2006 STANDARD LANDCRUISER VERSES 2007 CRD PATROL DX

Submitted: Wednesday, Sep 16, 2009 at 21:09
ThreadID: 72307 Views:5052 Replies:6 FollowUps:10
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Hi all,looking fore collective wisdom as to which of the two vehicles would make the best tourer,economy,reliability,comfort etc.I like the idea of vinyl interior fore ease of cleaning .I would be grateful fore your thoughts to help decide on which one.

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Reply By: The Lobster - Wednesday, Sep 16, 2009 at 21:43

Wednesday, Sep 16, 2009 at 21:43
haha! Good luck getting an unbiased response! It's kinda like getting on the loud speaker at a V8 supercar race and asking for a constructive comparison between ford and holden. It never ends well.

My advice is, do the research on the vehicles separately, and make a list of the pros and cons of each.

Personally, I'm a cruiser man and wouldn't touch a pootrol, but I'll try to be as unbiased as possible.

Cruiser pros:
- reliability
- vinyl

Cruiser cons:
- lack of extras
- lack of performance

Patrol pros:
- cheaper
- fuel economy?

Patrol cons:
- the 3.0 litre TD explosion factor


That's all I can think of right now. I'm sure others will add to that list.

matt
AnswerID: 383439

Reply By: Robin Miller - Wednesday, Sep 16, 2009 at 21:51

Wednesday, Sep 16, 2009 at 21:51
We all have different values IVA and you have to set out yours.

The Patrol is to slow to be safe , and the cruiser is much slower again.

AnswerID: 383441

Follow Up By: tim_c - Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 13:56

Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 13:56
You've got me curious now Robin: "too slow to be safe" together with your comment the other day that a car must go from standsill to 100km/h in less than 16sec in order to be safe...

My first car was a Suzuki LJ80v with the 0.8L 4 stroke engine in it (ie. no Corolla conversion). I once timed it from a standstill to 100km/h and I think it managed it in around 40sec (poor little car was never quite the same after being flogged so hard! LOL). My parents were quite happy that I didn't buy some big powerful thing like many young people do, only to end up in trouble because the car's too fast/powerful for their level of experience (although that car had many other characteristics to catch out an inexperienced driver!).

So I've just got ask: how can something be "too slow to be safe"? Afterall, if I'm ever involved in a crash, I'd prefer it to be at low speed.
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FollowupID: 651163

Follow Up By: Robin Miller - Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 17:59

Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 17:59
Hi Tim

First I would agree with you that cars can be to fast in addition
to being to slow.

In fact that statement encapsulates the real issue.

Anything out of the mainstream of human experience will cause an increased
non-compliance.

When applied to car this means more accidents.

We can all point to various anecdotes in which this or that happened
or we lived with a deficient car for ever without a problem but reality
is cold and unforgiving across a large population.

We can guarantee somethings based on proven, for example more people
who drive little cars will die when they hit big cars.

My line is often to concentrate on the main issues affecting primary
safety, because in the end , while we can't say who it will be
we can say that it will happen.

I am sure you have heard all the standard arguments , like a
surprise you don't need when overtaking a truck and the reply
that having the right "personality" would prevent you being
there in the first place , but you can not escape the conclusion
that slow vehicles close off options.

Using a more recent situation , I do not believe a standard cruiser
would have been able to generate the momentum needed to get up some
unexpectedly hard sand blows we have encountered.
Had it been alone and the second sandstorm had come through 1 day earlier
so they could not turn around , who knows what the outcome might have been.

I have friends with standard landcruiser, now warmed up significantly
from its original 22 sec to 100km. Just wouldn't go there myself.

16 sec is roughly the time needed to keep up with the traffic, the 3lt
Patrol needs to be thrashed to achieve that and its engine is not up to a lot of thrashing.

I'm with you on your last point to, when it comes my turn for an accident I'd prefer it to be slow, but then I'd prefer to not be in the way to get hit at all
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FollowupID: 651198

Follow Up By: Krakka - Friday, Sep 18, 2009 at 06:01

Friday, Sep 18, 2009 at 06:01
What a load of garbage, in my opinion anyway. We had better take all trucks and semi's off the road, hilux's, standard cruisers and patrols, even the 3lt by your determination as we dont want it to explode at that crucial moment. 0 to 100 in 16 seconds, where is the relevance to off road driving there?
Respect your opinion but I can,t see much relevance to off roading.

Regards

Krakka
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FollowupID: 651268

Follow Up By: Robin Miller - Friday, Sep 18, 2009 at 07:52

Friday, Sep 18, 2009 at 07:52
Hi Krakka

I am not sure what your point is , but some track sections require momentum and acceleration and cars like the standard 100 series are just to slow and cannot make it. Wether its 15 16 or 17sec is a bit arbitary, but your reply actually contains your answer , hence why some vehicles like trucks and semi sare no good on steep tracks even if they were straight.

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FollowupID: 651279

Reply By: Voxson - Wednesday, Sep 16, 2009 at 22:03

Wednesday, Sep 16, 2009 at 22:03
I have just stepped out of years of patrols and into a 2006 std landcruiser so i guess i can make some valid comments......
If you are looking at a 3litre Patrol (forget it)......
The more weight you carry the dramatically more fuel they use and they have ZERO engine braking for decents,, you will always be riding the brakes...
You can expect 11 litres per 100 in one if it is manual and you are in standard form on a country road,,, autos chew a bit more juice expecially around town because they need to be in lockout to equal the manual.
In sand they can average 17 per 100 in the manual and over 20 in auto form...

The 4.2 manual in the cruiser is great,, heaps of engine braking but no power for towing or hills,,, you will find yourself in 4th gear in a stiff headwind and on slight inclines but there is no hassle because that is only a small portion of it..

Fuel consumption is good,, 14 - 15's fully loaded and 17's in sand fully loaded.

Comfort is much better in the Landcruiser,, the seats are better and the vision is much better over the bonnet as the dash is more ergonomic.
Heaps more usable room inside,, the Patrol is smaller inside..

The ride is better in the cruiser,, more planted on the road,,, but the diffs are stronger in the patrol and the nissan wins again with a much better LSD in the rear.

More legroom in the cruiser and better armrests on the doors..

Power steering is also nicer to use in the cruiser,, with more vision in the side rear view mirrors..

Even refueling the cruiser is better because of the fuel filler layout..

The roofrack system on the cruiser is a pain because you cannot choose where to put your racks as they must be put where the predetermined spots are,,, the patrol was better because you could use any parts of the gutters...

The rear barn doors shut better on the cruiser and less dust enters the cruiser,, the rear seals seam a lot better.




AnswerID: 383443

Follow Up By: ctaplin - Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 18:51

Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 18:51
Voxson,

How would your normally aspirated 1HZ go say pulling a 6 metre boat in a head wind? You might find that you cause a bottle neck with traffic.
Those things won't pull the skin of a rice pudding...
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FollowupID: 651204

Reply By: Member - Graham H (QLD) - Wednesday, Sep 16, 2009 at 23:02

Wednesday, Sep 16, 2009 at 23:02
Ive had both so this is as I see it

Look at Landcruiser GXL TD auto
If you can afford to compare a 2007 Patrol you will do much better if you consider a TD croozer.

Pros More power
More comfortable Much more
Not much worse fuel consumption
Much better towing capacity.
Doesnt slow down on hills like the other 2
Is at least one gear better.

Cons

Only what Nissan owners can think up.

Usual about front diffs Which are only weak doing snatches in reverse.


Have done 26,000 k in mine towing a 2.8t van and have had NO probs so far.
Average about 16-17 l per 100k when towing
Does better when sightseeing.

The Std one with the 1HZ is slower than a wet week anywhere


Cheers

AnswerID: 383455

Follow Up By: Off-track - Wednesday, Sep 16, 2009 at 23:32

Wednesday, Sep 16, 2009 at 23:32
For a tourer and tower you'd be hard pressed to top the 100TD but they do need some work to be as capable as the GU for the really tough going that requires good articulation, clearance angles and strong diffs.

The front diff is relatively weak under shock loading and the rear lsd action is poo after 80-odd thousand kays. Be wary of radiator fans in the drink too.
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FollowupID: 651077

Follow Up By: Member - Ingo57 (NSW) - Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 10:57

Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 10:57
"Usual about front diffs Which are only weak doing snatches in reverse".

There have been many busted front diffs & is definitely not just from snatching in reverse. The reality is the front IFS diffs in the 100 series are weak!
"If" they break, It's "usually" from a lifted or unloaded spinning front wheel making contact with the ground again and shearing teeth off the Crown wheel.

Nothing against the 100 series, they are a real nice car to drive and the motor is one of the best around IMO but the front suspension and diff are "only" bad thing I think anyone can say about them.


Iva,

Sure the 3Lt Patrol has a bad history and most owners swear by them until they go Boom!!! I would never buy one however............
For a serious Off road tourer that can take some punishment the 4.2 Turbo Patrol would be a better comparison to the standard cruiser.

The 4.2 Patrols are bullet proof
the Cruisers definitely have a better build quality but nowhere as strong mechanically.

In saying this, I'm sure you would be happy with either.


Cheers

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FollowupID: 651121

Follow Up By: Member - Graham H (QLD) - Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 11:39

Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 11:39
Anything will break if you abuse it enough.

Im sure a few Nissans have sheared teeth for the very same reason.




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FollowupID: 651127

Follow Up By: Member - Graham H (QLD) - Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 11:42

Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 11:42
The original post was regarding a TOURER so perhaps he wont be lifting front

wheels off the ground.

As he hasnt stated where he wants to tour it would be reasonable to assume hes staying on roads.



Cheers

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FollowupID: 651128

Follow Up By: Member - Ingo57 (NSW) - Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 12:31

Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 12:31
G'day Graham,

Totally agree that everything has a breaking point.
I would have no hesitation doing a reverse snatch In my Patrol and with all the power of the 4.8 I have no reservations of unloading a wheel in 4L with my right boot in to it (If needed).

I remember when the 100 series was released one of the 4by magazines did a road test on all the major brands, the cruiser busted the front diff on the way up to the cape and they were not even trying hard.

I also agree with you that It depends on how the vehicle will be used, for example I know that I would not feel comfortable in a IFS 100 series on the Madigan's line for the front wheels are being unloaded all day with high torque being generated through the drivelines attempting to get over the dunes.

My good mate has a 100 series and I'd be lying If I said I wasnt envious for they are beaut truck to drive and the build quality is the best, however when he came across the Simpson with us last year, me being a mechanic It was always in the back of my mind.....What If!

Just my opinion though.... Toyota and Nissan drivers will always have these running debates and its healthy.

Cheers











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FollowupID: 651147

Reply By: Member - Captain (WA) - Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 02:23

Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 02:23
Hi Iva,

I too have had both, a 2003 GU 3.0TD and a barn door 80 series 1HZ (not much difference between 80/100 in standard model). While both have their good and bad points, at the end of the day I would prefer the GU over the 1HZ.

Both are live axle vehicles with similar on and off road suspension performance. While the GU LSD is better, not enough to be a deciding factor. The 100 gearbox/diff is not as strong as a GU, but more than strong enough if you drive within reason.

The 100 has more interior space, but again not enough to make the difference. The seat comfort is up to the individual, I found the GU great but replaced my 80 seat with an aftermarket one. Basically, more an individual thing than a decision point IMHO. As for vinyl for cleaning, I fitted the QMCC sandgrabba mats seat covers on the GU and after 5 years my interior was like new when detailed. But then again the 80 vinyl interior also was like new after detailing so nothing in it really.

Now reliability is one where the GU3.0TD has a very bad reputation. But most of the issues are well known and one can monitor/fix (but you shouldn't have too - thats a different issue with Nissan). While the 1HZ is arguably the most reliable motor around, the diff and gearbox (100 has the R151, not the H151 like the turbo 100) are potential weak links. I do think the 100 has the reliability edge, but in this day and age its not a life and death issue, just an inconvenience and $$$ issue.

But the clincher for me is touring and towing. I towed a van (1600kg) with the 1HZ and it was S..L..O..W.. and was not economical. The GU was a rocket in comparison (I had a Dtronic - 136Kw & 420Nm, helps the low RPM lack of torque) and I never had a genuine lack of power - and it got better fuel economy to boot. For some to say a GU is underpowered at 420Nm, well I don't know what world they come from. In a nutshell, the GU was a pleasure to drive when towing while the 1HZ was close to nerve racking at times.

I remember one occasion when towing my van into a strong headwind near Geralton that I could not get over 80km/hr. A 3.0TD GU towing a much bigger boat pulled out and overtook me - a very convincing display of the extra power.

Now while I do think the GU is in front and I loved my GU the whole time I had it, I will never buy a Nissan again!!! The way Nissan Australia (not the dealers) has such total contempt for it customers, well I spoke with my money when I replaced the GU. So, a true oxymoron here, while I recommend the GU over the 1HZ, I will never buy a Nissan again.

Cheers

Captain
AnswerID: 383462

Reply By: wak - Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 22:30

Thursday, Sep 17, 2009 at 22:30
what about the 4.2 nissan problems with overheating,being in the machanic trade we have rebuillt numerous patrols due to cooking the motor and the 3 litres are grenades after they get 120000 k's on the clock, if you are in the trade , everybody knows this is a FACT
nissans driveline is bulletproof but the donks are pathetic
AnswerID: 383581

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