Heavy Vibration in Nissan GU at 70-90 KM Front left

Submitted: Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 12:48
ThreadID: 68663 Views:10014 Replies:15 FollowUps:11
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Well this has had me guessing for a while now -- after the good advice about other methods of jacking up the Nissan - i have it sitting on Rated safety stands in the vacant block next door ( front wheels elevated of the ground )

NOW - symptom - between about 70 - 85 KMh i get a very Violent steering shake and it feels like the Left tire is jumping around and leaving the road - if i had to describe the feeling - it would be like running over about 20 speed humps at speed in one hit (BIG ONES)

Tyres are balanced - i have even swapped rear to front and vice versa - same effect - ( when tires from front are on rear - they run smooth as) when i get to about 95 + heavy vibration goes away

It has been getting progressively worse , and it is scalloping the left front tire only ( right is fine)

I have it elevated - and can not feel any movement or free play at all - turn the wheels FULL lock each way - test for slack left and right --- and pull on tires for bearing preload.. there is no movement at all!

clearly something is going on ..... can you guys suggest anything ? maybe i need to pull the left hub apart and see if something inside is causing this movement ?

any help appreciated

Boc
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Reply By: Outbackogre - Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 12:59

Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 12:59
Boc, I'm not sure that this would account for all of your symptoms, but I had front end vibrations at that speed (especially on a slight bend) on a Jackaroo some years ago and it turned out to be shot front wheel bearings. Hope you find the problem. Cheers. Rob.
AnswerID: 363992

Follow Up By: Ozboc - Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 13:23

Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 13:23
Gday Rod and thanks for your reply

bearings was the first thing i checked when it first surfaced - i pulled them out - re packed them after i inspected them ( no pitting or damage) reinstalled and added preload

same problem

Boc
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FollowupID: 631671

Reply By: Willem - Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 13:21

Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 13:21
Boc

Something amiss with your 'tire'.

Try fitting a new tyre to the rim and see how you go. Or fit the spare and see how it reacts. If the spare is OK then it is your LF tyre.
If the spare plays up then it is a suspension problem. Check if your tierod arm or draglink is bent slightly.
AnswerID: 363993

Follow Up By: Ozboc - Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 13:26

Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 13:26
HI there - i have already moved tires from other corners of the car with the same effect . I am thinking of getting new tires , maybe geolanders as that's what was on the car i bought it and this prob really didn't surface until a few weeks after the new tires

everything looks straight no obvious bends or Hits that could have caused a Bend -- will have a closer look though

thanks for your input

Boc
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FollowupID: 631672

Reply By: Travelling Pixie - Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 13:23

Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 13:23
check if the tyres have run-out

they can still be balanced but be out-of-round
AnswerID: 363994

Reply By: P7OFFROAD Accredited Driver Training - Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 13:24

Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 13:24
we recently chased a wobble in our GU for a couple of months (though I don;t think it was as bad as yours sounds).

After initially ruling out the panhard rods, and bushes (which are the obvious) we found that the 'new' mechanic was obviously on drugs, or a loony (either way, now looking for another job, apparently) because the vibration was, in fact, the panhard. In our case it was just a tiny bit loose, cinched up, and no more wobble...



(we also replaced the steering dampner because it was due anyway)

cheers

Dave
AnswerID: 363995

Reply By: TTD - Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 13:50

Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 13:50
Ozboc
Had the same problem with my 2004Gu and after going through all the usual issues solved the problem by taking the vehicle to a serious tyre place that had the correct stud pattern mandrill for the GU alloy rims. They took the time to centre the tyre rim on the drum correctly and the problem went away. In going through the exercise I also found out that there is no tie rod end adjustment on the Patrol only shims
TTD
AnswerID: 364000

Reply By: KiwiAngler - Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 14:32

Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 14:32
I would take a hard look at your shock absorber on that side - scalloping is often a sign of crook shocks
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AnswerID: 364007

Follow Up By: KiwiAngler - Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 16:38

Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 16:38
If you go to this website and scroll down - it refers to faulty shocks and what I call 'scalloping'


Is this scalloping?
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Follow Up By: KiwiAngler - Sunday, May 10, 2009 at 13:46

Sunday, May 10, 2009 at 13:46
Does the scalloping of the tyres that you refer to look like the pictures on the website I posted?
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Reply By: Nutta - Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 16:17

Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 16:17
I'm no expert but i'd say a crook shock too, good luck.
AnswerID: 364021

Reply By: Member - Tour Boy ( Bundy QLD) - Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 16:30

Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 16:30
Scalloping can also be caused by a worn steering damper. Pull one end off and see if it moves in and out slightly really easily (5mm or so)
The damper may still work fine but this small amount of freeplay will cause scalloping.
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AnswerID: 364023

Follow Up By: Ozboc - Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 18:09

Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 18:09
I shall climb under tomorrow and take a look at that --- it has not been replaced since i have owned the car - does not have the original , but i also don't know its age

Thanks for your input :)

Boc

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FollowupID: 631723

Reply By: Malleerv - Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 17:31

Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 17:31
Check the pan hard rod or track rod especially were it mounts up on the chassis. Sometimes they come loose or the rubber is slightly worn/degraded and allows the axle to move sightly across the vehicle. Also degraded trailing arm bushes can give this symptom.

I had a GQ patrol/Maverick early model and would always get a slight wobble at 80kmh. As the tyres wore it would get worse. I used this vehicle off road lots and very rough off road work too. one day I was driving down the road got to 80km and the vehicle started to shake violently to the point I had to brake or I would end up in the bush. I jumped out and had a look thinking the wheels had come loose or wheel brg let go but nothing was loose that I could see.
I took off again and same thing happened but this time I had not got to 60kmh. I stopped and stuck my head out the window at the same time moving the steering wheel about half a turn. To my surprise the body of the truck would move about 4 inches across the axle. When I check the pan hard rod it had broken the mount off the chassis. Not easy to spot or fix but I got the local engineer to weld and brace it back on. After it was fixed it was as good as new. Maybe the bracket was flexing and allowing the rod to move.

Hope this helps
Matt
AnswerID: 364030

Follow Up By: Ozboc - Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 18:10

Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 18:10
After i check the Steering dampener i might get the misses to take it for a run and i will ride next to her on my roadbike and have a good look to see what happens at that speed and if what you mention comes to play ... thanks

Boc
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FollowupID: 631724

Reply By: Old Johno [NSW] - Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 18:01

Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 18:01
Ozboc, we had a bit of vibration in our 2004 GU, went to a 4WD wheel alignment specialist and had the left hand side camber readjusted. They did this by putting an adjustable king pin in. They told me that these vehicles where designed for Right hand roads and that the left hand camber was incorrect for oz.
It seemed to fix the problem but as others have said balance can cause it & uneven brake discs can also be part of the problem.
AnswerID: 364035

Reply By: Dave... Adelaide (SA) - Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 19:13

Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 19:13
G'day Oz

My son has just gone through the same prob on his GU, the problem was the swivel hub bearings, im not saying this is definitely the prob with yours, but the easiest way to find out is to elevate the front of your car and remove the tie rod end on the side the problem is coming from, you should now be able to move the wheel freely from left to right, if you feel any binding whilst slowly moving the wheel from left to right it is a good indication that the swivel hub bearings are shot.
Hope this helps you out, if you need any more info let me know and i will give you my phone No...
AnswerID: 364047

Follow Up By: Ozboc - Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 19:26

Saturday, May 09, 2009 at 19:26
Greetings Dave - i lifted the horse of the ground today and tried that one - i was thinking along the same lines - no signs of oil leaks - no movement at all -- and all moving without any Binding at all

You know it may well be tires .... I had to get a new Front tire for my Road bike the other week - It was a very well known brand and about $350 --- new tire fitted -- took the bike for a run ... get to 70 - 80 Kmh -- bad shake - took it back the following day -- they done another balance -- took it back out --- same again -- get to about 70 -80 bad shake - if i took pressure off the handle bars you could see it wanting to go into a tank slap ( handle bars violently shaking left to right) -

took it back a third time -- guy claims must be bad bearing in my wheel -- and every other excuse under the sun -- i inform him that with the old tire it was dead Calm from 0 Kmh - right up to about 260 Kmh ( im too chicken to go faster on track days) - Spoke to the owner of the company - he told me to come in and he will have his Head mechanic look at it (The same guy that looks after his race bikes) he took it for a blast - - said it was terrible -- he will put a new tire on it ... 50 min later comes back -- says new tire is on ... he took for a test run already Perfect ..... i went home --- got up to freeway speed - dead smooth all the way through ...

This was a brand new tire that rated to over 300 KMH and buggered from the start BUT looked perfect - but could not be balanced .....

Maybe not my prob - but i hope it is ,.... just need to eliminate everything else

Boc
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FollowupID: 631741

Reply By: Mrbrush - Sunday, May 10, 2009 at 08:12

Sunday, May 10, 2009 at 08:12
Just a thought, Is your front left hub locked in unkowingly.
AnswerID: 364114

Follow Up By: Ozboc - Sunday, May 10, 2009 at 08:16

Sunday, May 10, 2009 at 08:16
Very good question , something that i had already looked at -- I have auto hubs and never lock them in

could it be possible that maybe the auto lock has not disengaged ?

any way to check ?

Boc
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FollowupID: 631793

Follow Up By: Horacehighroller - Sunday, May 10, 2009 at 11:54

Sunday, May 10, 2009 at 11:54
Hi Ozboc.

Manually lock the other hub and try turning the driveshaft?? ---(assumes the diff is NOT LSD.)


That being said I'm still unclear as to wether you have tried other wheel/tyres on that side.
You seem to indicate that you have, but then you still suggest it might be the "tyres".
If it's the same with other wheel/tyres then it most likely NOT the wheel/tyre.

Peter
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FollowupID: 631820

Follow Up By: Ozboc - Sunday, May 10, 2009 at 13:35

Sunday, May 10, 2009 at 13:35
HI peter - I have rotated tires around the car -- ie back to front -- same result after tire change on same side - prob does not follow the tire that was a prob - the prob stays on front left even when tires are changed

Boc
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FollowupID: 631838

Reply By: kiwicol - Monday, May 11, 2009 at 07:01

Monday, May 11, 2009 at 07:01
I also reckon shocky on that wheel could be shot. Col
AnswerID: 364240

Reply By: Ozboc - Monday, May 11, 2009 at 07:12

Monday, May 11, 2009 at 07:12
Greetings to everyone that has replied , thanks so Far !!

I am curious as to why it would be the shock Absorber - and why it would only happen at 80 KMH - would this not show its ugly head at all speeds???

I may just swap right to left today ( front shock absorbers) and see what the results are ....


Boc
AnswerID: 364242

Follow Up By: Ozboc - Monday, May 11, 2009 at 11:40

Monday, May 11, 2009 at 11:40
Ok , i have the front of the Car in pieces

this is what i have found so far ---

Pulled both shocks off --- both very solid and working equal to each other push in with some force - requires a lot of force to pull back out -- if left alone will open up VERY slowly - not able to make any sudden movements with the shocks ( or any free play)

Removed the stabilizer bar -- found the MOunting rubbers Buggered --- going to replace these --- could this be the cause ?????

Removed Radius arm ( left side ) caster bearings- holes are way off centre - looks to be maybe internal damage - but once again no free movement ( look at Photo)

tie rods - pan rods -- no free movement - feel very solid and move with NO freeplay



If you want to see more photos in very high def ( about 2 MB each pic showing very clearly - follow this link then choose an image

You comments - wlii these things cause my problems >?

High res photos of steering issues

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FollowupID: 631961

Reply By: Member - Geoff C (QLD) - Monday, May 11, 2009 at 21:28

Monday, May 11, 2009 at 21:28
Went through the same thing recently, changed shocks, had wheel bearings checked/repacked/adjusted, rotating the wheels varied the vibration but did not stop it. I had on wheel balances done, little change. Eventually I gave up and put a set of new wheels/tyres on and no longer have a problem. The original wheels were split rims with Roadgripper F's and the new ones are Nissan Patrol steel rims off a wagon (second hand). I have previously wrecked a split rim so can only assume I had more than one damaged wheel so that rotating them I always had at least one crook one on. Have done about 2000km since.
Geoff
AnswerID: 364389

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