The Simpson - Which direction - W2E or E2W

I am not sure which way to go across the Simpson Desert. It will be in early May. I have been told that May is quite early and going east to west may be difficult because of the steeper eastern sides of the dunes. I am also getting contradicting advice that it would be better than west to east.

The plan at the moment is from Canberra up to Camerons. Then a loop west to Merty Merty and up to Innaminka and the Dig tree. From there to Birdsville and the Pie Shop.

For the Simpson itself; The plan is to do an east to west run along the QAA line down to Lone Gum, across the Rig road and up to the the French line to Purnie Bore.Home via Mt dare, Lake Eyre and that horrible stuff bitumen.

So what do you lot think about which direction?

Phil

PS Yes I did search and read other reports but I have not found anything specifically answering my query.

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Reply By: Voxson - Tuesday, Jan 04, 2011 at 23:35

Tuesday, Jan 04, 2011 at 23:35
W2E E2W.....It is harder to go west but i wouldnt let it stop me or change my mind.... It is just harder that's all........
But i would definately go WAA line...
WAA is the best line across...
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Follow Up By: vk1dx - Tuesday, Jan 04, 2011 at 23:52

Tuesday, Jan 04, 2011 at 23:52
Thanks for the response Voxson

When you say the best what do you mean? Easiest, quickest, more challenging or what?

Phil
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Follow Up By: Voxson - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 00:09

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 00:09
WAA is the road less travelled through there...
It is a little more remote for bumping into to others,,,softer sand,,, steeper entrys,,,, trickier exits.....
Just a lot nicer....
I have been across 8 times now,,, and the WAA wins hands down for me..
Each to their own though,,,, plenty may say different.,...
And yes,, more challenging...
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Follow Up By: Voxson - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 00:11

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 00:11
oh,, and you are only 35kms away from the french line at any given time..
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Follow Up By: vk1dx - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 00:16

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 00:16
Less cars the better. Saw a girl on a quad race up a dune and over the top straight into a head on with a dune buggy on TV tonight. Ouch!!!

It also makes sense to use the WAA line if we are down at Lone Gum.

Phil
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Follow Up By: Voxson - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 00:21

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 00:21
Spot on.
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Reply By: vk1dx - Tuesday, Jan 04, 2011 at 23:57

Tuesday, Jan 04, 2011 at 23:57
I should have added that we drive a 100 series 4.2TD and no trailer/camper. Will be fully self sufficient before the trip. Still need to get a bigger fuel tank (hate fuel on the roof), maxitraks, sand anchour and sat phone to complete the car for a desert trip.

Its also a single car drive.

Phil
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Follow Up By: Member - John and Val - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 07:22

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 07:22
Phil,

It's a good trip, but as said, harder from east to west than vv. I'd agree with Voxon's preference for the WAA line - less congested and more interesting than the French line.

It's not impossible as a single vehicle, but a companion vehicle could save a lot of shovelling! (A good shovel is probably more important than a sand anchor!) Tyre pressures are critical (as I know you know!) Maxtracks good, but a snatch strap and another vehicle much better. Better still not to get stuck, but these things happen, especially late in the day when fatigue is setting in, the sand has gone soft and the tyre pressures have risen due to heating, or when your approach to a dune doesn't go as planned. Important to have a sand flag and to scan UHF for oncoming traffic.

Cheers

John
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Follow Up By: vk1dx - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 08:05

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 08:05
John

As you well know at the meetings and down near Bredbo for the training it has all been drummed into us. We have all the gear apart from the things mentioned above.

You agreement with Voxson is well timed also.

Currently the eldest son is hoping to come but he is expanding his business and it may not be possible. As you may be aware I am not able to do much physical work. It seems the blood has contracted the big "C" and no room for oxygen. That's why the sand anchor. Otherwise I would just bury the spare etc.

Good advice and its a pity a lot of 4WDers do not take it.

Phil

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Follow Up By: Member - John and Val - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 09:29

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 09:29
Phil,

I was aware of your health issues and the constraints imposed on physical exertion. In these circumstances, a companion vehicle is really very desirable. Can save a lot of personal energy expenditure. Maxtracks are good (tie a few metres of blue rope to them so you can find them in the red sand!) but no substitute for letting a big diesel do the work. Winching probably won't be much help, as most difficulties occur as you almost get to the top of a dune, then run out of puff (or dig in) in the soft windblown cap. Simply reverse back down, try for a bit more momentum, maybe drop tyre pressures a little further, and sail over the top next time. On the dunes, on your own, very rarely would you want to (or could you) winch forward.

Hope to see you next week at the club meeting. Have you considered sharing the trip with a compatible club member? While you lose some of the solitude, that immense personal space that contributes so much to the desert experience, you would gain valuable muscle and horsepower. We've found that COMPATIBLE companions add to the experience, rather than detract from it

Cheers

John
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Follow Up By: vk1dx - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 09:35

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 09:35
Hi John

The winching option is mainly in case there is any rain and we get stuck in the "between dunes" areas.Well you never know!

I read you loud and clear my friend.

Phil
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Follow Up By: Bonz (Vic) - Sunday, Jan 09, 2011 at 08:22

Sunday, Jan 09, 2011 at 08:22
We had planned the same trip same time with the same precautions, anchor sat phone etc but chose fuel on the roof cause its really only from Birdsville out as far as 60l will take you, other than that you arent carrying extra weight you wont need, and long range tanks are quite exxy.

Our plan was Out to Poeppels, then French Line, Knolls Track, Rig Rd, Erabena Track (Lone Pine) south to Rig Rd, then left onto WAA line and back up onto French Line and out.

One day we'll do it. Maybe
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Reply By: Ozhumvee - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 07:11

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 07:11
Phil
After 30 years and over 20 plus crossings on just about every track (and some that aren't) through the Simpson you will be pretty early in the season, the desert will probably have had quite a deal of rain over the previous 6 months and you will likely be breaking the ground on some tracks if off the French line.
Our preference has always been for east to west for the reason that this direction usually has less traffic so the dunes while they are steeper are usually smoother. That being said in school holiday and peak times it makes bugger all difference.
Our suggested route for newbies is QAA, Poeppels, west on the French line to the Knolls track, then down to the WAA and west to the rig road. Follow the rig road west until it joins the French line and then on to Purni and Dalhousie.
This route will take you through the different parts of the desert and the POI's like the Lone Gum are not far away to divert to.
The biggest thing is to take your time, stop and look at things, camp early ans enjoy the solitude. We usually take anywhere from a minimum of 4-5 days to up to a fortnight to do a straight crossing. The longest trip across took over three weeks.
We've done it alone but be very careful that early as blows on dune crests can trap the unwary and righting a vehicle when on its side can be nigh on impossible without assistance. Our preference is at least two vehicles but I wouldn't let that put you off, you may be able to travel with or at least keep tabs on others either before or after you. Make sure you have a list of contact numbers for the satphone before leaving Birdsville or Dalhousie.
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Follow Up By: vk1dx - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 08:24

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 08:24
Excellent Peter.

Its the "sand blows on dune crests" that I am thinking about. Its an unknown quantity until you are there. Also each desert has its unique characteristics that can make them quite tricky. I appreciate the warning.

We wont be in a rush but because my wife works we only have four weeks for the round trip to Canberra. We will need 6 days for the Canberra to Cameron's and then home from Lake Eyre to Canberra. Quite within our capabilities with two drivers. That leaves us three weeks for the rest. Maybe when my wife stops work we will have more time to do another slower trip.

"Kodak moments" and just "look around" stops will definitely be on the agenda. Its a long way back. We are hoping the phone we get will accept the "home" mobile phone chip and all its data. Hmmm! We shall see.

I think a combination of your suggested route and that of Voxson's may be the go. Both of you okayed the E2W drive.

Excellent

Phil
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Reply By: Member - Stephen L (Clare SA) - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 08:14

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 08:14
Hi Phil

Like others that have travelled the Simpson from every possible way, our preferred way is always from the east to west. Sure the dunes are steeper, but with the correct set up, it is still a great trip even though a little more demanding.

Count speed out, slow as you go is the way to go. May you will still have days over 40 C, and yes I have travelled in early May before, so I know what I am talking about. Your best friend will be a set of MaxTrax. Tyre pressure will be critical because of the very soft sand from the very hot summer out in the desert. I would not play with pressures and put them straight at 14psi, remember you will only be going very slow. Even at that low pressure there will be some dunes that may require more than one attempt to get over and yes you will get bogged because of the powder fine sand.

Some of the tracks will be blown over, but with a good eye for desert terrain, you will make out where the track should be. If you lack a little confidence, then moving map will help you greatly and as a matter of safety, do not travel Solo seeing this is your first visit (We have travelled solo but know what to expect)

You have the swim at Dalhousie at the end which makes up for the hot days out in the desert.

Have a safe trip.


Cheers

Stephen

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Follow Up By: vk1dx - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 08:37

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 08:37
Thanks Stephen

From the previous respondents I think our biggest hurdle is the "new" soft sand near the top of the dunes. We are not novices to sand. But we are novices to the Simpson. We have a 7" VMS GPS unit in the dash and lots of paper maps and a compass for navigation. I did a lot of bush driving and map reading in the Army. Both here and OS. We will have enough "extra" provisions to "sit" with the car for a week plus. The GPS is quite accurate but it's only as good as the map that it displays. And of course it has the map coordinates should we need them. Maxtrax are already on the must buy list.

Excellent advice. Thanks

And another vote for the E2W direction.

Phil
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Follow Up By: Member - Stephen L (Clare SA) - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 09:11

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 09:11
Hi Phil

From what you have just said, you are no novice and the army training will be very beneficial. To be honest, the only reason that I use moving map is to let me know just how far I am away from our good camping spots. For anyone to get lost out there, well what can I say, they should not be out there.

Another very good friend is a long handled shovel. Even though you will get hot days, the nights and mornings will be cool and the campfires will be great.

Have a great trip, it will not be your last Simpson trip.


Cheers

Stephen
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Follow Up By: Voxson - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 13:58

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 13:58
Personally i would not go the WAA as a lone vehicle...
I only just realised for whatever reason you are alone out there...
Sorry mate,, i should read every word..
I say that because the last two times i have been,, both times we have had someone drive off a dune wrong and got stuck...
Both times i have thought *wow*,,, how would you get them out without removing the whole dune almost..
One lack of concentration on the WAA and boom,, you can be stuck...
Hard to judge the turn direction off the top sometimes...
Even with all the bury the tyre ways, etc etc etc,,,, i still shuddered to think about a lone recovery...
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Follow Up By: Cooper Creek King - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 14:16

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 14:16
I agree with Voxson.
We were on the WAA line a couple of years ago heading west and most of it was easy. However we came across a handful of dunes that some people had all kinds of trouble getting over. Heading east over the same dunes was far easier. The same dunes on the french line were heaps easier. That particular year we zigged zagged all over the place for a variety of reasons.
The King
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Follow Up By: vk1dx - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 14:37

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 14:37
Ahhh Is that a gotchya. Thanks. I will keep that in mind. We can always change at the last minute anyway.

Phil
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Follow Up By: Voxson - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 16:29

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 16:29
There are a few ways off the WAA line if you dont like it which head north back to the french line.......
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Follow Up By: vk1dx - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 16:31

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 16:31
Exactly.

Thanks
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Reply By: Flynnie - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 20:10

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 20:10
One advantage of travelling east to west is that the harder parts will be at the eastern end and you can get them over and done with early. Thinking here of Eyre Creek and Big Red and some of the other dunes which are harder.

I agree with those who suggest starting on the QAA and French line and dropping down to the Rig Road. The lone gum is worthwhile seeing.

Technically I don't think there is that much difference in east to west or west to east. I have done both.

Only done a short stretch of WAA line. Preferred the Rig Road.

If it rains while you are out there you would not want to be alone. If rain was to happen returning to or staying on the French line would be the go.

Flynnie
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Follow Up By: vk1dx - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 21:03

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 21:03
Thanks for the bit about the rain. Would that be because the French line would have harder packed track surface? I think so.

Cheers

Phil
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Follow Up By: Flynnie - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 21:44

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 21:44
Phil

I was thinking more of "safety in numbers" on the French line. Rain can make it very hard and people tend to form loose groups or at least stay in radio contact of other vehicles. This is easier on the French line because it gets the most traffic.

When it is wet the sand does pack down making the dunes easier to cross and the corrugations are less as well. This would apply to all the tracks. BUT the boggy sections are the stuff that nightmares are made of. The salt lakes too are treacherous when wet. Detouring them is best.

Flynnie
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Follow Up By: vk1dx - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 21:55

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 21:55
Understood

Not worried about sitting for a few days waiting for the mud to dry or even detouring around a bad patch. We have done our share of "stupid" things. Back when we were teenagers and got mud on the windscreen going in too fast. Dad nearly murdered me once when I came home from a weekend surf trip down Darras way and had "fun" on the dirt raods in his perfectly new Humber Supersnipe. I still hurt.

No need to try that any more.

Thanks

Phil
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Reply By: Member - Bruce T (SA) - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 21:29

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 21:29
Our experiences of the Simpson is that it depends on what the weather has been like there.

We have travelled it when the vegetation was waist high and the birds, chats in particular, were thick. We have also travelled it when the sand was so soft that by the time you reached the top of a dune the sand was blown away and that was just after one of our group had crossed it. No sign of any animals then.

We have also had bad conditions and a starving fox come into our camp for food; it was so hungry we did not scare it. No food though, but I must admit it feels pretty harsh not to help. The same thing happened years before with a starving dingo family.

The Simpson can be easy, a piece of cake if you like, or it can be extremely hard.

Our experiences with the Knolls Track is that it is pretty much a hard slog for quite a considerable distance.

We've seen it so green that you would wonder if it were a desert and we have seen it so dry that it was desolate.

Be prepared and enjoy it.

Di and Bruce

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Follow Up By: vk1dx - Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 22:11

Wednesday, Jan 05, 2011 at 22:11
Ahh You make it sound very appealing. But isn't that what appeals to us. Its not a perfect bush and you are always looking for what is around the next corner or over the next dune.

We don't get bored with desert and outback travel. I guess we learnt a lot about how to truly see Australia from the Leyland Brothers. Stop and look. Take your time. Hey a track - lets see what's down there. The last one sounds a bit adventurous bit with accurate GPS and good map reading skills and some of that old common sense and bush skills, then its okay.

We are hoping it will still be green, but we are not holding our breath on that one.

I chose May for the following reasons:
Wife's work,
No school holidays
Nicely after the wet season but not too dry
Starting to cool down (???)
Already have trips in Jan, Feb, March. And school and Easter break = stay home for us. Cant stand crowds.

From what I have read so far it looks like E2W is still the go for us and as for the route: We shall see when we get to Birdsville and ask the locals. But Lone Gum is a must.

Thanks Di and Bruce

Phil
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