Refilling disposable Coleman Gas Bottles

Thanks for the replys. How do you pre chill them do you put one in the Engel for 10 mins? When they are full do they just cut off or does gas squirt out the end of the Coleman Bottle?

woohoo, this is as good for an adrenaline rush as it gets!

GOOD question Orejap!

Being a bit of a LPG freak myself, I came across 'gravity filling' of LPG tanks before.

According to their instructions, you chill the small cylinder and then fill it from the larger cylinder upside down.

And when the small cylinder is full of (cool) liquid gas, you turn off the tap...

And what happens after a few minutes, when the liquid starts to expand inside the full bottle?

Right, the overpressure valve will vent - hopefully...

They even mention this overpressure relief valve thingy under 'caution in refilling cylinders'.

Thing is, when you buy any factory pre-filled bottle of LPG, there will be a void in it, full of gas which allows the liquid gas underneath it to expand/contract with temperature.

So if you really want to rely on the overpressure relief valve, because you can't measure the amount of refill you put in, you better make 200% sure this valve is not stuck in any way.

But how do you test its functioning before you fill your bottle?

You can't.

If you pull up the manufacturer's web site you'll notice - they don't directly sell this suicide device anymore....


Best regards, Peter

Peter,

Looks like we've got a few thrillseekers in our midst LOL

Regards

This re minds me of a story I once herd.

A sky diver jumps out of a plane, when it was time to open the parachute it failed, not panicking he goes to deploy the second chute, it fails as well.

As he falls to earth he meets someone coming towards him at great speed, as the other guy gets close he yells out.

DO YOU KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT PARACHUTING ???

The guy coming towards him yells out.

NO !! BUT HAVE YOU ANY IDEA HOW TO REFILL A DISPOSABLE COLEMAN GAS BOTTLE ???

That is funny,

Could be called Natural Selection =)

thrillseeker meets thrillseeker hehehe
But on closer examination I'd rather be the bloke with the gas bottles....

Mr.Bitchi's observation got me thinking, and yes, there is an explanation for this 50% or so max fill level.

The coupling device forms an orifice in which the liquid turns into gas while it gets pushed into the initially low pressure environment of the receiving cylinder.
Due to the high pressure gradient inside the orifice, the expanding gas will take up a lot of heat from its surroundings. The heat will flow from the outside air through the coupling device into the fast moving gas stream (the faster, the lower the pressure/temperature - and the colder the coupling device will become).
While the gas in the receiving cylinder starts being more and more compressed by the slowing inrush of gas, it'll heat up until the pressures/temperatures of the contents of the two cylinders are equal.
But because there was a net heat inflow into the receiving bottle, the flow will stop, before all the volume can be taken up by liquid, i.e. pressure equilibrium will be established before the receiving cylinder is full of liquid.

Should be allright eh?

Best regards, Peter

Gramps
Your right....wonder what they'll say when it goes bang...or bang then Kabooooom!!!

probably say something like....."why didnt someone tell me" or "why isnt this warning of a dangerous act written on the cylinder"

MN1,

As the old saying goes "some people can't be shown, can't be told". As long as the counter view to this practice is aired, people here can make up their own minds about the risks involved and the "substantial" savings to be made. It only needs to go wrong once .........

As for the idea that because devices are available to facilitate such practices, selling cigarettes is still legal.

Regards

OREJAPs family have a few people to sue should he heed the advice on this forum if it all goes pears shaped.

I can't believe people are happy enough to potentially kill or maim themselves or their families, just to save a few bucks.

Good luck with that

Googling produces a # of ExplorOz threads on this such as #48877.

Cheers.

John,

When I google I get this page Mac Couplersearch page

With 9 hits on the front page including an eBay link.. have a look

Thks Tony.

I was only intending to direct members to prev. threds. I saw the e-bay links as well. But will prob. pick one up in the States later this year if I come to the conclusion it's a safe operation.

Cheers.

No probs, :)

http://www.colemanaustralia.com.au/gear/cooking-and-heating/hot-water-on-demand/5ft-hose-(1-52m)-with-pol-fitting(2).aspx

•Not Suitable for top mounted appliances (1 burner stoves, lanterns, catalytic heaters)

Andrew

Andrew,

Thanks, thought there was one. Depends on OREJAP's application then.

Regards

I have a Mac Coupler and use it often.

I have four coleman cylinders and fill them before going on a trip.
I have never noticed liquid being expelled from the cylinder during the filling process.

You chill them down for about 20 mins or so, connect them to a larger gas cylinder with the coupler, turn everything upside down and open the larger cylinder valve. I use a 4.5 kg cylinder as the source.

The instructions say to allow 60 seconds then turn the valve off to stop the flow.

Are they completely full???
Don't know and don't care, but a refilled cylinder and a new one weigh about the same so I assume so.

As for any safety issue, I don't believe there is any. I do the refilling outside in the open air so there is no issue of any escaping gas building up.

Oh, obviously one doesn't smoke during the process, or have naked flames in the general vicinity.

Bought mine from RV Irving Outpost in the US. Cost bugger all and was delivered within a few days.


Bill.

in my humble opion dont if you dont dont value the good things in life keep going with these stupid ideas
regards morry

Not a stupid idea Morry.

They are as safe or safer, than many full size gas cylinders people use.

Common sense prevails with the condition of the "disposable" cylinders the same as the normal ones.

Maybe I'm just a "risk taker""-)))


Bill.

Landy , hundreds of items in general use are labeled single use only or do not refill , every beer bottle /stubby has that warning yet that does not stop home brewing , in hospitals, items that are labeled single use only by the manufacturer are regularily cleaned and reused [ bronchiotubes come to mind] , the dangers of refilling a Coleman cylinder are laughable , no different than refilling a vehicle gas tank at the sevice station , the only gas that escapes is that tiny whiff on uncoupling.

Who says they are not designed to be re-filled? Why is the device made to refill them if they are not to be refilled? You can weigh them to see how filled they are if that matters.

Peter
Id say it has DO NOT REFILL written on the cylinder else it wouldnt be a disposable type...???...those words would make it illegal to refill.

Just because a device is made to refill them doesnt make it legal to refill.

Thanks everyone for your ideas much appreciated. To those who think I am stupid to even contemplate such a manouvre, look at yourself when you refill your vehicle with LPG,petrol or diesel. I still after all these years believe it is permitted to drive into a service station (anyone can regardless of their state of mind) & happily refill their vehicles without any supervision from the controlling body. The mind boggles as to what dangers exist in that enviroment!!!

Well said Orejap.

Although you are filling something that is designed to be refilled. I was more interested to learn from this thread whether the 'disposal' Coleman cannisters are actually engineered to a lower standard given they are intended for single use only?

Member 1 , hope none of your mates are into home brewing then , as every stubby and beer bottle has that warning , ,, Landy ,the only reason that the coleman cylinders are labeled as such is to sell more cylinders , would sooner trust the Coleman cylinder than the last 9 kg bottle ibought which was made in China ,had all the Aust approval no.s ect , valve has leaked from day 1 ,

Alloy
it is a health hygine reason if they do...nothing to do with an explosion

No 1 , in stubbies the warning is only partially for hygine , add to much sugar in to the stubbie at bottling [secondary fermentation] and you have your explosion in the making.

The law on beer bottles is for hygine reasons only...you check it out Alloy

if you think its also related to a possible explosion then we are right eh?....you/we/one should not refill disposable gas cylinders...eh? "you have your explosion in the making" .....you did say that didnt you?