribution process.

The Minister at the direction of the industry mogul, would "arbitrarily" halve the recreational bag limit of say Blue Manna Crabs as but one shining example saying publicly he had scientific evidence they were under threat.

(Remember there is a formal west coast review process every 5 years to reduce bag limits with consesus of rec anglers) This decision was taken without rec fisher consultation and outside the formal review process.

Yet his own Fisheries Dept Annual reports would show that Pro Catch averages of 50 tonnes from that system - had been exceeded to 85 tonnes in that record professional catch year!

Kinda makes a mockery of the suggestion the resource is under threat from excessive recreational catch during a record pro catch year!.

At the same time he would set up a 3 year creel survey to establish "the recreational catch statistics". (These of course will reveal a 50% decline from REAL figures because the bag limit was arbitrarily halved).

Thus in 3 years time when the TAC is researched and published - the allocation to rec fishers will be only 50% of what the REAL recreational catch statistics should have ensured.

In effect the Pros will get 50% of the rec fishers %age entitlement under TAC BECAUSE the then Fisheries minister arbitrarily made a decision ahead of the IFM process, that halved the rec catch and set up a statistics project to cement that figure prior to introducing the new IFM principles into manageing that fishery such that the pros will reap that increased share!

The same things have happened in the Lobster Fishery

Rec Prawning banned altogether!

Etc Etc etc

This is what happens when pro industry moguls who are multi millionaires and billionaires start using those $ to bribe the politicians & public servants in charge of the process.

For the rec angler......only one choice is left!

Kill & Eat your bag limit and make sure it is in the creel survey results in order to get a fair as possible IFM allocation of the TAC - which will then diminishg every year thereafter in terms of bag limits as participant numbers in rec fishing increase and we then face the prospect of BUYING BACK the privelege from Pro fishers - to go out and catch a fish

If you C&R - you might as well just GIVE our Recreational anglers share of the TAC resource to the pros and sell your fishing rods now.

You see the goal posts have changed - Australias fisheries will likely become a monopoly ownership by one or two industry moguls who can BUY state and federal politicians and Public Servants to do their bidding and use their positions of power to disenfranchise recreational anglers of their far share of the resouce bye corrupting the IFM process in a way its =creators never dreampt of!

Our only way out - in the future under the current system - will be to BUY those resource rights back.

So in short - if we don't catch and eat our bag limit we are just giving them to the pros & will have to eventually buy them back - yep pay th epros to stay home and watch us go out for a fish.

Dunno bout you but to me that sucks big time.

And that from a devout C & R fan who now advocates Kill N eat!

Don't blame me - I didn't invent the now corrupted IFM process and I didn't buy off any Corrupt Fisheries Minsiters or Fisheries Dept Staff!

Quite simply we are being robbed and worse - anything we don;t kill and eat we might just as well GIVE to the pros, coz under IFM thats what happens in perpetuity for every fish you release.

Sure it's all bass ackwards but I didn;t invent the system - I'm just the ONLY guy in Australian Rec Fishing Circles blowing the whistle at the moment!

A LOT of the Rec Fishing Community are still being blinded by all the smoke & Mirrors!

Hopefully they will wake up when they join the dots - but bye then it will be too late because the fix is already in and the political donations deals behind closed doors have already been done!!

Guys like Rex (bless him) and Buschy and Starlo (and dare I say Myself) - were RIGHT at the time to promote C & R angling practices under the rules in place at the time as the responsible thing to do!

Those times & rules have now changed because the Politicians and Pro Fishing Industry Moguls - corruptly worked out a way to change the goal posts and USE Recreational anglers concern for the future of the resource, as a TOOl to strip them of their historical right to an equitable share of the resources Total Allowable Ecologically Sustainable Catch biomass and take that share for themselves for a hefty profit!

Simple - the goal posts have changed - we got to half time and now we are kicking towardthe other end of the oval fellas - time to wake up now or pony up your $ afterwards to BUY back what rightfully belongs to us now!

The corrupt pros have stolen "catch & release" from us rec anglers and are now using it (under the guise of IFM) Integrated Fisheries Management to swindle us!

"Catch & Eat - it's the new Rec Fishers Call To Arms!

Sorry for the "war & peace" length epic reply but its an important subject being largely ignored by rec fishers. Fisheries Consulting is something I do - and someone did ask the question / post the thread and this is an issue comming to you soon no matter where in Aus you live!!

Theres the bad guys taking more than their limit they will always be crooks - but theres the broader issue here - the big picture if you will.

Catch & eat a few fish - its your right as an Australian citizen and recreational fisherman, and one you'll soon be paying some industry billionaire pro fishing mogul and a few corrupt politicians for the right to buy it back!

Cheers
AnswerID: 346174

Follow Up By: kev.h - Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 18:47

Tuesday, Jan 27, 2009 at 18:47
Hey Mate slow down or you,ll get RSI then you wont be able to fish at all
I do agree we have to get off our backsides and do something now before its too late - good wake-up call
Where to from here?
Cheers Kev
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FollowupID: 614166

Reply By: Member - Richard H (NSW) - Monday, Feb 09, 2009 at 12:35

Monday, Feb 09, 2009 at 12:35
Image Could Not Be FoundI remember on the Darling River in years past of camps running freezers full of Murray Cod & Yellowbelly fillets.

Now all we catch is bloody European Carp. The Fisheries bloke here told me recently that the demise of the native fish has seen to the rapid rise of the carp. Evidently, native fish like to eat the little carp.

On of last Saturday's Sydney papers mentioned that Fisheries Inspectors hit the Lachlan River near Hillston and got over 30 offences. The bulk being exceeding the bag limit.

The native fish in inland rivers in NSW will not accept being bashed like they are, and a number of us in Broken Hill have been saying for some time that the Darling River, in particular, should be declared closed waters for a year at least so as to alow the fish population to increase.

I've actually seen people come home from the river with heaps of fish & yabbies, that have eventually been thrown out cause you can't eat fish all the time.
AnswerID: 348307

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