OT-Going for the SEA CHANGE - need advice on selling house ...

Submitted: Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 08:40
ThreadID: 69603 Views:2264 Replies:15 FollowUps:14
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Greetings and sorry for the OT - i thought i would post here as many of you would have done the same and need some advice.

We are selling up in Sydney and moving down south ( not far from vic boarder) All this week i have been flat out repainting the house - organizing new carpets , blinds and so forth to make the house look brand new again ( house is 8 years old )

NOW the financial controller and myself have not had to sell a house before , so not sure what the pro's and cons are and costs that may be associated ... Have you guys been able to Negotiate house sales commissions with the large real estate guys or is it pretty much they say x% is the fee - no negotiation - also is it possible to advertise with 2 agents rather an exclusively with one >? ( as long as the individual contract does not sale exclusive rights )

any other advice to help this along as we have spotted our dream house already and want to get this all going ASAP before someone else buys it!!

thanks

Boc
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Reply By: wild dog - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 09:17

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 09:17
Why not put your own for sale sign out the front?????????
You can save a bit on commission and you can offer a buyer a better deal.

We,ve sold 2 properties like this and it's a very satisifying feeling to know that you haven't paid some agent $2000 per minute to sell your house.

Just remember one important rule in buying and selling real estate:- The agent is working for himself, not you, not the buyer, but himself first last and always.

If you're new to buying and selling real estate make sure you ask a lot of questions about the new property.

And don't believe ONE WORD an agent tells you about the " dream home ",
most of them would sell their own grandmother
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Follow Up By: Ozboc - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 10:39

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 10:39
Thanks for your replies wild dog - can i get your email address by any chance as i have some other questions that's probably better off in email

such as - did you advertise on Domain.com.au -- i looked there and they want $500 for 28 days of listing ???

can you email me on Boc1971@hotmail.com if you don't want to have your email published here

thanks

Boc
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Reply By: hiluxcab - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 10:17

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 10:17
ozboc there is some web sites that you can listed your home on to sell
one is owner but if you google you will find more.
do not buy your dream home until you have sold your home
unless less you are in a financial position to do so.
cheers craig
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Follow Up By: Ozboc - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 10:44

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 10:44
Hi Hilux - yeah that's why we want to sell quickly - and price will be accordingly - we didn't want to get a bridging loan , so its really going to be a hit and miss.

once we have a genuine offer we will then put in our offers at the other property

Boc


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Reply By: Member - DW (NSW) - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 10:34

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 10:34
Hi Boc
Have a look at this site as it may help you. http://www.jenman.com.au/

I have no connection to that site whatsoever but have read several of his publications which are very interesting.

Good luck
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Follow Up By: Ozboc - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 10:41

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 10:41
Thanks DW - will have a good read ......
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Reply By: Gazal Champion - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 10:45

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 10:45
Hi Ozboc, congratulations on a good decision. We did the tree change 25 years ago and have never regretted it.

I always reckon that agents are working more for the buyer than the seller as they do not get paid until the buyer parts with the money and they seem to do more to appease the buyer than the seller. But ultimately I suppose it is just as stated that they are really working for themselves.

Selling yourself seems like a good idea. Put an add in the local papers and look into putting it on ebay or some such other site. You may be surprised at the outcome.

Regards, Bruce.
At home and at ease on a track that I know not and
restless and lost on a track that I know. HL.

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AnswerID: 368915

Reply By: SPRINT-GTO - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 11:10

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 11:10
Whatever you do if you go through an agent under no circumstances tell the agent you have your eye on the other property. They will use this against you in a form of emotional blackmail in order to try to get you to accept a lesser price and they make a quick sale!!!
Just tell them your selling up ---you dont have to justify your actions to them!!
Similiarly when you negotiate an agents fee confirm if it includes GST and not plus GST.
a good rate would be 1.75% INCLUDING GST
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Follow Up By: Member - Mike DID - Tuesday, Jun 09, 2009 at 19:10

Tuesday, Jun 09, 2009 at 19:10
I thought it was illegal to advertise a price that didn't include GST.
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Reply By: Member - daz (SA) - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 11:17

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 11:17
Its great is it not.

Bag the agent, bag the accountant, bag the lawyer, bag the plumber, bag the electrician, bag the mechanic, bag anyone who works as a professional in any job that you do not do. Lets all become a do it yourself mob.

Never support a trained licenced professional dong his job. You get those qualifications out of a weetbix packet. Lets all get a job with the government & then winge about them.

Sell real estate yourself & make one blue by saying the wrong thing, & you will need to be a lawyer with plenty of money to defend yourself.

Make sure you have a couple of million dollars professional liability otherwise you can loose everything.

& what is the name of the Victorian boarder (border)
Daz
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Follow Up By: get outmore - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 12:49

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 12:49
well considering my agent pressed me to take the first offer even before the home open and it was feature house in the local rag - then yea there is a bit to beware of.

i held off and the extra i got paid for there fees and it still sold in about 2 weeks
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Follow Up By: George - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 14:12

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 14:12
Accountants and lawyers are qualified professionals and must hold relevant university degrees, while plumbers, electricians and mechanics need to complete 3 to 4 years apprenticeships. On the other hand real estate agents generally have no more than "Mickey Mouse" certificate of attendance from TAFE or similar, so the comparison is rather pointless.
Having said that, any reasonably successful real estate agent would probably have better selling skills than average punter. Also, the agent will take care of all the tedious tasks and formalities associated with the sale and in any case it is highly unlikely that you will end up with higher price if you decide to do it yourself.
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Follow Up By: Member - daz (SA) - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 14:38

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 14:38
May be a call to the relevant real estate institute in your state will enlighten as to the study required for a real estate SALES licence. A bit more study & time than attending a few evenings at TAFE in SA. To obtain a Real Estate AGENTS licence takes a fair bit of time & is EXPENSIVE. Most real estate people do not last in the industry, as it means long working hours, week ends given up, working with stressed vendors, who may be going through breakups or have to sell because of loss of income or a death, & unless you are in the top rung a pretty poor income. Negotiating with two parties who want different outcomes is always stressful.
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Follow Up By: George - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 18:17

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 18:17
This is from REISA:
Do I need formal qualifications to become a real estate salesperson?
Yes. You need to complete the Certificate IV in Property (Real Estate). This is the minimum educational requirement to sell real estate in South Australia. This requirement is set down by the Office of Consumer and Business Affairs.

You can complete the Certificate IV with REISA in three ways: full time (six weeks), part time (two nights a week for seven months), or as a traineeship (12 months).

How can anyone seriously compare six weeks training to a university degree course or a trade apprenticeship?
And yes, most real estate people do not last in the industry. Perhaps it may have something to do with the fact that the industry is prepared to take anyone?
Education, skills or experience generally not relevant.
Cheers
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Follow Up By: Member - daz (SA) - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 18:42

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 18:42
Further Education required as you go George.

Getting the license does not get you a sale.

Most starve as they can not get enough to sell & there employer can not continue to give them a retainer to produce no income for the business

My little gripe in this whole thread is that we seem to be a nation of knockers of those who are successful. The butcher is ripping off the lamb producer. The garage should not be charging $85 per hour.
Come on every one has the right to earn a living. 30 percent of those going in to there own small business fail in the first 12 months. & one reason is they do not realize there are hoards of costs in running any business.

Most of us do not appreciate that most self employed have to sell or starve & those who are a bit on the shady side soon get found out.
People grizzling about agents usually are dealing with a jonny come lately. The professional operators are just that. Professional.

Tell me that some one selling a 10 million dollar property can get all the no how out of a tafe course. That comes from experience & professionalism.

We want to buy everything as cheap as we can & sell every thing for as much as we can.


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Follow Up By: George - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 19:28

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 19:28
Daz, I said in my first FollowUp that:

“any reasonably successful real estate agent would probably have better selling skills than average punter. Also, the agent will take care of all the tedious tasks and formalities associated with the sale and in any case it is highly unlikely that you will end up with higher price if you decide to do it yourself.”

So my position is not that much different from yours and personally I wouldn’t bother to try to sell my house without an agent. I would however choose the agent carefully and I would happily pay for a professional valuation because the so called “free appraisals” spruiked by some keen to get the listing agents are worth exactly what you pay for it and often less… if you get my drift.
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Follow Up By: Member - daz (SA) - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 21:23

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 21:23
We are singing from the same hymn book there George.

I just find it annoying that people bag others doing a job. Tar everyone with the same brush

The fellow up the street from me is trying to sell his house privately.
What A joke, He is showing people through while the missus is cooking the lunch & his son has not made his bed. VERY PROFESSIONAL. Just makes you want to jump up & buy it.

The smartest real estate agent would have them out of the house, give it a make over, & probably get $20 K more than he wants.

An interesting part of this thread is the person who sold privately on the week end to the first looker when a good agent would have attempted to see if the other prospects were genuine & may have paid more. In real estate the more the vendor gets the more the agent gets. A low set selling fee offers the agent no incentive. In fact I know a seller once who offered the agent 10 percent of what he got over a certain figure as a bait for the agent to try harder. Then we would have the buyers grizzling because the agent was too aggressive. Most complaints in SA come from the buyer not the vendors.
We have all these funny rules at auction that it must all be transparent for the buyer.


I think we have flogged this enough A right of reply if you like but I have to be up at 4. 45 am

Two weeks to go & then off to the Flinders, Innamincka. Coongie Lakes & Birdsville. Three weeks of Bliss No computer, No Television, No Phone

Good Luck

Daz
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Follow Up By: Member - Mike DID - Tuesday, Jun 09, 2009 at 20:03

Tuesday, Jun 09, 2009 at 20:03
Interesting.

This site is full of advice on do-it-yourself modifications and repairs to vehicles.

NOT ONCE have I seen Tradespeople get on their high horse about doing paid people out of a job.

So why are Real Estate Agents so special ???
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Reply By: HappyCamper - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 12:05

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 12:05
G'day Boc

I would never list with an agent again after the last one really st*ffed up a genuine sale and lost me heaps of $$$'s which I looked on as a breach of contract so set about a DIY sale. It's not hard, just takes a bit of work and most of all 'very rewarding' in both $$$ terms and satisfaction, not only that the prospective purchaser gets 'correct' information from you, not someone who knows zilch about your house nor has any real interest in when/if it sells, nor not!

Take the time and type up a 'full' description of the house/garage/sheds/yard/etc (mine was 5 x A4 pages) and contained measurements of all rooms. Next I took heaps of photos and had several sets printed (pre-internet) to send to prospective buyers along with a copy of the description. Reference the photos to the room number in the description, might be a good idea to burn a CD or two, and also have some prints for non-computer purchasers.

Lastly, place an ad in Trading Post as it can now be read online as well as hard copy. Don't skimp on the ad contents as the extra $$$'s (in my case) were well spent...think the ad cost around $30 but would have changed by now. When people phoned and left their address I sent a set of photos and a copy of the description and funnily enough all (except the final purchaser) returned the photos..not that I asked for them to be returned and didn't really expect it to happen. In the end there were three people 'very' interested and the first lady to make the trip from Sydney bought it then and there, even though her husband hadn't yet had an inspection. The other two had planned to make the trip the next weekend...unfortunately it was too late for them.

Hope this helps?
Bronwyn ;-)



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Reply By: Member - Rodney B- Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 12:19

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 12:19
If the so called professionals acted like professionals then we would be happy to use them but, too many of us we have been ripped of by them as they serve their own interests and not their customers. Unfortunately it is generally too late when you realise you have been had. I agree with Daz though, be careful what you say and promise, be truthful and you will stay out of legal trouble. Use a good conveyancer to finalise your deal.
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Reply By: tim_c - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 12:47

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 12:47
I think most Real Estate agents would not let you list it with other agents at the same time - and you'll probably still have to pay advertising costs whether they sell it or not (so one 'set' of costs would be for no real benefit). If your property is listed on a well-known website (would be allhomes in ACT/SE NSW) then it will have all the exposure you should need.

As for the question of whether to sell it yourself or use an agent, it's similar to whether you sell your old car yourself or trade it in to a dealer. Perhaps you'll get a few more thousand bucks if you sell it yourself but you'll have to field the calls, conduct the inspections/open-houses, draft the sales contract, do the negotiating etc. etc. Yes, you pay a lot to a real estate agent (you'll be one of the people helping them to pay off that BMW they so often show up in!) but they do actually do something to earn at least some of what you pay them! You'll have to decide for yourself if you think their charges are "value for money" or if you can do it better yourself.

If you decide to use an agent, make sure you talk to a few of them as their rates vary, as does what is included in those rates - and be specific (ie. if they say "advertising" does that just mean a sign out the front, or a short description in the weekend paper, or does it include an internet ad as well?). Ask lots of questions and get some "all up" rates that include everything (some will hit you for extra costs for different advertising options, contracts, professional photos etc.). As with anything, when choosing an agent to sell your home, it pays to shop around!
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Follow Up By: Member - daz (SA) - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 14:15

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 14:15
one thing for sure the cheapest is not always the best.

Used a cheap plumber ONCE. now that was an experience Think he was self taught. Knew all the shortcuts

Most who offer the cheapest service stuff up the industry

How easy is it to spot a cheap wig, or a cheap suit. Shiny ars... in a couple of weeks.
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Reply By: get outmore - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 12:53

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 12:53
definitly negotate their fees - if they wont neg then theres aways the guy accross the road . i think i got 5% without a hassell from memory
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Reply By: Ozboc - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 13:37

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 13:37
Thanks to all for the excellent advice - I think i will Give the Private sale a go, Getting all new Carpet put in tomorrow upstairs and i should finish the painting by tonight ( just have touch ups to do now )

Have a digital SLR so will take HEAPS of photo's of the house - inside and out - also will include google earth photo

I may even do a walk through with the video camera and burn to disk( and photos set out in powerpoint format) for those who may want something posted out to them

Once again - thanks for some excellent advice and i knew this would be the best place for this question

will keep you posted if it sells

Boc
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Reply By: Member - Matt & Caz H (QLD) - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 15:27

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 15:27
Hi BOC

We have just gone through this (we sold November 08) it can be heart breaking - so many "lookers" through the house and 5 open houses (eeekkk!!!) we made the BIG mistake of signing exclusively with one agent (in the end we begged them to let us out of this and to their credit they did).

Fees's not 100% (I would rather forget how much we paid them.....) however I think it was $1800 of the first $5,000 then 2.5% of the balance (this is in QLD not sure about NSW).

So $355,000 sale price you are looking at a fee of $10,550.00 however I do believe there are companies around that do a fixed rate of approx $5,000 GECKO is one that comes to mind.

Can you make an offer on the other home? just be sure to put in the contract "Subject to sale of your home" not 100% sure on this either check with a professional first.

I too recommend looking at the JENMAN website as someone else has suggested. Good luck
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Reply By: Member - Graham H (QLD) - Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 19:43

Monday, Jun 08, 2009 at 19:43
I recently sold on Bribie Island and had an joint exclusive with 2 agents The selling one to get 100% commision.

Cost $20,000 roughly in fees for an over $700.000 house Lawyers were another $1,000.
My advice is ask local sellers how the agent is Surely you have been there long enough to see who is selling houses and who isnt. Is an indication of their ability.
Research your dream thoroughly or it may turn out to be a nightmare.

You can put an offer i n subject to the sale of your home within a set time.
However the seller can also put a clause in that may give you 72 hours to confirm if they get a cash buyer.
Called a sunset clause in Qld
have fun

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Reply By: GLX3000 - Tuesday, Jun 09, 2009 at 12:31

Tuesday, Jun 09, 2009 at 12:31
G'day Ozboc,

We sold our home in February 2007, after getting several "valuations" from real estate agents. One guy said we should accept $580k but in the deteriorating market, realistically we probably we would end up with $560k after fees etc.

We got our sign wording cut and made up our own signs.

3 weeks later the place was sold for $618k with no-one to pays. No agents creaming it.

If you would like to know the nitty gritty of how we did it, ping me.

Peter
AnswerID: 369097

Reply By: GLX3000 - Tuesday, Jun 09, 2009 at 12:38

Tuesday, Jun 09, 2009 at 12:38
G'day Ozboc,

We sold our home privately in February 2007, after getting several "valuations" from real estate agents. One guy said we should accept $580k but in the deteriorating market, realistically we probably would end up with $560k after fees etc.

We got our sign wording cut and made up our own signs.

3 weeks later the place was sold for $618k with no-one to pays. No agents creaming it.

If you would like to know the nitty gritty of how we did it, feel free to ping me.

Peter
AnswerID: 369099

Follow Up By: Ozboc - Wednesday, Jun 10, 2009 at 15:43

Wednesday, Jun 10, 2009 at 15:43
Gday Pete , would really like to chat a bit more if you get time -- either email me or add me ON MSN Boc1971@hotmail.com
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