4wd Systems Diff "Lokka"

Submitted: Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 17:51
ThreadID: 8748 Views:9385 Replies:9 FollowUps:12
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Hi Guys,

I'm sure that diff lokkers have been talked to death before.... but I am after feedback on a particular type.
The 4wd systems mechanical diff "lokka" it goes by a few names I think... it is around $550 plus install. Does anyone have one?
I am looking to fit to a 2002 3.0td Hilux dual cab, should I do front, back, or both?

Thanks Rowler
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Reply By: Mickl - Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 18:52

Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 18:52
Have you checked out the 4wd Systems web page? From memory they have a fair bit of info on "Lokka's"

www.4wdsystems.com.au
AnswerID: 38422

Follow Up By: Rowler - Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 19:37

Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 19:37
Thanks Mickl,
I have read all the 4wd systems info on their web page...... but it is their web page & it's always like talking to a salesman. I am hoping for some user feedback.

Thanks Rowler
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FollowupID: 27911

Reply By: Mark from Getaway Portable Refrigerator Hire - Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 18:58

Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 18:58
Rowler, there is heaps on this subject in past threads.....good,bad and otherwise.

Regards
AnswerID: 38424

Follow Up By: Rowler - Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 19:40

Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 19:40
Thanks Mark,
I am looking for the 4wd systems brand & have not seen anything on th threads.

Thanks Rowler
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FollowupID: 27912

Follow Up By: Rowler - Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 20:08

Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 20:08
Sorry Mark...... Found the stuff on diff lokka's
Bloody blind, after reading it still confused though

Thanks Rowler
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FollowupID: 27916

Follow Up By: Mark from Getaway Portable Refrigerator Hire - Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 20:22

Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 20:22
Rowler, What exactly are you wishing the diff lockkers for?
As far as I can see the choice is control the lock yourself- Air lockker(this is my preference)
Or Automatic lockkers such as Detroit or Lockrite. I went to a diff specialist the other day and he was saying that he had pulled out a heap of Air Lockkers from Defenders for the Army and installed Detroits prior to them going to Iraq. It was just that the SAS guys didn't like the manual operation which given that the someone may be shooting at you and your pushing buttons rather than a trigger, is understandable. He showed me how the Lockrite had worn down the teeth on the diff but I assume that this was a rear diff and may have had many k's under the belt.
You will be confused and if you really want to get confused, post a thread about fridges or tyres.
It is each to their own and there is no perfect answer... Sorry
Regards

Mark
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FollowupID: 27917

Reply By: - Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 20:13

Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 20:13
rowler, i had lokkas on my 75 series, the type you are asking about, i would not hesitate to fit them to the front again, but i would not put them in the rear, i sheared the axle studs off an a trip to the high country, i did a lot of work with them but did not like them in the back end. They do make your steering a little heavier. regards
jeff
AnswerID: 38435

Follow Up By: Member - Eric- Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 21:48

Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 21:48
you sure you broke your wheel studs due to the locker ? first time I have ever heard that . Did you set it up by the book ? not been smart here , just cuirious . I was trying to figure out why you would fit one in the front and not the back ? it you think it broke your wheel studs due to the locker in the rear , I would hate to think what it would do to your CV's

I prefrence is air locker front , to disengadge when I like for steering , and lokker for the rear, I find it releases fit , even less torque than a LSD in a Patrol. I find that if torque ic comming from a wheel . It disengadges real quick , if the torque is comming drom the tail shaft its rock solid .

The reason I like this set up is due to the fact that mine is a costant 4x4 so manuel lokker for the front in out of the question , and our LSD are non existent after 10,000 kms from new

Cheers , Venus Bay
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FollowupID: 27926

Follow Up By: diamond(bendigo) - Wednesday, Nov 26, 2003 at 18:06

Wednesday, Nov 26, 2003 at 18:06
gday eric.
whats your thoughts on a lokka in the front of my gq.
thanksback by popular demand
:-)
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FollowupID: 28564

Reply By: Mark - Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 20:46

Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 20:46
Hi Rowler,

I had the auto lokka (identical to 4WD systems lokka) in the front of my 80 series diesel cruiser (part time 4WD). I had it in for ~ 7 years and 150,000kms (some very hard) and I swear by it. I have just purchased a GU patrol and will install a locker at some stage (but cannot use auto lokka due to auto hubs).

There have been a few horror stories about auto lockers, but apart from a slight increase in steering wheel effort (ONLY when in 4WD), you would not know it was there, except your at the top of a knarly hill while those without lockers are still trying :)

The two main advantages of the front auto lokka (not including price) are
(1) that you can still steer if there is traction for both wheels (typically rocky hill climbs), unlike an air locka (tends to go straight ahead) and
(2) they are always on when in 4WD, do not have to worry about when to turn on/off.

While the air locker is an excellent locker, I prefer the front auto lokka (but it can only be fitted to front of vehicles with part time 4WD). Note that I would NOT install an auto loka in the back (thats where the air loka goes!!!).

There is a huge amount of debate on whether to fit to front or rear first, but IMHO the front fitment is the best place to start with as; virtually all 4X4s have a rear LSD, a front auto loka is cheaper and i reckon that you get a better traction advantage from a front fitment over a rear (watch the debate over that statement!!!).

Cheers

Mark
AnswerID: 38437

Follow Up By: Member - Wayne- Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 21:05

Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 21:05
Why cant you use the auto locker with auto hubs? I though the hubs would only engage once the front axle was driven via the front drive shaft.

I had a GQ with the 4WD systems locker and it made a huge difference. Now have a GU and should have swapped it across but it made selling the GQ easier and I reckon I almost got my money back on it.

Wayne
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Follow Up By: Mark - Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 22:21

Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 22:21
Wayne,
I have been to told (but obviously have not experienced) that a front lokka with auto hubs can "trick" the hubs into locking. This effectively is like driving in 2WD but leaving your hubs locked in.

This in itself is not a problem, but at the end of the day I, like most others, unfortunately spend more time on the blacktop and do not want to be driving with effectively locked hubs while in 2WD.

If others have any experience of an auto lokka with auto front hubs, I would like to know if you have experienced this "false locking" of hubs.

Cheers

Mark
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FollowupID: 27931

Follow Up By: Ferret - Wednesday, Nov 26, 2003 at 02:22

Wednesday, Nov 26, 2003 at 02:22
Simply change the hubs to manual ones. I.ve got a 4WD systems Lokka in the front of 95 GQ. Bought it second hand from a mate who runs a 6.5litre turbo diesel through it. Its been treated like complete crap as the guy thrashes the bleep out of his car, always breaking axles, CV's and hubs but there wasn't a mark on the lokka. He scored a whole front diff after breaking both axles and 1 CV in a single outing and it came with an air locker. I changed the hubs because they can stick some times and this may have given me trouble with things trying to lock/unlock.
Scott
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FollowupID: 27960

Reply By: Truckster (Vic) - Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 22:35

Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 22:35
Save your money and go with tried and well and truly trusted AIR LOCKERS...

90% of people in competitions cant be wrong.. They are STRONG, and well worthit.
AnswerID: 38457

Follow Up By: Mark - Wednesday, Nov 26, 2003 at 12:51

Wednesday, Nov 26, 2003 at 12:51
"save your money"... Truckster I think you need to check the prices of an air locker. By the time the air compressor is fitted, you are looking at $1500 - $1800 for a single diff. Compare that to ~$800 fitted for a lokka.

By your comments, it seems you have the air locker, not the auto locker and thus no first hand experience with auto lokas. I agree the air locker is a good locker, but so is the auto locka. I have mates that have broken air lockers and detroit lockers. Nothing is indestructable when abused.

There are many, many reports of satisifed auto loka owners and I am one of them. I had one in the front of my 80 series and that vehicle did some really hard miles (3" lift, 33" tyres, extractors etc...) in a variety of conditions. It has lasted 7 years and 150,000kms and is still going well (vehicle has over 300,000kms)

Most stories I hear of front locked diffs breaking are front CV joints. This will happen REGARDLESS of the type of locker (air, auto, Macnammarra etc...). And then one can usually trace that to huge amounts of torque, wheels in the air, lots of speed and then landing with the power on.

When comparing the internals of a locker, the auto locker's weak point is that it uses the original diffs centre. A detroit locker and an air locker replace the centre and are stronger than original equipment. So,
an auto locka can only be as strong as the original diff centre.

As for competition, that places an extreme stress on the diff and i would agree with the use of an air/detroit due to their stronger centres. However, you will find that virtually the whole drivetrain has to be strengthened as well (bigger CV's etc...) This is completely different than typical "hard" 4WDriving in a club situation.

Not all "new technology" or designs that challenge the existing crop of equipment is bad. I have read your threads on the 3.0 TD GU Patrol and can see that unless you can fix it with a hammer, duct tape and a large shifting spanner, then its too complicated, unreliable and not as good as a 1950's design with all the technology of that era.

Cheers

Mark
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FollowupID: 28006

Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Wednesday, Nov 26, 2003 at 16:02

Wednesday, Nov 26, 2003 at 16:02
Mark..

I have no lockers, I dont need them, havent yet in 2 years of high country, toolangi, walhalla, Wombat, etc etc...

If you want a Lokka get one.. on the several forums IM on, including a few with all the top comp blokes in the country, I would save my $$ and go with an Air locker.

The other advantage with Air locker you get a compressor to inflat your tires with... Thats $300-400 saving there...

It costs more for an Air Locker for a reason. Quality.
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FollowupID: 28538

Reply By: Coops (Pilbara) - Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 22:57

Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 22:57
I have them in my 80 series and can't fault them given the inexpensive initial outlay.
I would definitely fit them to the front before the back ( I got my back ones for an additional $200 which is the only reason I purchased).

Reasons I like 'em other than any already mentioned:
simple to operate and I don't need to bother the wife with all the intricacies of diff lock operation, she can just engage 4WD and not know why we can climb that hill when others struggle.
relative ease of steering
excellent for descents

I've posted countless responses on Locka from 4WD systems so you should be able to find plenty more.
A Locka to the front of your Hilux will be one of the best investments you make initially even if you do change laterAllyn
Some days we are the flies; some days we are the windscreen.
AnswerID: 38467

Reply By: Member - Toonfish - Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 23:56

Tuesday, Nov 25, 2003 at 23:56
hope your not in a hurry to get one as a few people have been waitng over six weeks delivery even though they say to you in under a week????
their cards were debited 2 days after ordering???

was in a 4by mag recently too.

i have never dealt with them , just what i hear/1999 NISSAN NAVARA DUALCAB
DIESEL 3.2 & SPRINGY CARLTON TOY
2 awestruck kids (dads driving!)
AnswerID: 38480

Follow Up By: Eric from Eric Christopher wholesale - Wednesday, Nov 26, 2003 at 07:14

Wednesday, Nov 26, 2003 at 07:14
had that problem once , were a wheel carried took a long time to arrive. I rang and complained , and problem was fixed , I usually receive things within 4days now , nice bunch of people to deal with to . Now remeber we are dealing with Adelaide here lol

gone fishing ,,,,,,,,, any bites Eric Christopher wholesale
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FollowupID: 27961

Reply By: Member - Karl - Wednesday, Nov 26, 2003 at 09:43

Wednesday, Nov 26, 2003 at 09:43
Rowler,

I have a second hand one fitted to the rear diff of my 80 series and I could be happier. Have it professionally installed and there should be no problem. I got one because I could not afford the more expensive air lockers.Everyone is entitled to have an opinion - just make sure that yours is correct.
AnswerID: 38512

Reply By: Dennis (Brisbane) - Wednesday, Nov 26, 2003 at 20:27

Wednesday, Nov 26, 2003 at 20:27
Mark said...............

"I went to a diff specialist the other day and he was saying that he had pulled out a heap of Air Lockkers from Defenders for the Army and installed Detroits prior to them going to Iraq"

What a load of c*r*a*p.

The CENTRE diff lock (CONSTANT 4x4 or 6x6 depending on vehicle) on the Army Land Rovers is a pneumatic (vacuum) operated system with an on/off pull/push knob on the dash.

If the vehicle will run (and therefore produce vacuum), the lock will operate, barring shredded and shot up vacuum lines of course).
AnswerID: 38589

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