Why use HF Networks ??

Good response there Robin!


Cheers

Brian

And regarding costs - after the initial purchase, the HF radios are slow to depreciate. Bought my set for $2950, and it would be worth about $1800 now. Costs me $200 a year for VKS and Bushphone (+calls).

Ditto Fred.

I used to think a Ham radio would be a cheap and good alternative to a mobile Radio but it is really only useful for voice communications CB style.

A Ham radio will only do 2 of the 10 items Fred listed legally ( half of item 6 plus item 7). Possibly one or two others illegally or with extra stuff added.

Like Fred, I have a Sat phone as a back up and to receive incoming( SMS ) messages, HF's weakest point IMO.

Without beaconing, selcall , RFDS, messaging etc you would be very limited with a HAM radio, especially for contact with anything other than chatting.

Hi Fred

Have you found the text messages to be practical or worth implementing - not sure about this aspect yet !

Hi Robin,
I often use the txt option when wanting to send a private message or just letting family know I am safe and well, rather than an open radio call; OR if voice comms is not that great, but I still need to get a message through, I use txt. It works well.
regards

The HFoZ GPS position feature is great!

The VKE 237 HF Radio Club also has a system where you can send your GPS position to a base station so they know where you are in case of an emergency.

Bookbook

I think you should have another look at what an unrestricted (full) licensed ham operator is permitted to do. I have full access to amateur owned satellites and have actually made contacts using a hand held with an external yagi antenna to both local and international stations. Internet portals are all over the place. Hams may also use a lot of computer/data based modes and facilities ranging form simple text (sms like) comms to more advanced full video conferencing linkups. Just imagine that you cut yourself up badly. You set up the camera and show the RFDS doctor the problem. Heaps better that trying to explain it verbally.

Phone patching is nothing new and is simple and widely available. In the 80's I used to link up the Antarctic bases with Australian relatives and friends before they got the sat link. I believe you can widely access the internet also. Mobile or home based operation is only restricted by available power and also space where the equipment is installed.

Nah Sorry HF does not hold a candle to what a full licensed amateur radio operator is permitted to do. Basis operator I think you are close but not a full unrestricted licensed one.

I have two radios in the car. A UHF CB and a UHF/VHF ham radio. That gives me both local (both radios) and world wide comms (VHF/UHF through the satellites).

Phil

Yep Vk1dp agree

I said
"A Ham radio will only do 2 of the 10 items Fred listed legally ( half of item 6 plus item 7). Possibly one or two others illegally or with extra stuff added. "

BUT you do need to pull it together ( not easy) and have extra stuff, not in the box.

If you can do it good luck to you.

Not hard to carry the extra stuff these days. Most of it is miniaturised these days. Look at my satellite stuff. The hand held sits in my top pocket and the yagi folds up and goes in the car door pocket. Even a small video controller and the Yeasu tribander are nearly as small as the average UHF CB. All my extra kit goes in small pockets in the car. Years ago when I linked up to the Antarctic I will agree it was bulky. Not now.

Anyway, each to his own and then you need to get the unrestricted licence. Thats not the easiest if you are not in the electronics game at work.

Our eldest son has the HF system. He is not the best when it comes to electronics.

Cheers

Phil

Well I guess that depends on what you do for a living, or why you are out there....everyone to their own...........surely?

Cheers

Egg Sakery

Hiya Rod
Which HF network do you use ??

I am a member of the HF Radio Club. Suits my purpose.

Thanks for your reply...
I am currently a member of VKS737- however last week I received an invitation (and application form) to join the HF Radio Club (VKE)...
What is the setup with VKE- how does it operate- how do you use it etc etc..
Cheers

The web site with details is here HF Radio Club
From looking at VKS 737 website and listening to their skeds the 2 clubs are much of a muchness. The HF Radio Club seems to have a lot of Caravan and Motorhome owners.

I'd second Brian's remarks. Our old Codan came as an ex-hire one from Footloose - as you Brian, sadly missed.

There have been many thoughtful responses to this post. There are a couple of reasons for for favouring network hf that we consider very important and haven't had a lot of mention.

When things go wrong in a remote area, there may well be help close by. It will not be available via sat phone or general (ham) hf, but there is a fair chance that it can be reached through a network.

The network involves more than the technology - it is the people that will help - the technology simply lets us communicate with them. Those manning the VKS737 base stations are a thoroughly professional (unpaid!) mob who do a great job. The readiness of others on the network to jump in and help with communications and other support is also a strong factor favouring this network, and no doubt others too.

John

well it is extremely biased and uninformed what ham radio actually is today
have fun
gmd

I would suggest that Footy was one of the most unbiased people I have ever come to know.
The man wrote that in response to the certain bias of people who frequented this forum at that time and like you continually seemed to think that ham was the end to all the issues.
Footy was a very experienced radio person with 40 odd years of experience and a ham operator also, if he thought there was a difference then I would believe him.

I would also doubt that much has changed in the ham area in the last two years since that thread was written but I stand to be corrected and if you care to inform us as to "What ham radio is today" then I'm interested to hear your thoughts.

I am not here to educate you. Do some research yourself. Some maybe inspired to do so. If you want it presented on a silver platter than sorry, I am not going to do that.
Here are a few buzzwords
APRS
D-Star
PSK31
Airmail
Pactor II and III and other non commercial packet solutions
AX.25
RMS
Winlink
AMPRNet
are a few buzzwords ... just do a google search and read
I have a Yaesu 817 now amongst others and that thing
lives in my backpack where ever I go in the world, because
I can use my license for 90 days without additional permissions
pretty much everywhere in the world.
have fun
gmd

All of which have been pretty much available for more than the last couple of years so you have offered nothing new and Footy's comments stand.

since you are not capable of understanding the consequences of such systems to the scenario by footlose I give you a hint how that emergency would be handled by me:

I call my home RMS (I have to run one since there is none in WA at the moment) or I call 2 of the ones over east and send an email with my position given by the radio as a precaution in case no repeater picked up on my last APRS signal. Done.

A few minutes later I probably receive a call from a mate on one of my emergency bands (which are auto scanned) and/or I poll the email answer from the nearest RMS. understood ?? no ??

This scenario is as valid as the example from Footloose ...

Have you ever travelled with your Codan or Barret outside Australia ?

I am not saying ham is the bees knees ... just saying that Land mobile is too limited for me. thats all ...

have fun
gmd

So gmd as you already know everything your original post was just a troll then?

Sorry ?? .. I still do not know why one would use a commercial network ?
that was the original question and so far I have not been convinced ...
Is there a ham who is gone to the commercial networks for traveling ? and why ?
I know a couple who went the other way and I know why.
You are using VKS737 as your sig says ... so why do you use it ?
no license ?
functionality ?
community ?
speed of response ?
I try to understand, so far I have not really seen convincing arguments other than
convenience of not needing to care much about anything technical and paying a price for that with limited features and at a price. Is that it ?

have fun
gmd

GMD???
The question you ask was answered in my link to the thread by Footloose but you chose like so many before you to either not read what is said or to just remain ignorant.

The issue of contacting a VKS Base or your mate on the amateur net (Provided he is home) is clear to see.

As for the hundred bucks, in your view being a high price....Big deal its not even a tank of diesel these days and the VKS Network provides me with so much more than just an emergency contact.

As we say to each his own and if your happy with your little plastic radio and chatting to your mates then good luck to you.

Hi GMD,
To answer your questions:

"You are using VKS737 as your sig says ... so why do you use it ?"

"no license ?" Partly, I can use 100W and a foundation only gives me 10W. Also I have no interest in getting involved in the ham networks at the moment. I have a mate who is very keen and keeps encouraging me to get my foundation but that is the difference between us. I see HF as a tool and he uses it a hobby. It is like my 4WD. I don’t go out and find difficult tracks to drive down for the sake of four wheel driving. I have a 4WD to get us to all the interesting places we want to visit and experience.

“functionality ?” Not really, I have an older Codan with a Jenal microphone so I can get Selcall and Telephone Interconnect. Simplicity – yes.

“community ?” Definitely. While camped at Cullyamurra Waterhole last year we listened to VKS737 helping out someone stuck on the Walkers Crossing Track and they had all the contacts they needed at their fingertips. In the end the chap was helped out by another VKS mobile user who was 50km down the road. This would be difficult to arrange through a Ham network and there are a lot of VKS mobile users out and about during the travel season. The VKS operator also has access to all bases and frequencies and in some cases a choice of different aerial arrays to work a difficult contact. On another occasion I met up with a guy whose landcriuser had locked him out (in a somewhat bizarre set of circumstances). VKS set up a telephone interconnect with a Toyota mechanic who walked him through how to break into the vehicle.

“speed of response ?” Again Yes. I can selcall a VKS base 24/7 and get a response and assistance from a team who will know where to go to for help. I can also press the big red button and wake up a RFDS base for emergency assistance.

The last two points were the significant ones for me in my choice. We looked at the whole remote area comms and safety thing last year before we went on a trip to the corner country. I am very familiar with the vagaries of HF having been a military communications officer and spent many years at sea at the end of a HF link. We had the choice down to:
HF (HAM or Network)
SATPHONE
SPOT
EPIRB

SPOT while useful is very limited and we discounted that. EPIRB has one use only – emergency response in a life threatening situation and we will probably get one at some stage.

For assistance in an emergency I could see little difference between Ham Radio and Satphone other than cost. In both cases I would be reliant on knowing who to call myself and then them knowing who best to help me and being able to get them to respond. I also lose the possibility of someone camped on the other side of the sand hill either hearing the interaction or being called by the base operators to give me a hand.

In the end we decided on land mobile HF and I got my whole setup (Codan 8525 radio, Codan autotune aerial and Jenal Microphone) and installed it for less than $800. It is a simple system that works. While you have listed a whole heap of services available to ham operators they all come at a cost in both dollars and the time to learn how to best use them.

We are happy with our choice – proven equipment and a network that works for us every time we call up at the price of 6 tanks of fuel and one tank a year.

Cheers

Pete

"But one good thing about the whole discussion is hearing people talk about old Footy!...What a champion he was...and if new we were still talking about him ( and debating) I reckon he would be laughing his fun bags off!!! LOL"


Well said Hairy! I reckon he would have a BIG laugh over it, at the same time I think he'd be just a tad embarrassed by the attention. He was a humble man who certainly knew his stuff!

Cheers

Brian