1 week, to head on accidents. Be careful

It never seems to end does it.

So long as he didn't hit you is the main thing.

Sorry, heading should read 1 week two head accidents. Spell check didn't get that one!!!!!! It is late though.

Josh

[quote]Everyone knows drinking can lead to drink driving so it is premeditated. You willingly drink, willingly get in your car and willingly drive home drunk. I could choose not to pick up the gun, you could choose not to pick up the keys. Being drunk is not an excuse.[/quote]

Flawed thinking - been guilty of it myself (the flawed thinking).

Where to start?
It all seems so simple doesn't it?

But your wrong - I know this thru life experience. At say 17 years of age - the son of an alcoholic - I thought the same way. My dads a drunk - he chooses to drink, and he then gets drunk and embarrasses the whole family in public.

Never saw or spoke to my ol man from 17 till I was 28...bout 11 years - easier to leave home and start a new life away from his problem.

OK

Then the ol bugga got sober after being given 6 weeks to live (advanced liver failure).

He stayed sober another 20 odd years and even gave up smokes in that time as well - but not before throat cancer killed him.

In those 20 years he headed up the AA association in the state - was a delegate to Sydney and other states and helped a LOT of alcoholics turn their lives around - as ONLY a reformed alcoholic can do..... he started a business for EG RA Industries - (recovering alcoholics industries) - where they could get work - despite their problem - as LONG as they stayed on the wagon.

So not every "no hoper drunk" will end his years that way - some do turn their lives around with help and become productive members of society again.

Whats the point?

They don't have a choice - they have a disease of the brain. Its called addiction.

They have the same disease of the brain as Drug addicts have. You could "catch this illness / disease", it's dead easey to do.

Heres how you catch this disease!

1. You believe the TV adverts for alcohol - its good for you - makes you relaxed and fun to be around, helps at parties to get everyone happy and gets ugly women laid even.

Miracle juice!

2. Peer pressure, peers already on their own personal journey toward alcoholism encourage you to have a drink - as an excuse so they can have what they crave.

3. As a crutch to relax from the days stress. Just a few beers / drinks each night when you get home to help you relax.

Nuthing in and of itself wrong with that, except

Except when it gets to this point!

Except when you start to drink so much that your liver doesn't expel / process ALL the alcohol in your body in a 24 hour period - before you take your next drink.

That's when the rot starts - loss of liver function - liver disease, slows your body's ability to process alcohol - and before you know it you've entered the downward spiral where theres ALWAYS alcohol in your bloodstream 24 hours a day.

You probably don't drink any more than you did when you were young, BUT - your now getting older and liver function is down, the alcohol stays in your blood 24 hours a day coz your body can't process it. Now it takes less drinks to get you drunk...because your just "topping up from yesterdays intake" by the time you have your next beer.

Your a cheap drunk - 2 beers and you start to sway - slur your words... for 2 reasons.

1. Your Livers ill - starting the disease of alcoholics called cirrhosis of the liver.

2. You've formed a "chemical" in your brain, that causes dependency - you re now screwed, just like a herion addict, you CAN'T stop - even if you want too - because you have a DISEASE.

Its a curable DISEASE - but not easily curable and not without help (from recovered alcoholics at AA).

So - that "useless drunk" you see weaving everywhere and hitting others head on - has a disease - one that often proves fatal.

Its a disease you catch because the drug that causes it, is socially acceptable, everyone's happier with a drink or two under their belt, the TV adds promoting it tell us so.

What the adds (just like smoking adds of the good ol days) DON'T tell you is that if your not smart (educated) enough to control your alcohol intake - it can lead to cardio vascular disease that will kill you - alcoholic hepatitis that causes liver cirrhosis that will kill you, drunkenness behind a wheel that will kill you (and innocent others), family breakdown, marriage breakdown, loss of job, loss of sexual function, depression, and a whole raft of maladies - you don't want to know about!

But consumption of Alcohol is part of our social fabric - your not a REAL AUSSIE, unless you have a few at the local on the way home from work every day - buy it for others, and everyone drives home a bit wobbly - if you do that your a good bloke.

So - there's peer pressure that some can't handle that leads to alcoholism.

I happen to enjoy a beer - on a hot day 2 but most people (even my alcoholic relative) call me "OBE EE One Can Only" - in the hope I'll one day become a drinking buddy so he can have the excuse to drink more. Likes to tell people I wouldn't shout if a shark bit me.

Had he grown up the child of an alcoholic (actually he did) he might realize WHY I am so careful about alcohol consumption.
As the child of an alcoholic I am genetically predisposed to the disease (as he is).

I love a couple cold beers at the end of a long hot day - some guys use it as a motivation / reward to help them cope with long hard & hot days.

I particularly like a cold beer at the end of a days off-roading, traveling or fishing, while sitting round a camp fire, and crawl off to the tent to sleep it off.

It's a rare day I'd drink more than 2 beers.

People like him with an obsessive compulsive disorder - who eat too much and drink too much - can't help but become alcoholics eventually specially where thru family history there is a genetic predisposition towards it already.

Anyway - the whole point is that Alcoholism is a disease that's a community concern - and its something that people drift into, a little bit a day, and that insidiously catches up with them eventually - it's mostly fatal, but there are some who beat it and return to society to become positive contributors.

So the drunk you see about to climb behind the wheel - has a disease & it's a disease of addiction just as bad as heroin addiction - it ISN'T something that our kids are well enough educated about, and it IS something that far too many in our society "catch" thru "trying to be a good Aussie bloke", from peer pressure.

"They should have the smarts not to drive!"

Yeah and Heroin Addicts should have the smarts not to inject themselves too - but we all know that's not going to happen.

Saying it, doesn't make it possible, for the addict!

We as a community should be open about dealing with the problems of alcohol addiction.

We can make all the driving laws you like, it won't stop people becoming alcoholics & driving drunk and killing others.

We need a cultural change in Australia, one that embraces safe consumption of alcohol and that ostracizes those who aren't "safe in their drinking habits".

Instead of such behavior denoting "a good Aussie bloke" it should denote the sort of people we avoid, ostracize and basically don't invite to social functions.

Where in our drink driving laws is compulsory treatment for alcoholism?

It isn't and as long as that's the case we keep missing our chance at early intervention.

Your first drink driving charge should result in loss of license for life, UNTIL you have passed a detox and alcohol addiction treatment program where reformed alcoholics from AA, "vouch for you" in person, in front of a Judge, as someone who's now earned the right to be trusted again with the responsibility of driving a vehicle.

Might seem a bit harsh - but that's the reality if you want to save those innocents that the drunk alcoholics kill every day on our roads!

You want the freedom to be ill with a deadly disease that kills others - then the cost is dead innocents killed by drunks / alcoholics on our roads.

There isn't another way - yet!

Maybe one day technology will prevent people with alcohol in their system from being able to drive a car - but until that day - innocents are going to keep dieing so we can have a nation full of "good Aussie blokes" (at east until they kill someone - then they are just a mongrel).

If they could choose to stop drinking - if they could simply choose not to be drunks - then they would.

The trouble is - once your addicted - you no longer have choice - you have an almost incurable and fatal disease of addiction.

We should feel sorry for people with this disease - BUT we shouldn't afford them the privilege of the right to drive a vehicle & kill our family & kids on the roads.

They can't choose to stop - get it?

My 2c and then some.

Cheers

I don't think that the point of the post was about an alcoholic...maybe he isn't.

I think the point was that people who have been drinking have a choice not to drive drunk and that it should be classed as attempted murder or murder.

Sorry but I tend to agree, it may help to reduce the suffering of victims if it scares a few drunks off the road.

Cheers
Dave

Police do not have the funding for enough road patrols to catch the idiots. Then when the Police do catch them, the courts just give them a slap on the wrists and the idiots are back out re-offending.

For serious traffic offenses like Drink driving etc it should be 3 strikes and you are out. On the third offense you loose your license for ever (In addition to other penalties) . Maybe should also include confiscation of the vehicle, like the anti-hooning laws.

As I read it the original post was about people taking responsibility for their actions.

The post about alcoholism is the antithesis of this and is purely a well worn attempt to absolve people from taking responsibility for their actions.

In a previous career choice, I spent too many hours listening to people trying to justify anti-social actions by blaming various substances or events to listen to such ill-informed blanket statements

I will acknowledge that some people are psychologically, or possibly physiologically, predisposed to the effects of substance abuse. However, to become addicted to them requires you to work at it over a period of time. One hit of heroin does not make you a physiological addict, a couple of months usage probably will. One hit of heroin may start to make you a psychological addict when the euphoria acts as a release from a soul destroying existence. Every addict can justify their reasons for partaking in their vice of choice (I’ve even hears a paedophile using the same justification to attempt to excuse his actions)

Many years ago, I read a Judge’s Sentencing Comments, for a crim convicted of some nasty armed robberies (Unfortunately, I never kept a copy and can’t remember the judge’s or crim’s names)

Paraphrased from memory, it went as follows;

“I have considered the most eloquent submission from your counsel, and note that you came from a broken home, you never had any contact with your father, you were physically and sexually assaulted by your stepfather, you were introduced to drugs at an early age (...followed by a litany of social worker type excuses)

If you were 16, I would consider this history to be the reason for your offending; if you were 21, I would consider it to be one of the causes of your offending. You are now 30. It is time for you to take responsibility for your actions”

The crim was sentenced to 7 years with a non-parole period of 5

If any addict wants to stop they can. Ask any ex-smoker on the forum; most ex druggies will tell you nicotine addiction is more pernicious than heroin or speed

Hi Josh, Maree and girls

Glad you are all still travelling safely and on the home straight too by the looks of it.

One possible good thing to arise from your family witnessing these two maniacs is that hopefully the message that drinking and driving doesn't mix stays with your two girls for the rest of their lives. I am sure they received positive advice from you and Maree about what they both saw.

There is also the possibility that now the other innocent parties to these accidents also learn a lesson about drinking and driving.

I agree - everyone does have choice whether it be alcohol, drugs, smoking or whatever. It all begins with a choice to start or a choice to not. If someone blames peer pressure for their actions I think they have bigger problems than the drink or drugs etc that they consume. It is a weak excuse in my opinion.

You could probably throw into the mix that there is a real possibility that these drink drivers already are driving unlicenced from previous convictions. If that is the case it backs up others arguments that the laws and how they are enforced are very weak in this country. We are relatively a small country and the laws should be universal from one state to the next for all we do.

And to FW I hear what you are saying but that does not excuse them or give them a reason for their actions. If they had an alcohol addiction and used that as an excuse to rob, bash or kill someone the "I am an alcoholic" excuse wash with me. I have been very close to some alcoholics and also drunk alcohol sometimes to excess when younger, but the repercussions for my actions for the first drink whenever that may be are mine and the person who also drinks are theirs alone.

Sorry your family had to witness these but you provided positive actions to stop and render assistance, provide positive advice and support to your family so that hopefully they also grow up responsible just like you and Maree.

Stay safe with your remainder of your journey, cheers mick....

Josh your a good man to sit there with the idiot. Sitting here I don't think I could. The hm doesn't have the right to life he drove attempting every body else's lives including yours and your family.
Couple weeks ago down near the paddock im living in there was an almighty crash. Sister came running out of the house we got in the old girl and drove over to find a cruiser ute on its lid. Sister freaking out cause she thought the snorkel was his head. I got out in my jamies in the friggin cold didn't think to grab jacket and looked for the driver. No where to be seen. We searched the bush then another ute came. The two fellas jumped out both bleep we know this cause they were at the pub two hours earlier while we were there having dinner vocal then. One no shoes and blood under his nose. The jock straps decided to try to pull the ute over with telecom string. Just sat there shaking our heads and told them we called the cops. Didn't he go off. Only the police said to stay put we wanted to get out of there. I Absolutely have no respect for anybody that drink drives .
Sharon

Your opening post reminds me of renewing my gun licence recently.
The question was 'what is my genuine reason for owning a gun"?
My thoughts were; its my right to own a gun, regardless of what some antigun nuts think and also if i wanted i could drive my gu into the surfers paradise mall at speed and possibly kill more people than i could with a gun, so whats the difference? Anyway, just a question that annoyed me.
Cheers.