Single vs Dual axle camper trailer

That's cutting things fine for "offroad". I had an offroad trailer that had a 2.5T axle to carry 1.25T.

Yep i think that the 2ton option would be best, a tandem would take more towing in heavy terrain like sand.
Surely judy doesnt need to take that much stuff !!!LOL

Cheers Pesty

Why not get Pesty to build it.

I heard Roachie had plenty of Dexion angle avaliable, he has time on his hands and they might be able to do a deal with Pesty.

Might be a start to a new career.

I'll be happy to build the trailer out of Dexion for Muddy and Judy; but NOT if Pesty is gunna be swingin' by all the time and giving me grief!!!

I have an impecible record of building stuff that doesn't fall apart during the 5 minute warranty period, so I don't understand why Muddy hasn't been in touch to let me know his specs and I'll get it built in a coupla-days; no worries cobba!!! hahahaha ;-)

Thats funny Drew, I am building it hahaha, but be assured there wont be a piece of dexion within 50 k of the place.
I might even invite Roachie over to see that there is a would without dexion.

Cheers Pesty

So you have not offered yet?

You could do it when you are on holidays.

Good idea, you could put Roachie on as work experience or you could see if you can get any assistance from the government for retraining him.

Pesty how is that MQ Patrol going, have you Cheved it yet.

Definitely a Dexion Free Zone as far as this job is concerned!!!!!!!!!!

Pesty will be a walk up start to be the main contractor on this job and if he chooses to offer some subby work to a semi-retired bank man then far be it for me to knock back the assistance. I am sure we will need someone to make the coffees and sweep the workshop floor!

I am still pretty keen on the dual axle given the weight penalty of starting with the 600kg camper box before anything else is added. The opinions of Ed C further down in the post sound valid in terms of better weight distribution and ride and more surface area on the ground to float the trailer over softer ground with appropriately reduced tyre pressures.

Gotta get this thing done before the camper rusts away in the shed!

Cheers
Muddy

Now THAT is what I call a TRAILER!!!! What a ripper.

What sort of weights are involved there Ed?.. (both overall and ball weight?).

I'll bet in tows really well too.

Sand etc would just require lowering all tyres appropriately of course and she'd float over the sand really well I'd imagine.

Of course, you do have ONE major asset that Muddy doesn't have: a stonking great 4.8 Patrol donk that would hardly let you know the trailer is even there (until you got out the plastic card at BP of course..... LOL)

Roachie

G'day Roachie,
so how's the retirement comin' along then? :)

In case ya hadn't noticed, there are actually 2 different trailers in there, the green one is MkI.. dry weight 1100kg, and a "guesstimated" loaded weight somewhere north of 1600kg (depending what "stuff" ya take;-)

We weren't totally happy with that one, mainly because the axles were too far back, resulting in excessive ball load.. OK on firm surfaces, but in the soft stuff it meant that I had to run higher (rear) tyre pressures than I would have liked. also made the front end lighter which meant that I wasn't getting optimum assistance from the front wheels.. a bit "hairy" under brakes too:(
even after re-locating the axles, it was never gunna be right...

So, I sat down with pencil & paper (& ruler), and re-designed the thing (loosely based on the original dimensions), the result being MkII (the goldy-coloured one;-)...

This one is much better balanced, only problem being, with 140 litres of water, + 140 lts of fuel under the belly, + a bigger battery bank, and more room for more um, "stuff", when fully loaded it tips the scales at, errm, do ya really wanna know?? .. OK, 2T ++ ;-) but that's loaded to the hilt, not hard to trim weight if/when necessary...
Ball weight when loaded is around 200kg which is in keeping with the ATM..
It tows ecxeptionally well on and off road (and in the dunes), and when behind the 4.8, if ya wanna pass a road-train, ya plants ya boot, and ya go! and the trailer, what trailer??? (we'll worry about the fuel bill later;-))..
actually, when driven sensibly (??) the 4.8 fuel consumption is not as bad as ya might think..

IMO, the big advantage with the dual axles is, as previously alluded to, is the fact that there is _less_ weight per wheel (and bearing) than on a single axle trailer, even those which are lighter.. This means that I can (and do) run those tyres down to 6psi in sand with minimal sidewall bulge.. Having most of the weight on the trailer (and less in the vehicle) means that the vehicle tyres can be run lower also, which means that, despite the weight, it handles sand very well indeed..
One of the few downsides is that the tandem does not like tight turns in soft sand, but one soon learns to compensate;-)

All-in-all, I reckon the advantages of the dual axle set-up far outweigh the disadvantages (which are few)

Catch ya later,
Ed C

Ed, that is exactly the sort of info I am looking for from someone who has a heavyish dual axle. I am wanting to achieve that same effect of having more rubber on the ground to distribute the weight.

I am looking to set this up to do long distance/duration trips on rough roads/moderate off-road so carrying capacity is important.

I know your vehicle is a bit more powerful which will be a factor but the Prado still does OK. I do already have an on-road 8x5 tandem trailer and have towed that with 2 tonne in it (for a gross of 2400kg) and it goes fine.

I don't intend doing a heck of a lot of sand work with it, its' mainly tracks that might not have seen a grader in a long time with washouts and corrugations. I want something tough enough to cope with those conditions, big enough to carry everything we need (and keep stuff out of the car).

Thanks for your thoughts.

Cheers
Muddy

You have answered part of the question right there. If you stay away from heavy slow sand driving you should be right.

Dual axle trailers aren't really a problem in sand until you get stuck. Then your more stuck than you think. Turning takes more effort because you are dragging tyres sideways, and backing up in tight situations will send the most patient person bonkas. trust me :)

Turning the trailer by hand becomes impossible.

When I need to push my dual axle trailer I wind the jockey wheel down as far as it will go and this brings the back wheels up which helps heaps.

When I had a dual axle 8x5 trailer it was very difficult to turn by hand.

It is worth noting there are (at least) 2 different ways that leaf sprung duals are set up. If you have one that has 2 sets of leafs totally independant of one another (ie: they are fixed at one end to the chassis and have a shackle at the other), then they are fairly easy to jockey-around on hard surfaces simply by winding the jockey wheel right down, which lifts the back wheel set off the ground.

However, in the case of my trailer, there was an equalising bar between the 2 sets of axles. This was a steel "joiner" about 8" long which held the shackles for both sets of wheels. I can't recall whether the front and rear of the springs were shackled or pivoted directly off the chassis....but I'm almost sure it was the latter.

In any case, the result was that the wheels stayed on the ground, no matter how low the jockey wheel was wound down. However, I found a way to overcome that situation........... I carried 2 blocks of timber, about 3"x2"x6".

When I needed to jockey the trailer by hand on a hard surface, I would wind the jockey wheel so the front of the trailer was as high as I could get it. This had the effect of making the gap between the shackle of the front axle set and the chassis, large enough to be able to insert one of my timber blocks on each side. I then wound the jockey wheel fully up so that the tow bar of the trailer was down near the ground. Now the rear wheels would be lifted off the ground as the equalising strut between the 2 sets of leaf springs was rendered ineffective.

Hope this makes sense...

Roachie

Indeed, that is one of the downsides to the tandem set-up, the ability (or inability) to manoeuvre the thing by hand (off the vehicle)..

In my case (due to the weight), I simply accept the fact that it ain't gonna happen... So what's the problem?? ;-))

As for getting stuck in sand, well, between our previous and current c/t's, I've dragged 'em over something in excess of 3000 sandhills (who's counting?), and have required a second (or third) attempt on no more than 6 - 8 of them.. to date, not one has required more than 3 attempts, and I have taken a 'snatch' on 1 occasion only..
When SWMBO and I crossed the SD (French & QAA Lines) in '05, we were travelling solo, so it was simply a case of makin' sure ya don't get stuck, right?...

As previously explained, tyre pressures waaay down (all round), and we had no problems:) .. had to take the 'chicken track' over Big Red though;-))

Cootacampers are no longer in business :(

Although there is one of their campers for sale in Port Maquarie at the moment.


Cheers Kev

Some great and involved reading in those links Geoff!

Thanks for taking up a few hours!!!!

Cheers
Muddy

No problem, I hope you got something out of them!

Geoff