Feelings & Factors in Turning Around !

Submitted: Wednesday, Nov 04, 2009 at 20:44
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We were at the scene of a troppy tray recovery that had hours to run
so I said to my wife, there is another way to Victoria's Mt Sunday
so off we headed via Mt Skene south of Mansfield in NE Victoria.

The seasonal closures were just over and many tracks had little or no usage
in months leaving debris everywhere, as shown by these 3 trees down to-gether.

Image Could Not Be Found

Our destination was to be via a beautiful gorge known as Peters gorge
about 1000+ meters up in the High country.

Last time I drove it it was a pleasant 4wd route with interesting bits but nothing to hard so we felt at ease as we left the dirt roads and entered an area of rough tracks by ourselves.

The GPS showed 25km to the destination at 3pm.

The drive began well enough but soon we noticed an excessive amount of
fallen trees most of which lay from across the track such that you had to drive
under them. Some were pretty tight and the GU just cleared them.

We left the Barkly river track and conditions slowly got worse with the
track turning into true 4wd and tree rubbish everywhere. Small rockslides
began appearing and weren't to bad.
I noticed a set of wheels marks which indicated that at least 1 car had gone before us and this meant it must be ok.

We passed the Middle ridge track turnoff, and the track immediately got harder
and steep.
A fire had been thru this area and now there were many logs lying around
but the next log was about 35cm thick and wheel marks had gone right over it.
I knew that my 33 inch wheels wouldn't allow that so out with the chain saw
and we cleared that obstackle but I began to wonder about what lay ahead.

Several fallen trees later we came out onto a very rocky steep downhill grade
and down we went, slowly picking our way.
These things usually don't go for that far but this one kept going and was followd by another which was getting steeper and the little slides began as we went further down over a rock ledge being sucked in by the good traction we had on the warm dry rocks.
I am not quite sure when I began to seriously wonder about getting back out
but it might of been as we came to a large ledge drop-off with a hole over a meter deep in it and she dropped straight onto the chassis rails and slewed a little.
I now had no choice but to continue down picking the line carefully.

Oh well, its only 14km to Mt Sunday now and the track used to be so good
, so this must be the worst.

Off the rocky descent, we were straight into the lush green weed filled swamp land approaching the gorge.
The hot car now entered a long water section which sank of oozing mud
steaming off the exhaust.
Simply spectacular country, with massive fern growth and occasional small water falls from the recent snow melt.
Beginning to watch the time now as we headed northeast away from the gorge and we soon encountered a large swamp area strewn with fallen branches and leading straight to a small uphill rock wall.
A major tree blocked the track and a rough bypass was in place which made a tight path between other trees , deep grass and mush.
The bypass required a couple of backups and intersected with a deeply rutted track requiring an immediate sharp turn.
Got thru 90 % and as we turned the car slipped on a grassed over log and slid sideways.
The back end hit a tree damm! and put a dinner plate sized dent near the fuel filler panel.
Never in many years of this stuff have I ever done this to a car, and I wasn't feeling very good about it.
We got onto the track proper, chained sawed two more trees out of the way and now 1/2 exhausted stopped to take stock.
Soon I would need to make up some more chainsaw fuel.

13 kms to go at 4pm, I had covered about 1km in the last hour and began to get a bit of a funny feeling in the stomach. We were out here by ourseleves well equipped but no one was going to help us and I didn't think I could go back.

On we pushed, but we were getting an obstackle every 100m or so now but still I believe a car had gone thru, so, so can I.
Next was a 150m climb in deep mud ruts, I could see the odd diff marks on the mud top and the climb looked hard.
We locked front wheels and the car pulled itself up, I stopped and looked back, we had dragged the car all the way!
I was now convinced that whoever had gone ahead had 35's at least and probably 38's.

The steep rutted climb had torn off the passenger side mudflap and brought us to a forbidding rock wall section, with huge smooth boulders unlike the broken rock section on the descent.
Seriously concerned now we stopped and walked the rock walls.
I reckon I could have winched myself up given time, but we didn't have time and then my wife pointed out a long mark in the rock.
If they made this mark it really would mean that my car would have to be dragged up.

It was to much - what should we do ?

Caught between two difficult rock climbs, I couldn't go forward and I couldn't go back and was without other support, and had already damaged the car.

Can't remember such presure for a long time, and found it a sobbering experience in a morbid sort of way.

Whatever I did would be my call and needed to be made carefully else I would be spending at least the night here and no tow truck was ever going to get me out of this.

Factors I considered were that I really didn't know what was ahead.
Maybe this rock wall was it and it would be easy after it?
Maybe the car that had left wheel marks had never even made it either and turned back.
I had 3 hours of sunlight left and knew that only the rock ledge we had descended earlier would stop me all the rest was just time and care.

Made the call to turn back, primarily because going on was into the unknown.
In the back of by mind I knew it would be easier to climb the rocks while warm and storms were forecast. Rain would seriously compromize us.

We turned and drove down the muddy chute formed by the wheel ruts, it was about waist height on the car and we had to get out of it at the bottom to bypass some trees and this is when I think we tore out the gearbox breathers.

But despite this I noted an interesting feeling, as soon as I had made the turn around descision I felt better, even though we knew what was ahead.

At least we had a definite object and purpose in mind.

Through the swamp holes and minor climbs we were now at the base of the rock ledges section. (UTM 55H 0449130E 5860044N).
5pm and no time to mess around so we put in both lockers and began the climb in 1st low.
The bighorn muddies were in good condition @ 18psi and the warm rocks meant traction was at max.
The first three ledges went well with just a bit of scrabbling and the odd retreat.
Then we saw the huge step in front. I'm sure it looks bigger when your on edge but to me it really looked mean.
Taking the best line the front wheels rose sharply up the face, grabbed for traction, lost it, grabbed again then gave up and car sank back down.
Tried again on a different line but we sort of sat their with the wheels turning on the rock and the car sort of bouncing around as it kept grabbing and letting go.
Going nowhere and with the car developing a side angle I called it and turned the engine off.

Got out, and looked around, what could I do, there was a winchable tree ahead but it would be a hard pull straight up, looked at the tyres , maybe we could drop pressure a bit more but the drivers rear was already badly depressed by a sharp rock the car rested against.
Last thing I need to do right now was tear out a side wall so I left the tyres alone.

Hanging on the side of this hill we stopped and my wife insisted we just take the time to have a drink and calm down.
As we are sitting there I glanced over the track edge. There were a dozen or more soft drinks cans right there including a half full one sitting on a rock.
This had clearly been the site of a previous struggle.

My wife then made 2 comments, first was she would get out, taking a few things as well and hence lighting the car, and second, the Toyota dealer had only rung again yesterday and she just looked at me and said.
"Robin, can you really see yourself right now, in this situation, with a new Prado in place of this car".

The resting was good and I decided on a plan. I had brought a full sized
mattock with me. Just the thing for smashing into rocks.
We repositioned the car and began rebuilding the track one rock at a time.
6pm now and we were ready to roll.
Lined up the car so one wheel would be over the now straightened track edge but was aimed right at a tree. Carefully we took off and up the car crawled, the scrap on the passenger mudguard was little price to pay as we overcame the rock wall and the feeling of relief was almost to much.
We were threw and stopped for a minute, then proceeded on up again as there were still rock sections above.
One caught us out and required 3 backups before we got it.

Now we were genuinely threw and stopped much relieved and in need of another strong coffee.

Some hours later as we approached our place in the dark we saw 3 Koala's seperately walking the road.
One jumped up at a roadside tree, missed and fell flat on its face dazzeled by our headlights.

Yep, it had been a hard day all round !


NOTE - If your in the Peters gorge area take care as the track has deteriorated to the point of being undriveable without backup and support.

NOTE 2 - Usually we take more photo's but this got forgotten this time.
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Reply By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Wednesday, Nov 04, 2009 at 20:58

Wednesday, Nov 04, 2009 at 20:58
Robin,

Can't add too much to that..well done.


Michael J
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Follow Up By: Robin Miller - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 07:43

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 07:43
Thanks Michael , its amazing how some of this stuff , just falls into place for a story , I can't ever remember seeing 3 seperate cases of Koala's walking within 2 km of track before etc
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Reply By: entropy - Wednesday, Nov 04, 2009 at 21:02

Wednesday, Nov 04, 2009 at 21:02
Stuff of legends - like the fish that got away. Great story - well told.
AnswerID: 390015

Follow Up By: Robin Miller - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 07:38

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 07:38
Hi Entropy

That fish came closer to not getting home than the report shows , but alls well that ends well.
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Reply By: Member - Toyocrusa (NSW) - Wednesday, Nov 04, 2009 at 21:10

Wednesday, Nov 04, 2009 at 21:10
Hi Robin. Shows how quickly the best laid plans go astray. Glad you got on top of it in the end. (Why do people leave their cans etc behind though?) Bob.
AnswerID: 390016

Follow Up By: Robin Miller - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 07:39

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 07:39
Its just so annoying Bob , but this is one time we didn't take the time to pick up rubbish.
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Reply By: Crackles - Wednesday, Nov 04, 2009 at 21:40

Wednesday, Nov 04, 2009 at 21:40
Yes travelling in groups with plenty of saws on the more obscure tracks for the next month is probably a good idea. Fire areas in particular seem to have one tree down every 100m on average going by our clubs recent track clearing efforts. You did well getting as far as you got in the end.
Brother had a horror trip on that same track several years ago when it rained about half way. Group got out at 1am after winching for nearly 8 hours. Might be time to revist Mt Sunday myself ;-))
Great story Robin, Cheers Craig..........
AnswerID: 390020

Follow Up By: Robin Miller - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 07:36

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 07:36
Hi Craig

Just that hill by itself with some others probably would have just been fun, but hours of clearing and getting round obstackles etc by oneself sort of wears you down and your off to a bad start.

It such a beautiful area its well worth a re-visit , but as you say , after a few more have cleared the way.
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Reply By: Willem - Wednesday, Nov 04, 2009 at 22:22

Wednesday, Nov 04, 2009 at 22:22
Good yarn, Robin. You are putting that old ticker of yours through a bit of stress...LOL
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Follow Up By: Robin Miller - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 07:41

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 07:41
Can't slow down Willem ,else my wife will say these no reason we shouldn't tow a camper or worse a "Car........" , can't bring myself to say the word !
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Reply By: Member - Captain (WA) - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 00:22

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 00:22
Yet another great tale Robin, well done, but would have been a fantastic tale if you had pics:) Does this effort mean you will keep the mighty 4.8GU a bit longer - or has it got you thinking "oh what a feeling ..."

Cheers mate

Captain
AnswerID: 390029

Follow Up By: Robin Miller - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 07:33

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 07:33
I found it interesting that we were to concerned this time to take more pics Captain , I was trying to think how much damage I would do to a new car in that situation and if a new cruiser/Prado would have made it with less damage.
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Reply By: Gramps - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 07:52

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 07:52
Robin,

That was a great read. Obviously the Boss has put up with your 'interesting' excursions for quite some time LOL

AnswerID: 390039

Reply By: Travelling Pixie - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 08:54

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 08:54
great tale!! thanks for sharing!
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Reply By: Wayne (NSW) - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 09:20

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 09:20
Robin,

A great tale of "what not to do"

Maybe staying with the Toyota ute and reporting on how it was recovered might have been better than potentially getting yourself in to a similar position down the track.

Wayne
AnswerID: 390050

Reply By: Pete Jackman (SA) - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 13:05

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 13:05
Great story Robin,

I must admit that:

"I noticed a set of wheels marks which indicated that at least 1 car had gone before us and this meant it must be ok."

can always be a worry. I have wondered on one rough track if I was going to find the maker of the tracks at the end of them still stuck there in his 4by!

Cheers

Pete
AnswerID: 390072

Follow Up By: Member - Leigh (Vic) - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 13:24

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 13:24
Moral of the story is:

know what you're doing,
always assess risks (within your limits)
have a plan and options
carry the right gear
have a friend with you
buy a HF or Sat phone (call a friend)
carry sleeping gear, and
never follow in the wheel tracks of a Troopy!!

Good to see you got out of this OK though.
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Reply By: Tony MD - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 13:29

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 13:29
Hi Robin. I thought those trees looked familiar!
I ran a club trip recce from Marysville to Mount Buller. Camped Saturday night on the Goulburn river then headed to the Middle Ridge Road & the Mount Sunday Track. The chainsaw got heaps of work on Middle ridge road. Had lunch at the old hut site prior to the Mt. Sunday track turn off.
One vehicle required a pull up a rutted dirt section immediately after Peters Gorge used a double snatch & my new x-trax mats - (where I had to clear another tree) and also the peak of Mt. Mckinty where we stopped just to the north at 4:10pm & set up camp making it 4.5 hours including a lunch stop to travel about 13 kms.

The climb you had trouble with I first tackled on the LHS with both ends locked & new 285-75-16 BFG muddies but got the rear left caught on a tree root ledge. Pulled out the winch but stalled it on a double pull. Backed back down & took a RHS approach that initially looked harder but got all vehicles (3) up this route. RHS front wheel pawing the air.

After we had set up camp, a group of (Monster Trucks) passed by heading south. They would have to tackle the steep rocky climb up to the Middle Ridge Rd. We now knew that the route before us was at least open although there were numerous fallen tree detours that were too much for my saw - I was stilll feeling a bit stuffed from the day before.

We all felt quite invigerated after completing this tough trip. I pretty much put all of my recovery gear to use except for the high lift.

Glad to see you made it home.
Cheers, Tony
AnswerID: 390075

Reply By: Tony MD - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 14:51

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 14:51
Hi Robin. I thought those trees looked familiar!
I ran a club trip recce from Marysville to Mount Buller. Camped Saturday night on the Goulburn river then headed to the Middle Ridge Road & the Mount Sunday Track. The chainsaw got heaps of work on Middle ridge road. Had lunch at the old hut site prior to the Mt. Sunday track turn off.
One vehicle required a pull up a rutted dirt section immediately after Peters Gorge used a double snatch & my new x-trax mats - (where I had to clear another tree) and also the peak of Mt. Mckinty where we stopped just to the north at 4:10pm & set up camp making it 4.5 hours including a lunch stop to travel about 13 kms.

The climb you had trouble with I first tackled on the LHS with both ends locked & new 285-75-16 BFG muddies but got the rear left caught on a tree root ledge. Pulled out the winch but stalled it on a double pull. Backed back down & took a RHS approach that initially looked harder but got all vehicles (3) up this route. RHS front wheel pawing the air.

After we had set up camp, a group of (Monster Trucks) passed by heading south. They would have to tackle the steep rocky climb up to the Middle Ridge Rd. We now knew that the route before us was at least open although there were numerous fallen tree detours that were too much for my saw - I was stilll feeling a bit stuffed from the day before.

We all felt quite invigerated after completing this tough trip. I pretty much put all of my recovery gear to use except for the high lift.

Glad to see you made it home.
Cheers, Tony
AnswerID: 390082

Reply By: Tony MD - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 15:03

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 15:03
Hi Robin. I thought those trees looked familiar!
I ran a club trip recce from Marysville to Mount Buller. Camped Saturday night on the Goulburn river then headed to the Middle Ridge Road & the Mount Sunday Track. The chainsaw got heaps of work on Middle ridge road. Had lunch at the old hut site prior to the Mt. Sunday track turn off.
One vehicle required a pull up a rutted dirt section immediately after Peters Gorge used a double snatch & my new x-trax mats - (where I had to clear another tree) and also the peak of Mt. Mckinty where we stopped just to the north at 4:10pm & set up camp making it 4.5 hours including a lunch stop to travel about 13 kms.

The climb you had trouble with I first tackled on the LHS with both ends locked & new 285-75-16 BFG muddies but got the rear left caught on a tree root ledge. Pulled out the winch but stalled it on a double pull. Backed back down & took a RHS approach that initially looked harder but got all vehicles (3) up this route. RHS front wheel pawing the air.

After we had set up camp, a group of (Monster Trucks) passed by heading south. They would have to tackle the steep rocky climb up to the Middle Ridge Rd. We now knew that the route before us was at least open although there were numerous fallen tree detours that were too much for my saw - I was stilll feeling a bit stuffed from the day before.

We all felt quite invigerated after completing this tough trip. I pretty much put all of my recovery gear to use except for the high lift.

Glad to see you made it home.
Cheers, Tony
AnswerID: 390085

Follow Up By: Tony MD - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 15:35

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 15:35
Hell, sorry for the multiple relies. I keep getting a server time out error when attempting to leave this thread then whammo, the reply gets posted again!
Image Could Not Be FoundImage Could Not Be FoundImage Could Not Be Found

A few shots of our trip. Was also a bit busy for too many photos.
Tony.
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Follow Up By: Robin Miller - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 18:30

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 18:30
Fantastic Stuff Tony , had things not gone well you could have rescued us the next day.
As I read it you were at Peters Gorge Sunday, I was there saturday, but someone else had been before me.

Just trying to follow your path , from Goulburn how did you get to middle ridge (Lazarinni).

How were your mats used, what did you think of them ?

I was very reluctant to try a winch pull up the rock face on my own where I think yours stalled.
Might have to upgrade the winch somehow , cause at times you need to count on it

I hope the downhill rock section was better for my attacking it with the mattock !
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Follow Up By: Tony MD - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 20:11

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 20:11
I thought that you may have been there after us.
I had spoken to Ken Dwight (WP. Police) & the Mansfield DSE earlier in the week for conditions & was aware that this track had not been cleared of trees so expected much of what we got. I had only just bought a new chainsaw & this was its' first outing!
As for the X-trax, they were an aid to the recovery but a snatch was still required - laid in the ruts on the climb after Peters Gorge. The main issue here though was lack of ground clearance & average tyres on the other 80 series. I actually bought them for the Mt.Mckinty wall section where with some track reconstruction, they could provide an easier climb. Not needed there though. (Had track information from another club trip some years ago - I last did this track solo on a bike in 1983!)
As for the winch, either a double snatch block or an alternative tree could have been the go - & also the mats. I was not aware of how big the tree root step actually was until I had backed off it!.
Our route consisted of Big River road, Frenchmans' creek tk, Boundary tk (blocked by a large tree just past the creek crossing. Detoured back to BRR & did the other end of Boundary tk), Corn Hill tk, Frenchmans gap tk, The German Spur, Army tk, Lazarini Spur, Jamieson - Licola Rd, Middle Ridge rd, Mt. Sunday tk, Low Saddle rd, Mt McDonald tk, nobs tk, Mt. Clear creek tk.
Due to a wet morning & time, we headed out via Brocks,the Bluff link & Bindaree rd to Craigs Hut.The original plan would have us over King Billy, the Bluff to Pikes flat then follow the Howqua eastwards.
As the track over Stilring is closed until 30 November, we simply went up & back to Craigs via Monument tk. Then is was a simple jump across the Howqua Gap to Buller.Image Could Not Be FoundImage Could Not Be Found

All in all a great trip. It would appear that there will be many more trees to clear as the season progresses as the ones I cleared off particularly Middle Ridge road were not by-passable. North of Mt. Mckinty were numerous fresh detour tracks that we thought had been pushed through by the "Monster Trucks".
On Saturday night/ Sunday morning on the Goulburn we has a short shower (tent predominantly dry) & saw lots of lightning activity way over to the east from Mt. McKinty on Sunday night. Monday night / morning on the Jamieson had lots of wind, lightning & thunder but not so much rain. Glad we were off the mountain as had trouble with rocks & tent pegs!
We normally carry some sleeping gear & food - even on a day trip, just in case! The exception was a trip the other month near Noojee & due to slippery conditions (actually used work drop sheets as traction aids - they worked well but are no longer white) & a broken diff, we didn't get back to Noojee until after 10:00pm. Cat came home via a tilt tray courtesy of RACV Total Care.

Catch up on the tracks, Tony.
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Follow Up By: Robin Miller - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 20:35

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 20:35
You weren't on a bike on that track in 1983 , I was on that track on a bike in 1983 testing the knew monocross first ever water cooled two stroke.

Did a ride from Knockwood , past Peters to Wonnagatta and even used two meters hand held to rescue someone from there - we must have driven past each other many times , gotta catch up some day.Image Could Not Be Found
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Follow Up By: Tony MD - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 20:52

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 20:52
Rode my PE250 from Big River to Mitchells to visit friends for the day. Had been on the track the previous year & thought it was great (North to South). Rode out back through Wrens, Silver mine, Snake Edwards, Moonlight spur, Mt. Terrible & Danes Spur.
Had to take a fair bit of extra fuel.
My backup was a 27mHz hand held - not an amateur then!

Photo is of me at the bottom of the now MVO track from Mt. Clear Creek to King Billy Saddle via Chesters Yard.
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Follow Up By: Robin Miller - Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 21:36

Thursday, Nov 05, 2009 at 21:36
The old PE-250 , good one Tony - hope you didn't carry a plastic leaking jerry on your back like we did and contaminating the food.
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