perfect off road caravan

Hi Lynne,
After so much research, I can't believe we found the perfect van ! I love that front boot space...so clever. Lucky you...you are way ahead of us, hope to see you sometime in the future ! Happy bushcamping.

Yes the tunnel boot is great - we already know how much you can stow in one of those and still have extra internal space in the van. But what about the Boy's Toybox on the front! That's what won John's heart straight up! I keep muttering about weight but we will see how we go. I guess we may have to do some culling but 500kg should be enough! He does want to hang on to his beloved Pathy if he can. Cheers Lynne

Don't forget that out of your 460kg carrying capacity you need to deduct 120kg for the water in the tank, about another 50kg for water in the HWS and gas in the bottles.

That will leave about 300kg or a little less for your own stuff.

It won't take long to get there, believe me.

It's an education to load up and take the van over a weighbridge. Measure evrything there. The van's weight, hitch weight and vehicle weight.

You'll be surprised.

The toy box is an absolute winner for the boys !!!

Thanks "Gone Bush" that is always valuable information and certainly not to be taken lightly

Just playing the devil's advocate here, not criticising....

There's only one solar panel and one battery. One battery will not last very long when bush camping. So you'll need to think about a second battery or a generator. The genny will take up half of your toybox and 30kg of your dwindling payload.

You will need to carry some fuel for it, also in the toybox. You will need to run the genny dry or empty it of fuel each time you use it because they give off fumes. You don't want fumes filling up the toybox so think about a scupper vent on the side.

true that - could be a good idea to fit an extra panel and battery...

mh

The old phrase "gazetted road" was clarified to us as being a road on any map! The van, as we understand it, is not guaranteed for extended travel across totally unmarked terrain, mountains etc. Roy of Sunland has an excellent reputation for quality and for backing his products. We have no worries about being caught out by "weasel words" and cute escape clauses!
Also the van can easily carry more weight than 2500kgs if your tug is capable of towing a higher weight. The ATM of 2500 allows for a payload of 500kgs over a tare of 2000kgs, meaning that you can safely tow it with a vehicle rated at that weight. Some Patriots will weigh more if people option them up with more water tanks, solar panels etc but their tow vehicle specs will be checked first! Lynne

Lynne,

if the ATM of your van is 2500kg, then that's the upper limit.

No variation in the towing ability of the tow vehicle will, legally, permit you to load your van higher than 2500kg.

If some Patriots can have a higher ATM, then they must have something different to yours, most likely the suspension.

If they all have an ATM of 2500kg and some buyers are optioning up with more water tanks, batteries etc, then that additional weight must reduce their payload.

Unless you change some of the van's particulars that allow it to carry more, ie have a higher ATM, you can't overload it just because you change tow vehicles. You will risk breaking something and almost certainly will void your insurance.

Not criticising, just informing.

I spoke with a dealer at a recent show. These are aimed directly at the Prado/Pajero market that have 2500K tow limits. They look a great van. The only problem I saw was the microwave being above head height. Be very very careful taking boiling objects out that you don't spill any on yourself.

The Tare will appear on the Patriot compliance plate according to the actual weight of the van when it leaves the factory, including any extra options above standard, and the ATM will be given in line with the capacity of the tow vehicle - usually about 500kgs more than Tare, if the vehicle specs allow.
Also (we did ask) it is now legal to tow a van of a higher stated ATM than your vehicle allows - SO LONG AS YOU DO NOT ACTUALLY LOAD IT more than your vehicle allows ie in the event of a legal or insurance issue the actual loaded weight of the van is now what matters not what is on the plate!
The whole issue of weights is very confusing for us all and keeps the forums buzzing but we have done our best to check that all this is correct at this time. It does seem that for many vans the ATM is a fairly hypothetical figure not necessarily connected to the structure of the van and there is no substitute for an actual weighbridge certificate!
Our vehicle allows 3000kg so we should be well covered in all directions so long as I keep an eye on the boy's toy box! Lynne

Lynne, I'm sorry to say that you have been mis-informed, and please don't shoot the messenger (you haven't so far and I appreciate that).

The weights thing is quite easy to understand. Your Patriot has a TARE of 2040kg and an ATM of 2500kg (Sunland website figures). Now your vehicle must be capable of towing 2500kg, which it is. But if you traded up to a Landcruiser which has a towing capacity of 3500kg, you could not load your van up over the 2500kg maximum purely because you have a different vehicle

The calculation to arrive at an ATM does not factor in the tow vehicle at all and is solely based on the load carrying capacity of the suspension and chassis etc. The manufacturer may look at a vehicle and say: we want to make a van that this class of vehicle can tow, but the ATM is still based on the capacity of the load bearing components of the van.

The ATM is not a hypothetical figure and is most definitely connected to the structure of the van. A weighbridge figure is purely to make sure you have not exceeded that stamped ATM figure.

Of course the engineering maths must set an upper limit on a van's carrying capacity. In many vans, especially single axle blacktop tourers, it is quite a juggle to end up even with a low payload of 300kg and an acceptable ball weight.
However many of the heavier off road or dirt road vans have wider margins to play with.
As I understand it, so long as a manufacturer does not set the ATM ABOVE the engineering limits of his van he can set it where he likes, or where he sees a likely market. Few customers want to buy a truck or prime mover! So an enterprising manufacturer can offer a base model that can be towed by a Prado or similar vehicle and still have a reasonable payload.
So long as his design is right (a key point!), surely he can also offer an All Extras Model with higher weights suitable for a Cruiser or other popular heavier tugs. As this is clear on the compliance plate everyone should know what they can tow the van with and how much they can carry!
Seems like good business sense to me. Lynne