LPG conversions vs other options for first 4wd

I had a 92 model (NH) as my last car. Took us on lots of good trips and towed my camper trailer with no problems. In your price range it would be hard to do better IMO.

The 3lt petrol is a good honest and reliable engine. The manual tranny on these can suffer from dodgy synchros and 5th gear was suspect on some but most would have been fixed by now. Plenty of room, lots of accessories available, spares are pretty easy to come by as there's lots of them around, relatively easy to work on...

I'd definitely choose the Paj before the Zuk..

I am NOT biased... (much)

I had a 92 model (NH) as my last car. Took us on lots of good trips and towed my camper trailer with no problems. In your price range it would be hard to do better IMO.

The 3lt petrol is a good honest and reliable engine. The manual tranny on these can suffer from dodgy synchros and 5th gear was suspect on some but most would have been fixed by now. Plenty of room, lots of accessories available, spares are pretty easy to come by as there's lots of them around, relatively easy to work on...

I'd definitely choose the Paj before the Zuk..

I am NOT biased... (much)

Gavo,
I am quite happy with my 96.
Had it since new, now has 335,000k.
Was looking at trading it in a couple of years ago and after looking at the market and what we do, decided to stay with it. It is mainly used around SE Qld and for the trips away in Oz.
The 93s are getting a bit long in the tooth now, and if you can find a low milage you might be OK. The prado of the same age (series 90 is maybe a bit younger) is similar, but of course, more money.
I would look at any pajero of that gen 2 shape, which is up to 1999 (NL).

If you want more info, go the Victorian Mitsubishi club forum.

Pajero club forum

As usual maintenance on them is important, and usual checks apply.

Know some who started in pajeros, and some have stayed with them and others have gone for something stronger off road like a patrol to suit their ventures.

In this price range Gav condition of the indivual vehicle is more importent then brand.Good low k NH s still bring $7k plus. We sold our 93 NH with 98000ks(would you believe) for $7400 in Feb this year.IT woulds have done anothjer 100000ks before needing any major repairs.Where are you?
I have seen a few good ones on car sales.
Their is also a plain looking but low k 95 Jack at cowra listed on Country cars
My first 4by was a lj80 Suz. Had heaps of fun with that vehicle, but no long distance stuff and just a few days atr a time.The Suzs are a bit dodgy in the safty aspect.
Anyway good luck Pete

Hi guys, thanks for the reply.

I actually forgot part of my post... I should have mentioned that in place of the Sierra, I am still on the lookout for a good-nick Vitara or even better, a Feroza (I know parts are harder to come by but for the price, safety etc, they seem probably a happy medium for a mostly-city car)...

What John C said really struck a chord... the 93s are really getting a bit old now I would think.. I actually mentioned that I sold my 98 Magna earlier in the year and now am looking at something substantially older with much higher kms...

Pete: Im in the South Western suburbs of Melbourne. I am heading to the Fowles pre-inspection auctions today but they have nothing in the way of smallies (cept a soft-top high kms, old Vitara). They do have a number of Pajeros ( http://www.manheimfowles.com.au/find_buy/power_search/index.mpl?unit_key=93149_AU102665117-93149;detail_tab=vinfo;fulltext=pajero;include_salvage=;salvage_only=;model=;state=Victoria;model_all=1;rm=view_detail, http://www.manheimfowles.com.au/find_buy/power_search/index.mpl?unit_key=93149_AU102670125-93149;detail_tab=vinfo;fulltext=pajero;include_salvage=;salvage_only=;model=;state=Victoria;model_all=1;rm=view_detail, http://www.manheimfowles.com.au/find_buy/power_search/index.mpl?unit_key=93149_AU102669689-93149;detail_tab=vinfo;fulltext=pajero;include_salvage=;salvage_only=;model=;state=Victoria;model_all=1;rm=view_detail, http://www.manheimfowles.com.au/find_buy/power_search/index.mpl?unit_key=93149_AU102673780-93149;detail_tab=vinfo;fulltext=pajero;include_salvage=;salvage_only=;model=;state=Victoria;model_all=1;rm=view_detail, http://www.manheimfowles.com.au/find_buy/power_search/index.mpl?unit_key=93149_AU102670079-93149;detail_tab=vinfo;fulltext=pajero;include_salvage=;salvage_only=;model=;state=Victoria;model_all=1;rm=view_detail ) that are going to be in the price range, but with the exception of the first link there, they seem to have very high kms... but 1 is an auto (not a big fan and hear theyre worse on fuel) AND doesnt seem to have reg...

So anyway I guess it boils down to "do I need a truck like this"... Now I know people say that the Paj is a whole-other class of vehicle to a Feroza or a Vitara (and most certainly to a Sierra!), but I have to ask myself if I really need something this big...

I can justify it if I can keep the costs down. The running costs are not stupidly, outrageously higher if the fuel consumption isnt through the roof, but the best I think I can expect on a 3L is 10L/100km and thats highway.. I expect more stop/starting in the city/... now Id be interested to know what people think about LPG fittings to it? Consumption of LPG would obviously be higher but I was hoping to draw on any experience anyone might have with them in this particular vehicle. What bothers me with LPG besides the back-firing component, is that it uses so much more and people are getting limited range on it, even as little as 200km per 90L tank... plus a smaller petrol auxillary that severly reduces the range of the big truck making it a bit of a silly thing: get a big truck to be able to do the occasional trip in the outback, but have such high running costs that fit LPG to it, which impacts its ability to work in the outback due to limited range)...

To sum it up, Id love a Paj, but probably dont need something that big because I dont have bucket-loads of money and wont be going on any big trips for a while at least. I do like to know that I can go on a bigger trip if I want too, but it seems a little silly to have something so large for a big trip I might not ever take, if the fuel costs are exceptionally high.

Having said that, I am reading on the Pajero forum (thanks for the link) that people are finding anywhere from 10/11L ((best case scenario)) to a more common 14/15L even up to 17L per 100km and that is just ridiculous to me... I am really worried that I get something like this and end up spending so much in fuel), not to mention the environmental impact which is acceptable IF I was using it all the time...

I am planning on joining the local 4wd club and getting away whenever we can but that might be limited because we are currently both looking for work and when we get it, its going to be more-work-than-play kind of thing.

Anyway let me know what ya's think, and if the consensus is to fit LPG to it.

Im off to the auctions now to have a look, and Ill make some private enquiries.

Oh and regarding the comment that its more importnat to find something in the right condition for its age rather than model, I agree completely. But the Pajeros price is consistently lower than a Prado or Patrol, Ive been looking at that.

I did find a great-looking Japanese import 89 SWB Pajero with a 2.5TD in it but the bloke said the engine isnt what came in it and it had to be reasonably modified to accomodate it... that worries me in case of working on it, I have to call him and chat to him a bit more about it.

H again Gavo,

You must have decided against that Rocky? It's good that you're considering a wide range of alternatives but just a few points to help you along...

If you are looking at longer trips (particularly if planning to head Outback), I'd recommend something bigger than Feroza/Sierra/Vitara. My first car was a Suzuki LJ80v (predecessor to the Sierra) and we managed camping trips up to one week but it was cosy, and it was quite an art to pack everything inside (like a 3D kigsaw puzzle)!

I'd also recommend against a grey-import... These can be difficult to get parts for since some of the parts aren't supported by local dealers & sometimes you have to import things as needed. A colleague of my brother had no wheels for a few weeks because he was waiting for delivery of an oil pressure switch! The difficultly of sourcing parts also drives insurance premiums up.

You have noticed that the Paj is significantly cheaper than say the Prado of similar vintage, mileage, condition, etc. Sometimes it is because of reputation, what the market wants, and the level of discounting & availability of new equivalents. From some personal experience: I wanted a Prado but ended up getting a Jackaroo since they were around $5-10k cheaper for the equivalent (ie. $15k instead of $20-25k). Was the Prado a better car? Probably, but definitely not nearly twice as good! Hardly anyone wanted a Jackaroo new (perhaps because Holden never bothered to market them seriously) and therefore not too many people wanted them 2nd hand either - this drove the 2nd hand prices down quicker than the Prados. Personally, I wouldn't buy a Pajero because I've heard Mitsubishi has a shady reputation on transmissions but I think this was mostly the early Magnas, I don't know if Paj's were affected or to what extent - it's possible that this also could affect the resale values (ie. making them cheaper for you to buy now!). I trust you were happy with your Magna? Many people have Pajeros and swear by them and wouldn't consider anything else for their next upgrade (which says something). I also understand that the ground clearance & wheel articulation isn't as good as some of the others, but people still seem to get them into some fairly rugged places!

My Jackaroo also had high mileage when I bought it (~225,000km) but I never had an significant repairs to it (sold it with ~395,000km). If you find a vehicle that has high mileage but has been well looked after ie. is in excellent condition inside & out, has been regularly serviced properly, etc. it might still be worthwhile but cheaper because all the other potential buyers are scared off by the high mileage.

Many Pajeros (like many of any sort of 4WD) never see a dirt road, let alone a desert track or rocky fire trail so there should be many that have had a fairly easy life. I've also observed that a lot of (not all) Pajero owners are VERY car proud so it shouldn't be too hard to find one that's been looked after.

Research the used car values on redbook.com.au and drive.com.au so you know you're paying the right amount.

Umm - maybe it's just me - but did you mean to ask a question about LPG conversions for a first 4WD maybe and forgot?

I just figured that from the heading was all.

Cheers

I think the pajero's are under rated. Most will have been used for shopping trolleys like the prados, (myn was).. The 3 litre is a great motor although can get a bit smokey and rattley if they havn't been looked after and done a few klms. Rear main leaks are common when they have done a few klms (like the prado's) and as mentioned above the manual gearbox's if they have thrashed syncro's will be starting to show signs of needing an overhaul.. You would be surprised the fuel diference between auto and manual are virtually the same. The manual will be sitting on around 3300, 3400, rpm at 110k the auto about 2600 in O/D. If  going LPG it will cost around the $3300 mark as they dump the main fuel tank in the rear and put LPG in its place, they then add roughly a 45L petrol tank enough to start up on and few more Ltrs to get you out of trouble if the LPG's getting a bit low. Heap of extra's available, diff locks, etc. Up to the 99 models had good ground clearance as well.. Dont be fooled by the suzuki's economy. Best I got out of the vitara 92 model 5 speed manual was 10L per 100, the 01 model we had was 9 L per 100. I love the sukz, but neither of them suited OUR needs, too smaller area for luggage, fuel tank to small (no after market tank available) and ok for towing on the road but too under powered to tow when off road. Like any short wheel base they have advantages and disadvantages. Personally I would go the pajero over the suk for what you have described and if intending to do a lot of off roading away from towns I would forget the LPG. Also with the LPG as of July you will only get $1000 back instead of 2 when converting any used vehicle to LPG.......Regards Steve

Just looking at those pajero fuel figures in the above posts made me happy ... really, really, happy ... LOL

Same figures and WORSE - than what my vehicle gets ......

You might remember my vehicle from your last thread ... one of those environmentally unfriendly, gas guzzling, dirty american Jeeps ... as many are so quick to describe them ... LOL

If you are stepping up in size ... you might want to have a look at private sale prices on a petrol XJ cherokee ... some will also have gas fitted ... many will have low mileage and all are well appointed with creature comforts compared to same age jap wagons. You missed a bargain in Sydney recently - bought by someone in N.Q.

They also drive a lot better than early jap wagons ... and certainly a lot better than 4wd tradey vehicles. Sizewise they compare well with forerunners/jackeroos/pajeros and early prados ... they just have a lot more "oomph" when it comes down to towing ability / downlow grunt.

You can even drive them in 4wd on the bitumen for better traction when towing etc .... something the jap stuff only learnt to do fairly recently by comparison.

I would suggest LPG as a nescessity for round town given your concerns on consumption of fuel.

Be warned tho ... If you buy one ... you will be ridiculed forever by the mitsiwutoyssan brigade ... Jealousy at its worst ... LOL

Have a good look at the jackeroos too ... they have always been a bit of a dark horse and would be my preference compared to the others.

Gday guys,

Thanks for all your help with everything!

Anyway, in the end, I got (what seems like) a good deal on a 98 Mitsubishi Challenger.

It came up at the right price, bit under under 200,000K. Got it from auction so wasnt able to take it for a test drive (a gamble, I know)... anyway brought it back today, noticed a few issues with it already but overall seems good.

Im a bit worried about the gearbox and the transfer case/notification system... Gearbox is my biggest concern at the moment.

Ill let you know when I know more!

Anyway I chose the Challenger because it was the right price, its a 98, apparently theyre pretty good on fuel when theyre tuned up properly and theyre still reasonably capable (so I am told... I wouldnt know, shes my first!)...

Will post more updates soon!

Tell ya what though, cant wait to get her on the road, tuned up, and get into a 4wd club!

Cheers