Bio Diesel

Submitted: Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 08:10
ThreadID: 73605 Views:3571 Replies:9 FollowUps:9
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Last week I tried my first tank of Bio-diesel..

This is BD20, and I must say, that I am impressed, to say the least, no loss of power, and the beast runs a bit better on the economy stakes too. 10-15% better, to be exact.
Not sure about the long term effects, on rubbers, valves, my pump, ect, but if you can believe a 20 year old consol operator, when quizzed, she stated that they, meaning the manufacturers of BD20, will pay for repairs, if this stuff damages my motor.

MMMmmmmmmmmmmm

I wonder ????????

Cheers in advance for your comments
Bucky
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Reply By: Member Brian (Gold Coast) - Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 08:53

Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 08:53
Hi Bucky,

Interested in your ongoing opinion of this, keep us updated on how it goes.

Cheers

Brian


AnswerID: 390440

Reply By: get outmore - Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 16:50

Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 16:50
been using gull bio D which I think is B20 for at least 2 years now. Only time I dont use it is when travlling around and cant get it

no issues
AnswerID: 390481

Reply By: Ozboc - Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 21:02

Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 21:02
only issues you WILL have is infact you have rubber seals rather than VITON -- most cars POST 89 will have viton seals .... anything after 2000 WILL have viton unless they were provided with dodgey seals
AnswerID: 390529

Reply By: fisho64 - Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 21:29

Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 21:29
Ive used B20 Gull in LC and Hilux for as long as its been around.
No issues at all, runs spot on, and cheaper also.

Dunno about what the console operator said though. AFAIK its the same as any fuel related problem-prove it first.
AnswerID: 390531

Reply By: Member - Bucky - Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 21:35

Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 21:35
Sorry guy's

I forgot to mention, that I will have to travel 100 km to Traralgon, Vic,to get this stuff, so It may not be done on as regular basis as I would like

next nearest will probably be Pakenham ( 90 km ) or Dandenong 100 km..

that is a shame, as the patrol actually loves it ( so far )

Cheers Again
Bucky
AnswerID: 390533

Follow Up By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 07:06

Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 07:06
Bucky,
Do some research on adding 2 stroke oil to your diesel tank...... It will make your 4.2 less rattly; I love the stuff in the Chev.

Cheers mate

Roachie
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FollowupID: 658344

Follow Up By: Member - Bucky - Wednesday, Nov 11, 2009 at 04:50

Wednesday, Nov 11, 2009 at 04:50
Roachie
All's good !

Run her out and now back on the good stuff.
I cannot justify driving 115 km or there abouts, just to get synthetic fuel.
but if I was driving by the servo, .... well that's a different story

So it's back to paying a little more for the local fuel..

Cheers Mate
Bucky Image Could Not Be Found
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FollowupID: 658650

Reply By: blackmax11 - Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 21:53

Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 21:53
Couple of things to be aware of re Bio Diesel,
1) Its hydroscopic, that is it will absorb water and can promote micobial growth in the tank.This can go through to filter and cause components to go through to engine injectors.
2) Its very solvent, so will clean out all the junk in your fuel system and take it through the system to filter and after. So change fuel filter at least half normal change time. Need to do this at least 3 times before going back to normal filter change timeframe.
3) Also check with your vehicle supplier to ensure your model is suitable to run on Bio. Not all diesels are.
Other than above, good luck if you do have problems with getting help from the fuel supplier.
AnswerID: 390535

Follow Up By: fisho64 - Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 01:52

Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 01:52
microbial growth occurs at the interface of mineral diesel and water. Because BD is hydroscopic, Im not so sure that it will "promote growth"?
Also, at B20 I doubt it is hydroscopic.
Many fuel additives promote getting rid of water from your fuel, and that is by absorbing it into the fuel and burning it.

just a thought?
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FollowupID: 658343

Follow Up By: blackmax11 - Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 08:58

Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 08:58
Fisho64,
Sorry to have to say but all Bio Diesel is hydroscopic, it just depends on the % of Bio as to the extent.
I have had testing in our lab and confirmation by the fuel Companies about this.
One of the greatest problems is this occuring in the fuel suppliers tanks whilst sitting there. Reason to only buy fuel from volume supply servo's.
This is a huge problem for Marina's where diesel sits generally for quite some time and in a water/humid area.
Regards
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FollowupID: 658352

Follow Up By: fisho64 - Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 21:23

Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 21:23
understand what your saying, but i doubt that B20 will absorb very much if any due to the low concentration.
Not sure of what part of the country your in but Im pretty sure there are no marinas in WA that sell BIO or bio blends-certainly none that I have worked out of and thats most ports in WA.
BP and SHELL have it cornered.
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FollowupID: 658438

Reply By: jeep cherokee - Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 12:25

Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 12:25
I wouldnt touch Bio Diesel with a barge pole.I used it my 1998 XJ Jeep Cherokee 2.5 TD. for just over a year.Then the problem started.The seals on the fuel injector pump staretd to leak diesel.The car went into a diesel injector specialist and it cost me $2945.00.The bio diesel chewed up the internals of the rotary pump and it had to be rebuilt.The No 1.fuel injector which has the sensors attached to it was damaged and had to be replaced at a cost of $988.00
I contacted the RAA and they wrote back to me explaining that unless i could get a scientific report that could support the damage report i was wasting my time trying to make a claim against a large petrolium company.
Unless i could get a written statement from the company relating to any repairs due to their bio diesel i would never touch it again.
It did run slightly better and the economy was marginally better too, but the damage far outweighed the benifits. I hope you have better luck than me in doing the right thing by the enviroment.
AnswerID: 390587

Follow Up By: fisho64 - Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 21:26

Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 21:26
out of curiousity;
who said it was the biodiesel that did it?
If the injection specialist-why wouldnt he put it in writing, or was he just speculating?
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FollowupID: 658440

Follow Up By: jeep cherokee - Tuesday, Nov 10, 2009 at 10:57

Tuesday, Nov 10, 2009 at 10:57
He did put it on the report and that report was sent to the RAA along with my complaint.That is when the RAA said it would become a long drawn out process taking it to the courts and it would end up costing more due to the fact i would then have to get the scientific proof to back up the technicians report.When you look at the size of the oil company i would have been fighting i soon realised i could hurt them more in the long run by word of mouth, which i have done ever since.
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FollowupID: 658519

Follow Up By: fisho64 - Tuesday, Nov 10, 2009 at 11:05

Tuesday, Nov 10, 2009 at 11:05
so which company was it?
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FollowupID: 658524

Follow Up By: jeep cherokee - Tuesday, Nov 10, 2009 at 11:45

Tuesday, Nov 10, 2009 at 11:45
SAAFF (South Australian Farmers Federation) and if i remember correctly they no longer have the depot from where i used to source the fuel.
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FollowupID: 658534

Reply By: blackmax11 - Tuesday, Nov 10, 2009 at 09:46

Tuesday, Nov 10, 2009 at 09:46
There is residule water in BIO so its there from the start, then add watever else is absorbed from air, which will depend on humidity and time.
As for Marina's, talking Eastern Stares, where we have warned the whole Marine Industry about BIO fuels, petrol and Diesel.
In NSW currently all Diesel is BIO, only 2% to 5% but until above 5% the oil Companies don't have to advise the B amount.
AnswerID: 390723

Reply By: Member - Flynnie (NSW) - Wednesday, Nov 11, 2009 at 23:11

Wednesday, Nov 11, 2009 at 23:11
Found some interesting reading at

http://www.environment.gov.au/atmosphere/fuelquality/publications/pubs/diesel-biodiesel-position-submission-43.pdf

when googling on biodiesel cold temperature

Where I live there is a problem with low winter temperature and diesel waxing occurring. We switch to a winter grade diesel for part of the year. Apart from the other "qualities" biodiesel is pretty bad on this point so likely the cold weather problem will get worse.

I hope we are spared from more mandated standards, though it sems a certain amount of bio is in the diesel mix already. Bad enough that we have to pay through the nose for extra maintenance to meet Euro IV standards that was foisted on us long before the fuel distribution system was up to scratch. Ask what happens when a common rail diesel engine gets contaminated (not up to standard) fuel.

It looks like the bio in the biodiesel blend cannot go beyond 5% and often a lot less depending on feedstock if it is to comply with standards. I reckon it would be better to have some industrial users switch to 100% biodiesel or a high blends and leave the motorists alone. Some incentives could be packaged to get someone on side and make some money out of it.

Cannot see much sense in having a tiny amount in everyone's fuel tanks. Reeks of tokenism to me. Worse the expense will be carried by motorists in higher maintenance costs.

I have no problem with using biodiesel as a fuel in Australia. The issue for me is blending it in all automotive diesel. There are situations where it just does not make sense.


AnswerID: 390943

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