Key start downhill

Submitted: Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 17:34
ThreadID: 79067 Views:3064 Replies:2 FollowUps:14
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Hi Folks

Just wondering if you can do a key start down hill, either forward or reverse in a new Prado. I believe you have to depress the clutch to start them. This would make the Key start very interesting i think.

Dave.
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Reply By: V64Runner - Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 18:12

Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 18:12
In the good old days, long before alternators replaced the tried and trusty generator, it was possible to turn on the ignition, let the car roll down the hill engage 2nd or 3rd gear , release the clutch pedal, and bingo she would start. However "touch wood" I havent found myslef in that situation with any of our family cars, mainly because the wife likes an Auto, and mine is a manual. I have a battery charger in the event of flat battery, so havent tried to start the vehicle on a downhill slope in reverse or going forward.
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Follow Up By: jendav - Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 18:17

Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 18:17
The Key start downhill forward or reverse is the only real safe way to start a 4WD on a steep hill. it involves starting the vehicle in gear which negates the need to match clutch out and revs against engine torque and speed/revs. with the new Prado i believe this is impossible, without some un warranted modification
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Follow Up By: landseka - Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 18:49

Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 18:49
I'm not sure what you mean by "good old days", my current model Triton manual will jump start just fine, as will 99% of today's manual vehicles.

The odd ones like V64 has quoted are the exception to the rule.
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Follow Up By: landseka - Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 18:50

Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 18:50
Oops, like jendav quoted that should read.

Have another glass of red Neil, lol.
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Follow Up By: Fab72 - Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 19:00

Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 19:00
Clutch pedal switch needs to be bypassed/bridged. However, this will also upset your cruise control operation.

Suggest a length of wire and a you beaut toggle switch. I have actually done this mod on a mate's Prado for the reasons stated by jendav.

Really easy and totally reversible. Just be careful when in cruise control mode not to have the toggle switch off, because touching the clutch pedal WILL NOT disengage the cruise control, and make your engine revs increase.

Can scribble up a basic wiring diagram for you if you care to email me on fabandsonja@hotmail.com
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Follow Up By: jendav - Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 19:17

Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 19:17
Thanks Fab72

Its interesting that Toyota would put such a mechanism in place considering they are one of the top 4WD manufacturers in the world. I wonder if the sales people at Toyota dealers are up to date with this unfortunate feature and explain it fully to buyers who intend to use the vehicle in steep off road environments. Are there people out there who have bought this vehicle, not really being aware of this problem
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Follow Up By: Member - Shane D (QLD) - Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 19:24

Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 19:24
What do the drivers of auto's do?

Shane
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Follow Up By: jendav - Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 19:30

Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 19:30
Hi Shane
Drivers of Autos do this
1. ease of accelerator
2. apply foot brake
3. select Nuetral
4. apply handbrake
5. ease of footbrake and ensure handbrake holds..... if it doesnt dont do the next step... if it does ....do the next step
6. select park.

Always stop your auto this way on a hill... To start off again... do it as normal start.

Dave.
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Follow Up By: Fab72 - Saturday, Jun 05, 2010 at 09:04

Saturday, Jun 05, 2010 at 09:04
Jendav,
My mate quizzed the city slicker salesman about this feature and was told that key hill starts were not required anymore because of the you beaut traction control system which incorporated active hill decent/accent.

Unfortunatley, the sales guy "sold" the feature so well, my mate acually believed what he was being told. And with no sandy or muddy hills around to test it, he had to take the "experts" word on it.

Never having a car with this feature before, he was none of the wiser. Anyway, long story cut short, first time he was in a situation where he needed a key hill start, he activated the hill decent/accent feature and in his words "It's expletive rubbish".

Now, no doubt hill decent/accent has its place, but it is no substitute for the ole key start.

Moral of the story....buyer beware.
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Follow Up By: jendav - Saturday, Jun 05, 2010 at 09:23

Saturday, Jun 05, 2010 at 09:23
Thanks Fab72.

I wonder how many others have been caught by this same incorrect info.
Its a shame the Sales people do not fully understand the features that 4WDs have.

DAve
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Follow Up By: Member - Shane D (QLD) - Sunday, Jun 06, 2010 at 15:31

Sunday, Jun 06, 2010 at 15:31
Jendav,
Thanks for the detailed explanation on how to STOP on a hill, but its NOT what I was asking.
Without checking any real figures, I would guess that now more auto's are being sold than manuals, especially in the wagon arena.
While I agree that having to start with your foot on the clutch is a PITA for any occasion, But, I wouldn't refuse to buy Prado just because you couldn't do a key hill start, when most (MAYBE) are Automatics which you cannot key hill start anyway.

Shane
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Follow Up By: jendav - Sunday, Jun 06, 2010 at 17:57

Sunday, Jun 06, 2010 at 17:57
Thanks ShaneD
My apologies for mis interpreting your question.

I think you are pretty close to the mark with more autos being sold than manuals. In our 4WD training program we have had to change our training techniques to cater for the ammount of Autos now coming through. In the scrub the auto is becoming more popular and in a lot of situations is a better vehicle to have.
I agree with you i wouldnt refuse to buy a Prado just because i couldnt perform a Key Start. What i would hope is that the Sales guy would know enough about the product to explain this to prospective buyers, so they are fully aware of this feature.
Its much better to know you cant do it, rather than wait until you need it and cant do it.
DAve.
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Reply By: Grungle229 - Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 21:31

Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 21:31
Only way is to try it...

Regards
David
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Follow Up By: Dasher Des - Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 22:32

Friday, Jun 04, 2010 at 22:32
And practice and practice and practice till u have it off pat
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Follow Up By: jendav - Saturday, Jun 05, 2010 at 09:26

Saturday, Jun 05, 2010 at 09:26
Thanks Dasher Dan.

The problem here is that with the new Prado you cant practice the Key start Uphill/
Downhill because the vehicle will not allow you to do it.

On steep grades you need to be able to do this, so that you can start ther vehicle safely. The new Prado apparently fails in this area
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Follow Up By: Patrol22 - Sunday, Jun 06, 2010 at 13:11

Sunday, Jun 06, 2010 at 13:11
or........................just don't stall the donk :-)
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