CSR 2 Wheel Drive

Was chatting to a tradie (about 48ish) the other day while he completed a job. Got talking about our camping/exploring activities. He had just completed 6 weeks away
and had travelled the GCR, Connie Sue,Tanimi and the Canning Stock Route. On the CSR he carried 600 litres of fuel, and all the normal camping and recovery gear needed for such a trip...plus a few slabs. He was in a convoy of 3 vehicles, a Hilux (which he had to tow a couple of times) and a Triton. He was driving a 2WD F250 long wheelbase!! He reckons he had a few close calls...but NEVER got stuck or needed a tow. The worst he experienced was having to have 3 goes at a couple of dunes. He said most travellers he met never realised he was 2WD....however one night around a campfire some others were relating the damage received from the horrendous corrugations...so he said he struck a patch so bad it shock his front diff off....they didn't believe him they went and had a look...!!!
So who needs a 4WD and all the trick gear for the CSR!
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Reply By: garrycol - Saturday, Sep 24, 2011 at 21:54

Saturday, Sep 24, 2011 at 21:54
My brother had a F100 with rear diff lock and it would go most places with a little thought and low tyre pressures. I expect that the current Falcon ute which has the extra clearance and rear diff lock would also do most of the outback tracks - again with a little thought and low tyre pressures.

Remember it was on 50 to 60 years ago that most outback travel was done in 2wds rather than 4wds.

Garry
AnswerID: 465950

Reply By: Alan S (WA) - Saturday, Sep 24, 2011 at 22:02

Saturday, Sep 24, 2011 at 22:02
I passed them, and wondered WHY?

The 250 rear end was so low. I know those things chew fuel, but why do you need 600lts.

They weren't on channel 40 and only came upon them about 100 yards from when the lead car appeared over a dune in front of us. We politely informed them of radio courtesy and off they went and promptly changed back to the channel they were on.

Just because you can doesn't mean you should.

It is people like that that stuff it up for the rest of us.

Alan

AnswerID: 465951

Follow Up By: Witi Repartee - Saturday, Sep 24, 2011 at 22:16

Saturday, Sep 24, 2011 at 22:16
It made me wonder why...it seemed to have the potential to go horribly wrong.
He says he carried way to much fuel...had a around 150 litres spare!
I forgot to mention he reckons his saving grace was the LSD in the F250.
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Follow Up By: Shaker - Saturday, Sep 24, 2011 at 22:32

Saturday, Sep 24, 2011 at 22:32
Wouldn't they have been on channel 10?

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Follow Up By: garrycol - Saturday, Sep 24, 2011 at 22:45

Saturday, Sep 24, 2011 at 22:45
I would need about 800 litres to do the CSR with an adequate reserve but then I have a 1.5tonne load capacity so can carry it in 4 44gal drums in the back.

Garry
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Follow Up By: Member - Phil B (WA) - Saturday, Sep 24, 2011 at 23:18

Saturday, Sep 24, 2011 at 23:18
I agree Alan

Just because you can doesn't mean you should. It is people like that that stuff it up for the rest of us.

cheers

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Reply By: Dennis Ellery - Saturday, Sep 24, 2011 at 22:18

Saturday, Sep 24, 2011 at 22:18
The first car to make to the tip of Cape York, up the telegraph track, was a 2WD baby Austin 7
AnswerID: 465953

Reply By: Crackles - Saturday, Sep 24, 2011 at 23:09

Saturday, Sep 24, 2011 at 23:09
On our last run up the Canning an Oka fully loaded with 10 people on board was still making progress despite blowing a front diff which goes to show when the sand is firm all you really need is ground clearance.
Cheers Craig...............
AnswerID: 465958

Reply By: CSeaJay - Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 09:40

Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 09:40
Well Well
Fool or hero
Does he not realise the track damage he does !?

Really makes me sad in an angry way
CJ
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Follow Up By: Fab72 - Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 16:23

Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 16:23
I was thinking the same thing.
Typical "I'm alright, bugger anyone else" attitude.
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Reply By: eighty matey - Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 11:17

Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 11:17
Thanks for the yarn Witi Repartee.

I feel it's a pity those that need to judge and criticise feel the way they do.

Maybe we should get some cameras out there so we can ping those that don't go by the unwritten rules.

So the bloke had a 2wd vehicle. So he carried too much fuel. So he had a go and probably had the time of his life. Good on him.

I feel sorry for the experts that feel the need to have a go at anyone that doesn't do it the way they do.

A mate of mine was part of a group that recently did the CSR on Postie bikes for a charity run. Should we ban that type of carrying on? It was a real adventure and that's what a lot of us Aussies are about, finding an excuse to stretch ourselves.

It's a huge country and I can't figure out what the whinging is about. Tracks get chopped by vehicles and the weather changes them every year. We keep going there and have a great time. Restrictions and closures happen when self interested do gooders feel they have to protect areas that are perfectly capable of adapting to change, or close off runs to protect people from themselves.

I hope the F250 has another big run next year.

Hoo roo,

eighty matey.
AnswerID: 465988

Follow Up By: garrycol - Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 13:03

Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 13:03
I agree 100% - you have written what I was thinking - there are too many Nannas around who think their way is the only way.

Garry
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Follow Up By: Off-track - Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 13:49

Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 13:49
x3. This place is full of people who think they know better. Most of them are also the biggest whingers too because people dont do it their way.

Lost track of how many posts each month about how somebody did this wrong, or drove too fast for conditions, or were too loud, too inexperienced, too little common sense, towed a trailer, didnt air down, or whatever, the list goes on...
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Follow Up By: Member - Phil B (WA) - Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 14:27

Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 14:27
Come on Eighty Matery, Garry and Off Track; you may not realise that access to the CSR is a contentious issue.
A few years ago a visitor told a ranger in as many words to stick it up your a*** when told his wife could not access a men’s business in the Calvert Range, also at that time some clowns damaged some ab art there as well. The result no access for anyone to Calvert range.
Carnarvon range near the CSR last year was put off limits, too many visitors, too much pressure on the environment and damage to art.
By doing things such as two wheeling the CSR, then there are others that have hard tyres causing track damage, swim in waterholes, stuff up well timbers etc and not following requirements of permits; it won’t be long before no one gets a permit to do the CSR.
Don't think it won’t happen; I believe the native title owners are only looking for an excuse.
The nanny comments as you call them aren’t being put forward because people think their way is the only way - they are being put forward so we can protect the right of 4Wdrivers to keep using the CSR.
I we don’t do the right thing and look after it we’ll lose it – rest assured.
cheers
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Follow Up By: garrycol - Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 15:02

Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 15:02
We are talking about 2wd use and about the wowsers who complain about everything - not happy unless they are having a whinge.

We are not talking about yobbos who vandalise everything and are certainly a risk to access in many places. You imply anyone who is in 2wd will abuse "mens business', damage art, will have tyre pressures too high - these are not relevant as this sort of damage will mostly be caused by someone driving a 4wd not a 2wd.

I certainly stand by my comments about too many Nannas around. When out and about if someone makes a suggestion on how to do things better and they are amiable I will certainly listen (never too old to learn something) but if they have the condescending attitude displayed by some on this thread, then I just nod and say thanks and move on - others would not be so accommodating and the bird and a F O might be the response. Nannas are condescending - people wanting offer genuine help are not.

Garry


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Follow Up By: disco driver - Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 15:13

Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 15:13
Phil,
Who said that the F truck crew did any of those horrible things you mention. Just because it was not a 4wd doesn't mean they tore up the track, swum in waterholes, cut well timbers or anything else that you seem to think they may have.

The Canning stock route is safe, it's only the detours to already limited access areas that cause problems for the native title holders.

Your comment "they are being put forward so we can protect the right of 4wdrivers to keep using the CSR. If we don't do the right thing and look after it we'll lose it -rest assured" assumes that the 2wdrivers did something wrong.

As far as I'm aware it is only a recommendation that 4wd vehicles be used, not a requirement.

And to top it off..............He may be a better driver than you

Disco.
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Follow Up By: Member - Phil B (WA) - Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 16:27

Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 16:27
Disco and Garry
If you read my post again you'll see I'm talking about access to the CSR and the loss of it.

Where did I say the F truck did this horrible things? I said
"By doing things such as two wheeling the CSR, then there are others ..."

Comments such as
He may be a better driver than me, too many nannas, condescending attitudes, don't get us anywhere in this discussion. Native title holders whether we like it or not have absolute discretion.

If we want to change the situation don't have a go at the native title holders or those of us that query actions and activities that might jeopardise access in the future.

Tackle your local politician, he/she and mates allowed legislation to go thru resulting in native title the way it is.
Until things change if they ever do I advocate tread lightly.


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Follow Up By: dazren - Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 16:44

Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 16:44
I am with your thoughts 8Tmatey, Some of those tracks are torn up pretty bad, Was this done by the Few 2WD drives that try these tracks ??? Or was it done by some of the 100's of 4WD that do it every year, Not All 4 wd drive people our safe and courtious drivers, there is a large ''yobbo'' cowboy type out there as well !!, and a misused 4WD can really create some damage, Not to mention that this is all our land, and you need a licence to drive it by law, not a 4 WD,
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Follow Up By: eighty matey - Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 22:52

Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 22:52
I hear what Phil B is saying and he's absolutely right. The actions of the minority determine the freedoms of the majority of responsible citizens in many areas of life now.

Traditional landowners may very well deny access to parts of the CSR in the future. That doesn't mean it's right, but I'm sure we'll find somewhere else to go.

I think there is a generational difference in attitude that defines the opinions on the forum. That's not a bad thing and it's the way it is.

I notice a lot of people that have time to tour at a leisurely pace seem to have a difference of opinions with some of the people that are still working to the clock, so to speak.

I reckon that's the good thing about forums when they get the different groups airing their ideas. I don't think anyone is "wrong", we are just coming from different directions. I wouldn't be interested in a forum where every post said, "yes, you're right", "oh I agree with you too". I might as well watch tele.

Hoo roo,
eighty matey.
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Reply By: Hairy (WA) - Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 11:37

Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 11:37
Gday,
A mate of mine crossed the dessert on foot with a couple of camels, but that doesnt mean its the best way to travel.
Another mate drove his 2WD Hilux into Ruby George, but ask him if he would have prefered 4wd...LOL

Ive made quite a few cartons over the years with the "my 2wd will go anywhere your 4wd will"argument....under the same conditions, they just dont......but its usually a pretty easy carton.

Cheers
AnswerID: 465989

Follow Up By: Alloy c/t - Monday, Sep 26, 2011 at 09:18

Monday, Sep 26, 2011 at 09:18
Makes me laugh when I go into town and see all the terrorist [ oops tourist ] vehiclesand am asked by a fair few about the road or that if their vehicle is suitable for this track or that , thousands of $$$ spent on modifications that they think they need and then you point out " have a look what the locals drive with NO problems or modifications bar a bull bar " ,
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Reply By: Peter_n_Margaret - Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 13:25

Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 13:25
Margaret & I have travelled the bush together for 45 years plus.
Only the last 15 years or so have we had the luxury of 4WD.
Should we have stayed home for the first 30 years?

Cheers
Peter
OKA196 Motorhome.
AnswerID: 465998

Follow Up By: Alloy c/t - Monday, Sep 26, 2011 at 09:01

Monday, Sep 26, 2011 at 09:01
According to some on here , yes you were a despicable vandal traveling in a 2 wheel drive and should have had your mug shot taken and be arrested . lol.
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Reply By: Member - Jim - Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 18:20

Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 18:20
This thread has already hit rock bottom.

Having actually travelled the CSR back in 1997 I am glad I did it then!

This was generally before the larger tyres and endless amounts of $'s become available that has generally seen the destruction of tracks that could have been overcome by a standard 4x4.

With regard to the F250 2WD, I am sure it could have done most of the CSR easily but would have stuffed a good deal of the hills for other folk not endowed with heaps of horsepower and the suspension required to get through the wheel ruts left in it's wake.

During the day it is generally hot and the sand not conductive to dune travel but that is when it is done, perhaps the F250 travelled during the night!

Many years ago the ranger at the National Park on Fraser Island used to ensure you were in 4WD prior to you being able to tackle the track.

The kind of use being advised in this thread will ensure that the CSR will be closed (or otherwise regulated) at some stage in the future.

Common sense, and some concern for future travellers is required.

Regards,
Jim
AnswerID: 466024

Reply By: mikehzz - Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 20:20

Sunday, Sep 25, 2011 at 20:20
Once enough 4wd's with 35" muddies or similar gouge their way up any track it pretty well stuffs it for anything standard, forby or not, no matter where the track is. In a lot of Central Australia the traditional owners do the tracks in Falcons and Commodores. I can see why they would want to stop the rut (ha ha), they just want to be able to drive on their roads. Just my opinion, Mike
AnswerID: 466037

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